FLYJACK

Can you guys read,,, I just said it isn't exclusive to military. We know Cooper had some parachute experience, the contrast is between a sport jumper and military.. Sport parachutists used "reserves and mains", military used "fronts and backs".. that is the difference.. Hahneman was military he used "fronts and backs"... I guess aliens used some other term....

I agree with you conclusion, he was not a sport jumper,, but your premise is still wrong, he was being specific. Fronts and backs is military jargon for front reserves and mains.. the fact that he didn't receive what he asked for was not his error.

Your premise is wrong,, His demand was specific..

Summary.. Cooper expected a main/front reserve set. Received emergency bailout rigs. Cooper either did not notice and jumped anyway, not demanding mains or he didn't notice they were bailout rigs. Reserves and bailout rigs are emergency chutes and require a licensed rigger and packing card. They are considered unpremeditated aka not expected to be used.. Mains can be packed by the owner and are premeditated,, expected to be used. Bailout rigs are more robust and reliable than mains, harder opening and unsteerable they are designed just to get you to the ground hard. So, a bailout rig gets you to the ground more reliably but with a higher chance of injury. If Cooper pulled he landed alive. My understanding is that a reserve or bailout rig requires a licensed rigger and card but since a main can be packed by the owner it does nor require a card. However, a main could be packed by a rigger and have a card.. So, having a packing card isn't proof that it is not a main. Interestingly,, DUDEMAN17 claimed Gryder's chute was a main,, Ryan debunked the Gryder chute by proving it was NOT and NB6,, He is right it is not,, However, I am convinced that Cooper did not use an NB6.. if the Gryder chute is a main then that actually proves it is not Cooper's chute,, proving it is not an NB6 does not. If Cooper jumped at 8:11 he could have drifted up to 6 miles in any direction from his perspective. That is a 113 sq miles potential landing zone.. This plus not knowing the path.. THERE IS NO WAY HE TARGETED AN LZ... looking down picking a "dark" spot and jumping in two minutes is irrelevant.. There are only two possibilities,, Cooper did not realize he was using a bailout rig.. (My guess) or, he knew it and didn't care... So, I am trying to get a sense from jumpers.. what would it take to knowingly make that jump with a bailout rig vs main/reserve.. it is just like jumping with a single reserve. Not a big deal or crazy? Would you do that jump in a bailout rig?

They did contact Skysports and ask for fronts and backs.. They obtained Hayden's before they could be gathered and told Emerich they only needed the fronts. But Cooper initially asked for two chutes,, that meant two sets including a back and front.. he clarified to say 2 of each for 4 total. He didn't change his demand he just clarified. It would not have been different because he effectively did ask for mains and a front reserve.. The same thing happened with Hahneman, he demanded 6 chutes and got six military sets of front and back or 12 total.. the sets were in bags. 1 parachute = front reserve and main. So, apparently one "parachute" refers to a set, front and back.. that means front reserve and main. Point is Cooper expected for a main and got a bailout rig.. Did he notice? Does that tell us anything? His experience? and if he noticed why wouldn't he just demand mains. Does it change how he would jump if he knew they were bailout rigs. and for the jumpers would you do his jump at night with a bailout rig vs main.

I still don't know he would know,,, mains don't need a card but does that mean they never have a card.

He asked in 1971 not 1940...He did not ask for 25 year old rigs.. The military was doing non static jumps in the 60's. Again,, Hahneman asked for "fronts and backs" as well, in 1972, he got military front reserves and mains,, not an "emergency parachute assembly"...

You are.. that is the point.. Cooper asked for fronts and backs in 1971 not 1940,,, the term is military for reserve and mains.. As for reserve,, the technical term is "emergency parachute assembly" it is not a main and is constructed like a reserve.. I got "reserve" here long ago,, I think Larry said that and others.. It is a reserve type.. but that isn't the point. Fact is in 1971 Cooper effectively asked for a front reserve and main,, he got an "emergency parachute assembly" which is not the same.

It isn't helpful because it proves you are wrong. Bailout rigs and mains are constructed differently... they were in 1971.

You have to stop accusing me of things until you know for sure... you assume too much. My research indicates that emergency bailout rigs are not mains, they are constructed differently and have a different purpose. I am not well versed enough to understand the technical differences.. but a bailout rig is an emergency reserve worn on the back.. Cooper did not ask for or expect a bailout rig.. Asking for fronts and backs is early military speak for reserves and mains. Riggers handbook explains the differences for "pilot emergency" rigs.. it is above my pay grade to understand those differences.. but it is clear they are NOT the same as mains. https://www.nanaimoflyingclub.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/01/Parachute-Rigger-Handbook.pdf

Why didn't Cooper talk? He probably did...

A pilot bailout rig is not a main... You are caught in semantics.. a reserve is an emergency chute.. A back bailout rig is an emergency reserve. Asking for a "front and back" is old school military jargon for main and reserve.. Cooper did not get a main.

Don't think so.. There are military bailout rigs aka back reserves like Cooper got. and military jump rigs backs (mains) with usually front reserves.. like Hahneman got. He did not get two reserves. Check with Mark on that..

Not sure what you are saying.. There are military aircrew bailout rigs.. aka back reserves. There are also military back chutes (mains) with front reserves. Hahneman ask for and got those. Cooper did not ask for bailout rigs but didn't seem to realize he got bailout rig's aka back reserves. I don't know if it is clear that a rig is a bailout rig from the card or the outside of it. Cooper complained about no D rings,,, that indicates he did not know it was a bailout rig.

You are conflating two different things.. He was confident that he could secure the money but did may not have noticed the rigs were bailout/reserves.. these are not opposites. I asked about being able to recognize the rigs and didn't really get a clear answer. I don't see anything on the card or exterior of those rigs that clearly identifies them as bailout rigs except maybe the missing D rings. If there is, nobody has 100% identified it yet. I was pursuing that... Cooper just tied the money to his body, it wasn't a "drag bag" per se.. Nobody legit says Cooper was a genius.. Cooper had some parachute experience but not close to Braden level. He adapted, was intelligent and determined. He did get lucky on a few things.. The crew did not notify the passengers, the crew did not run off the plane and he was not challenged by the FBI or the crew. He had it fairly easy.