Kennedy

Per skymama. And to the nsfw thread in general: witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*

I remember when they said it would only cost $2 million. Five years ago it was pushing a billion, with a B, in expenditures and taking in only $140 million. Nice. And while they say it has made things safer, they refuse to actually track numbers where it has helped (if that number is bigger than zero). witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*

And that has what to do with the topic of this thread? (I'm still wondering if you think a golf club isn't deadly force, or if you think cops should never shoot someone threatening them with deadly force) Neither has Loughner. What's your point? Should I doubt he was the shooter just because a jury hasn't said so yet? witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*

Trial in Arivaca killings starts this week I hope she suffers horribly before being sent to Hell. And some folks think we don't need the death penalty. She doesn't even have insanity as an excuse. She's just freaking sick. I can't believe this is going to trial. Either defensemthinks they're going to get a racist SOB holdout juror, or the ADA just didn't want offer anything at all for plea. witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*

From the link: Reedink iz fundumentul. Since it went up yesterday, I kinda doubt this was the "Chinese missile sub" sighting. As anyone without a tinfoil hat has figured out, that was just an everyday jetliner. witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*

Yep. Pretty soon they'll be taking them up in pieces. So, do astronauts need security clearances, or is that coming soon to a launch pad near you? witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*

Yeah, for all you conspiracy whackjobs out there, this is what one actually looks like. Just in case those big commercial jets ever scare you again. http://www.thehindu.com/news/international/article1108036.ece witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*

You do realize that almost in every case, the prisoner is sent there for his conduct in prisons, not for the crime he was convicted of, right? That means that assaults on guards, murders, escape attempts, and things like that while incarcerated, lead to folks being shipped to a super max. Don't act like an animal, and they won't have to treat you like one. How many in super-max aren't there for multiple murders and attacks in prison? Or ordering hits on prisoners? Or running criminal networks? The answer is very very few. ps - how does protecting other inmates from these savages by locking them in solo cells constitute torture? Three hots and a cot, medical care, and protection of and from others. Where's the torture? witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*

You do know there's a big difference between ballistic protection and riot gear, right? So tell me, if I gave you a hand-me-down helmet and a Kevlar vest, and told you I was going to take a swing at you with a golf club, do you think you could reasonably assume that I might cause you serious injury or death? And you keep saying half asleep. If the guy was asleep, how the hell did he get the golf club and get to the corner in the few seconds from them hitting the door to getting five feet in? witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*

Nope, wasn't you. Sorry, mixed you up with the OP. My bad. Thinking about your posts though, I have to ask: when is the last time you found yourself on the pro law enforcement side of a disagreement? witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*

There are a number of possibilities. First, when organizing a raid, it's nice to include an officer carrying a taser. It's not a good idea to mix pistol and taser in each hand, but attaching a taser to the underside of a long gun is reasonable. The problem with long guns is that they can be very difficult to maneuver through small rooms and doorways. The alternative is having an officer only carry a taser, and that means he is limited in responding to deadly threats. Everything about a dynamic entry is a balancing act. Another good idea is to try to detain a suspect outside the search area prior to making entry. Try tried that here. They didn't get their guy. (it sickens me that their taking extra precautions that didn't work is somehow being played into them not caring) The other end is not using tactical units to make forced entry to serve these kinds of warrants. The trouble there is how often drug suspects are armed and willing to resist. A good friend of mine carries a big scar and nearly lost use of a hand because some tweaker (your addict, not a dealer) decided to stab and slash him rather than go to jail for paraphernalia. I'm not just talking guns. Drug addicts are particularly prone to grabbing whatever is at hand to attack people. You know, like maybe a golf club. What else? Well they could have tried getting a look at where he was and what he was doing, but that opens the peeker to risk. It's also very expensive to use tools that distance the peeker from the peekee. They could have dropped a diversionary device (flashbang), but I don't think that would have accomplished much here. The officer maybe could have waited a tenth if a second, but I'm not going to sit here and say he's wrong for not doing it. A tenth of a second is enough for a lot of bad things to happen. That's why units rely on speed, surprise, and overwhelming force. Staying ahead of them contributes to going home safe at the end of the day. It's not rationalization so much as preparing yourself for the fact that someday you may be called on to utilize deadly force to protect yourself or another person. Quality departments invest in training to do this, and take steps to assist their officers afterwards. Blair did come off worse than the officers, but I refuse to accept that it would've been better if the officers came out worse than Blair. Do I wish he could have come through without injuries and the officers all go home safe? Absolutely. But that's not always going to happen. When it doesn't, I'd rather the officers be the ones that go home safe. witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*

