dorbie

Hook line & sinker. I can see the funny side, but remember people who watch these get to vote. I have come to the tragic conclusion that many people who see videos like this (perhaps even most) believe them to some extent.

jakee, please don't dodge Kallend's questions in your next post.

Does it make you feel superior to accuse another skydiver of racism because you don't agree with his politics? It's pretty low, and so is the gutless way you make the accusation without a scintilla of evidence.

You're wrong, and your patronizing accusations of racism are getting old. If you cared about justice you'd care about justice for all, but the only thing you see is color; blue vs. red THEN black vs. white.

We know the jury was tainted in this case, we have one of the jurors (incidentally a left wing journalist) saying on video that he and others were asking "Where's Bush & Cheney?" during deliberations. We "know" nothing except what the media has told us. There is a process for appealing a conviction. Stop trying to short circuit it just because Libby is your darling. I personally saw video of the juror's comments, you're wrong, I know what he said. Of course the media had another angle they were looking to rope the executive into the whole mess, but they revealed too much about Libby being railroaded. There are also some very iffy restrictions imposed by the judge as 'punishment' for Libby not taking the stand. I know enough to know this absolutely stinks. You seem to like the stench though.

He's talking shite, he goes over the same bad science and straw man arguments of the conspiracy nuts, presenting "scientific opinion" that he's not qualified to offer. Anyone who spouts the fire cannot melt steel argument and anyone who believes it proves conspiracy is an idiot ignoring ample evidence available to anyone who cares to accept it. Tell me why as an Architecture student 20 years ago I was trained like every other architect on the planet to clad steel frame structures with intumescent fire protection and was also trained that it would only protect the steel for a very limited time before inevitable collapse if the fire was not put down, the purpose of the protection being to allow time for evacuation not prevent collapse. Now after this I've got to listen to every gobshite misfit with an internet connection parlay whatever semblence of credibility they pretend to have into a pitch for 9-11 conspiracy including their fuckwitted version of "scientific analysis". Tell us why being an British intel dropout with an axe to grind qualifies someone as a structural engneer making "scientific claims"? Tell us why all steel frame buildings have fire protection on steel structures or take your gobshite somewhere else. Tell us why after this has already been pointed out to you in other threads are you still presenting the same hackneyed conspiracy shit? One of the key signs of pseudoscience and conspiracy nuttery is that in the face of evidence the argument is not withdrawn, amended or corrected. The facts and simle explanaton is simply ignored. There is no reasoning with this crap because reason falls on deaf ears and the same discredited arguments and straw men are presented over and over again by people not in the slightest interested in any outcome other that their conspiracy theory being confirmed/reinforced. It is a fucking pathetic thing to witness.

Never happened, wouldn't happen but it's an easy and cheap claim to make. If you want to post any old shit without foundation then you can say anything, like "Evolution theory is wrong" or "Atheists want to burn Christians at the stake", but if you want to base your comments on any kind of a factual foundation then you simply can't turn that statement around and be left with a leg to stand on.

The undercurrent of your series of responses on this and other justice threads reveals too much about your own patronizing prejudices you struggle with in relation to other posters. I almost pity you.

Are Atheists free thinkers? How about scientists? People who follow a millenia old dogma laid out in a patchwork of a book are free thinkers? I've never heard of an atheist burning a scientist at the stake, only the religious do that, what does that say about freedom of thought?

Here's an interesting war trophy taken from a dead 'insurgent NOT terrorist': http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=ff9_1182600970

Nifong's comeuppance restores some of my faith in the system, and it keeps getting better: http://www.cnn.com/2007/LAW/06/22/duke.lacrosse/index.html It is more justice than I ever hoped to see in this case, the guy who knowingly and cynically tried to destroy three lives to boost his career actually receives a small fraction of what he tried to mete out, and now he may ultimately face time in jail. This is gratifying, not that I'm glad the guy is suffering, he's paid a heavy price, but he thought he was unassailable and decided to abuse his position of trust. What the guilty Nifong is facing now is a mere fraction of what he tried to inflict on the innocent.

We know the jury was tainted in this case, we have one of the jurors (incidentally a left wing journalist) saying on video that he and others were asking "Where's Bush & Cheney?" during deliberations.

I guess those death row inmates can wait after all.

Your best option might be to underexpose and shoot raw with low ISO & see what you can recover in the shadows. With a good DSLR you'll get acceptable results. You may not be able to close the aperture all the way down but that's for experimentation. You don't have to be in the air to do a little experiment. I remembered reading this a few years ago, and was able to find it again, see the section on dynamic range at the bottom of this page: http://www.luminous-landscape.com/reviews/cameras/1ds/1ds-field-4.shtml Do you really need additional HDR tricks when you're recovering this much detail in the shadows?

Just go to seaworld and see their prices for a holiday snap taken by a teenage high school student with a digital SLR. You're pretty close to that. As you say people are definitely happy to pay for this, I have, when it's busy they get in line for 30 minutes to check out the shots and pick the prints they want, and of course you can't just get the one print if you want to share with a relative. It does get pricey though which is the major unfortunate part, I limit any shots I buy for this reason. Volume discounts would make me happier and probably still earn them extra revenue.

They may rank higher, yet you find time to post in support of an obviously flawed conviction. . The jury found him GUILTY. I trust their judgment more than yours, since they sat through the trial and listened to all the evidence. Maybe the conviction will be overturned. Not your decision. Not my decision. Well I've heard a Jury member (a left wing journalist)ask "where was Bush & Cheney" w.r.t. the trial. Clearly there were issues with this jury. Again, shouldn't you be busy overturning Capital cases?

Just SOME of the flaws in the process as it pertains to Libby's case have been enumerated by Hitchens, others include the identity and comments of politically motivated jurors. Shouldn't you be busy freeing death row inmates?

I agree and this is one of the reasons this is a very serious issue that lends additional significance to a just outcome in Libby's case.

They may rank higher, yet you find time to post in support of an obviously flawed conviction. All injustice merits correction within our capacity to call for it. You're not merely spending your time elsewhere on weightier issues but practically advocating that an innocent man be kept in jail, AND spending valuable time doing it whilst pretending that it is your concern for other injustices and not your political bias that's the issue. Clearly this is not only inconsistent but one greater injustice does not justify a lesser one, although the individual consequences for Scooter Libby are something I seriously doubt you could bear with as much dignity as the victim in this case, despite your decision to belittle the destruction of this man.

Last time I checked, in the USA the JURY is the body that determines fact, not Hitchens. Complain to the JURY, not to us. Did you hear the comments from the left-wing journalist who was on the jury and returned to the leak issue which was not even what the trial was about. When a jury member says "Where was Bush and Cheney" you know something has gone horribly wrong with the trial of a guy being convicted over differing recollections of what he said in a chat with a journalist long after everyone knew the leak came from Armitage, and even after the leak has gone public. I reserve my sympathy for people truly railroaded by prosectors, with faked evidence and confessions obtained by torture. Then you have no genuine interest in justice.

Nobody deserves injustice, for that reason we should stand against it on principal regardless of the victim.

Last time I checked, in the USA the JURY is the body that determines fact, not Hitchens. Complain to the JURY, not to us. Did you hear the comments from the left-wing journalist who was on the jury and returned to the leak issue which was not even what the trial was about. When a jury member says "Where was Bush and Cheney" you know something has gone horribly wrong with the trial of a guy being convicted over differing recollections of what he said in a chat with a journalist long after everyone knew the leak came from Armitage, and even after the leak has gone public.

Did German POWs get a trial when captured? Your capacity to snow threads with off topic bilge and flawed analogies is limitless. Am I to take it that you do not care about this injustice because other injustices exist? Everyone should be concerned about the innocent being convicted under any circumstances, but that is a separate issue from the penalty in capital cases for example. Feel free to raise specific concerns about flawed convictions of all sorts, but don't pretend this is justification for other pet causes of yours. We both know you wouldn't wouldn't want capital punishment even in a case where guilt is 100% established. Are you going to comment on Scooter or just continue to hijack the thread with the same hackneyed posting of contrived analogies?

You can only hope that life does not teach you a lesson such that you appreciate more fully what has been inflicted upon Mr Libby. You're a moderator, if I'm attacking you as you claim then do something about it, but of course I'm not and your own inaction more than deals with your hollow claim. It is a shame that you would rather see an innocent man destroyed than address an obvious injustice. It says a lot about you.

You still choose to ignore the facts presented by Hitchens. It's a shame you want to see an innocent man destroyed rather than correct an injustice. It says a lot about you.