How do you go from seeing an imaginary gun to calling for termination of employment and criminal prosecution of an officer who has been cleared by investigators and the prosecutor in just two posts? witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*

Now why would anyone think you despised law enforcement? Oh yeah: Comments like that might have something to do with it. witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*

No, you missed the part where this was a search warrant, so it was for the residence. That fact that the investigation focused on one resdient more than another is irrelevant. If the guy had sat still and acted right, he would have held misdemeanor weed and paraphernalia charges at most. Instead he came out swinging a golf club. And unless you live with those people you know currently holding weed, you have very little chance of unpleasant police contact due to their weed. You also place far too much faith in the slanted piece of trash article. i was going to call it a rag, but this is the huffington post. It's a blog that mascarades as a newspaper. edit to add: Try these http://www.deseretnews.com/article/700066160/Roy-man-shot-and-killed-during-police-drug-raid.html http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/home/50304398-76/blair-drug-roy-police.html.csp# witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*

No, but we weren't talking about users in his example, we were talking about known dealers. However, as with dealers, users (such as in the case in this thread) put themselves in a position where their life is more likely to be taken than if they were sitting at home drinking water. I didn't say I value the life less, and I don't, but that doesn't mean I should be surprised when the predictable happens. And I'm going riding this weekend in an area that I've never visited before, so I'll let you know how the view is. witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*

And let's not forget that your "connected with gun shows" numbers include guns that were sold to a legal consumer and then stolen, or resold later to an individual who used it illegally. Can't really blame gun shows for that, can you? (unless you're Bloomberg or the ATF anyway) edit to add: 1. Bureau of Justice Statistics, "Firearms Use by Offenders," Nov. 2001. 2. Bureau of Justice Statistics, "Federal Firearms Offenders, 1992-1998," June 2000. 3. National Institute of Justice, "Homicide in Eight U.S. Cities," Dec. 1997. witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*

You can stop there. Anyone doing that is committing felonies, and if they draw the negative attention of other felons, that's their problem. The rest of you post is hypotheticals and not worth a hill of beans. The facts in this case are that law enforcement drew a warrant, knock-and-announced, and forced entry. While entering and shouting "POLICE! SEARCH WARRANT!" a man came at them with a deadly weapon. Officers responded as trained. End result: one tweaker pot head dead, one lawsuit coming. No surprises. What do you want them to do, sit down for tea and cakes? Think about it- how long does it take you to cross a tiny room and hit something with a club? And if you want to say he was half asleep, all I can say is he was up and moving quick before the officers got five feet into the residence. witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_Control_Act_of_1968 http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Charles_Whitman_police_report OK, so none of the guns he had with him were addressed by the law. There are stories that he may have abused amphetamines at one point, but I couldn't find anything clear. Other than that, nothing in the law addressed anything relevant to Whitman. Other than the mass shooting incident at UT, I didn't find anything alleging mental illness or incompetance. Whitman suffered from an aggressive brain tumor that many believeled to his severe headaches and him coming "unhinged." I have to tell you, if the 1968 GunControl Act was meant to specifically address Whitman type incidents, then the politicians weren't paying much attention. It doesn't address anything about him. * * disclaimer: I'm not saying the 1968 GCA is worthless or that I disagree with all of it. witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*

For it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "Chuck him out, the brute!" But it's "Saviour of 'is country," when the guns begin to shoot; An' it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' anything you please; But Tommy ain't a bloomin' fool - you bet that Tommy sees! witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*

Again, while I'm not saying the officer was actually right, some of the comments here concern me. Watching the video found here on YouTube it looks to me like the guy was coming around the corner, and he was actually moving towards the officers until he was shot, then he stumbles back into teh wall. witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*

FYI - a common definition of deadly weapon is Serious bodily harm (interchangable with great bodily harm) is defined as By virtue of the warrant, officers had a right (legal requirement, actually) to enter the house and conduct a search for the items listed in the warrant. A gold club, whether it be a putter a nine iron or a big bertha, can be a deadly weapon. When a person raises it over their shoulder and comes at an officer like that, it is a dealy weapon. Is it possible the officer could have safely concluded the incident wihtout shooting the resident? Yes, it's possible. But was it reasonable for an officer serving a search warrant to respond to a brandished deadly weapon with hisown deadly force? Yes, it is, and the prosecutor agreed. However, is the officer going to be raked over the coals in civil court? You betcha. I don't know how a judge or jury will find, but the most damning fact is that (according to reporters at least) the officer said the man was not moving towards him. If it's true that the officer said that, and if it's true that the man wasn't moving, then that is going to be a very difficult trial for the department. witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*

[shakes head] I don't know why I'm bothering. I guess I'm just that bored right now. Yeah, they tend to do that when officers are serving a warrant and someone inside threatens them with a deadly weapon. Take it up with the state legislature, the courts, and the local government. The police department doesn't just up and decide to start taking private property without all the other invovled parties. Try reading a periodical that reports the facts and allows readers to form their own conculsions. Unless you need Ms Huffington to do your thinking for you that is. So basically, you hate law enforcement. Congratualtions. Back here in the real world, that's not how things work. Did you even watch the video? They knocked and yelled "POLICE, SEARCH WARRANT! POLICE, SEARCH WARRANT!" before making entry. The guy came at law enforcement with a golf club held over his shoulder. I can't say I'm all that surprised. And anyone questioning why rural areas need cooperative units focused on drugs has obviously never lived ina rural area with a meth problem. witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*

You give LIP SERVICE to caring about individual freedoms and specifically gun rights, but analysis of the content of your posts over many years shows that you really don't care at all. You reject out of hand any and all suggestions that might prevent loonies from getting guns and killing people someday possibly lead to something bad happening to somebody. And yet you get full of piss and vinegar anytime someone calls you on that. [thinking cap] Now where did I put that definition of hypocrisy...[/cap] Provide a link to any post where YOU have made a specific suggestion that would help prevent loonies from acquiring guns about what firearms laws should and should not be. The best you could do was a copy and paste of time and day. You never did answer me about what thread your post was supposed to be in. You certainly didn't post a link. Demanding things of others that you won't do yourself, are we? witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*

Where did you get any of that? Specifically, in what "hood" are glocks "very popular & pervasive" guns? They are expensive and rare in the hood. The most common gun in the hood is a POS snubbie revolver and boat anchor pistols like lorcin, raven, and bryco. And what makes you say glocks need a good holster more than any other gun? What makes you say five pounds? You do realize glock sells parts that range from three and a half pounds up to twelve or fifteen pounds, right? Finally, glocks have three passive safeties, not one. They are the trigger lever you mentioned, the trigger disconnect, and the drop safety. witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*

So only non-negligent people should have guns? Fair enough. Or we could respect the rights and freedoms of citizens, and punish those who exhibit negligence related to firearms. You know, that whole prior-restraint thing doesnt sit too well with me. However, if someone has shown they are negligent when responsible for firearms, they need to be corrected. Here in NC, in addition to common civil torts and criminal charges for reckless endangerment, we have NC GS 14-315.1 the Safe Storage/Child Access law. So, since we have laws and courts and systems to punish folks who do things wrong, what else do you want? Short of asking for a government that prevents the possibility of anything bad happening/being done to you, what's missing? (in your opinion) witty subliminal message Guard your honor, let your reputation fall where it will, and outlast the bastards. 1*