S3 kicked my ass!

[nicknitro71 0]

Well I was able to make six jumps on my new S3; three/day. I could not physically do more. This thing is better than any workout I know of. I don't know if I'm doing something wrong but to get decent performance I got to rotate my arms, shoulders, and pull them forward as much as I can. Few times I had to pull at 5K because I was out of breath, and I'm in pretty good shape. On one jump I had to wait about 30 sec before I was able to pull the slider down after opening!

I got speeds in the lower 40s consistently and the best FF was a 110 sec out of 13K with deployment at 3800 with almost 3 mile coverage.

The turns are crispy and the suit does not oversteed at all. Actually turning seemed to be the easier part of the flight.

Is this thing gonna get any esier on your body?

How many jumps can you do it comfortably in a day?

Memento Audere Semper

903

[katiebear21 0]

You can check out Stacey's workout program here but I'm feeling your pain. I only have a Classic II but 3 jumps yesterday absolutely smoked me. I'm in good shape myself being an Army girl but flying works a completely different set of muscles. LouDiamond on the other hand got right back up and made more today so I'm sure with regularlity it will get easier. For the sake of my body let's hope so!

By the way, nice web page!

Katie
Get your PMS glass necklace here

[BirdWoman 0]

Thanks for refering him to my workout. Only if I could get a job with all that knowledge, I'd be in good shape. If you have questions on the workout stuff, let me know.

Stac

"I don't know where it is that I'm going, but wherever it is there I'll be!" --quoted by me

[rustik 0]

Watchin the soul flyers vid, Loic et al's suits appear to permit flying palms down, as this uses the muscles at the front of the arms / shoulders rather than the back and sides that the birdman suit does, do you think BM may make some mods in the future or am I doing it wrong? I have to admit, I enjoy the suit but feel sore after every jump. I have even tried rotating my arm in the suit prior to exit to get more of a palm down characteristic. Does the action of bending the arms with palms up (normal BM styleee) make much of a difference compared to a straight arm?

If it's safe it ain't fun

[The111 1]

I'll also admit that not only does flying palms down take less energy, it also feels cooler (I'm thinking of tracking here, the few BM jumps I've done have been "palms in"). But when you think about it, palms in seems to allow the most lateral range of wing control... when your palms are down your elbows are now unable to change the profile of the wing as effectively, so I think palms in might be the best for control, even if it does take more strength - we'll just have to get stronger. :)

The above is the opinion of a very inexperienced wingsuit pilot.

www.WingsuitPhotos.com

[jmfreefly 0]

I did only one flight this weekend on my S3, and it wore me out. Nothing like a go-around for traffic, thin air, a really long flight (132 seconds according to my neptune), and maxed-out, fatigued muscles to whip you. When I deployed, I was a bit dizzy for a few minutes.

But it was all worth it, flying from the dz to skirt a cloud, and flying back.

Nothing like brushing the edge of clouds to make me grin from ear to ear!

Back on the subject, I found that the muscles that gave out first where actually my forearms/hands from gripping the wing edge. The angle at which your wrist has to cant in order to grab the edge is unnatural to me. If I can do it without having my wrist at that angle, I could probably get better flights. I had to drop my wing edges for the last 1000 feet to let my hands relax so I could pull my hackeys/handles.

j

[namdrib 0]

I am sooooo glad that I was not alone on this topic. Got 2 BM jumps this weekend because I took on a drunkin stuper friday night. Got in at 3:30am and had to teach a ground course Saturday morning at 7:00am. Boy did Saturday suck!!!!

Unknowing attempting to take out all 4 wheeled vehicles remotely close to the landing area!

[notsane 0]

Based on your freefall time and tiredness I'd guess that you're trying too hard. Hitting the right position is a curious mix of being in the right position but also being somewhat relaxed. I weigh in at 200lbs (without gear), 5' 11" and I'm getting over 130 seconds with my S1. I'm definitely not a super athlete or thin/tall.

When I'm trying for maximum time I run though a checklist in my mind to position each body part:

1)shoulders forward, elbows bent, palms up
2)slight de-arch
3)legs straight, toes pointed, feel the leg wing pressure slightly
4)relax! and back to 1)

Getting the very minimum speed and the longest freefall time seem to be opposite goals too. Going the very slowest usually involves a dive, followed by a hard pull-up, followed by another dive, where the longest freefall time is all about consistancy and shallow turns.

IMHO

[nicknitro71 0]

Weight lifting can only do so much in this case I think.

The problem is that with BM jumps muscle movements are isometric. You muscles are contracted but they don't actually move. This leads to fast anaerobic respiration and fast fatique as well. Almost two minutes of that is a lot.

Hopefully I'll be able to find a compromizing position.

Memento Audere Semper

903

[leroydb 0]

Loic is not using a birdman suit. it is made by another company in euroope, I think salmon or "matter"...

Leroy


..I knew I was an unwanted baby when I saw my bath toys were a toaster and a radio...

[kevin922 0]

Quote

Loic is not using a birdman suit. it is made by another company in euroope, I think salmon or "matter"...

Loic is most definately not using a matter suit :-)

It's a fly your body, s-fly.


Kevin

[The111 1]

Quote

1)shoulders forward, elbows bent, palms up

When you say shoulders forward, do you mean similar to a "shrug" motion?

www.WingsuitPhotos.com

[nicknitro71 0]

I mean rotating them and also pushing them forward. The wings actually want to pull your arms back and make your shoulders flat if you let them do it.

Memento Audere Semper

903

[BirdWoman 0]

You are absolutely correct that weight training can only do so much in this case. However, if you try to start off resistance training by doing a lot of isometric or essentric contractions, you are more prone to overuse injury. Thus, initially developing the muscles through weight training is key to avoid later overuse injury. Once the muscles are used to being worked, you can then start to incorporate some isometric and essentric work into it. That can be done with bands, tubes, holding a weight, etc.

"I don't know where it is that I'm going, but wherever it is there I'll be!" --quoted by me

[alain 0]

Quote

Loic is not using a birdman suit. it is made by another company in euroope, I think salmon or "matter"...

errr first attachement down here is a flying salmon
second is a flying salomon suit ;-)

[namdrib 0]

OMG, that was funny. Sucks to laugh out loud in a public Library!!!

Unknowing attempting to take out all 4 wheeled vehicles remotely close to the landing area!

[LouDiamond 1]

Quote

Watchin the soul flyers vid, Loic et al's suits appear to permit flying palms down, as this uses the muscles at the front of the arms / shoulders rather than the back and sides that the birdman suit does, do you think BM may make some mods in the future or am I doing it wrong?

It's kind of like comparing apples and oranges. In order to tension the MTR/S-Fly arm wing you have to pull your arms forward to make the wing taught. The palm to earth method you mentioned works great for those suits. On the Classic II you can get away with palms down but on the other suits you will see a decrease in performance due to the wing shape and size. By bending your palms back at the wrist while flying you automatically position your upper arm/elbow in the ideal position to correctly tension the wings and present them correctly to the wind. You can fly with your hands palm down but IMO your just giving your self more of an arm work out and less performance from the suit. If you are dizzy or cramping by the end of the flight you are doing it wrong. First off, you should never stop breathing( I shouldn't have to say that but it happens) during your flights. Holding your breath will not help even if you just took a hit off of a helium bottle. Second, some peoples arms will feel sore after a flight but it shouldn't be as if you just did 2 hours of delts in the gym. Being too tense or too rigid does nothing to improve your flight, there is a degree of relaxing involved just as there is in every other form of skydiving. Not breathing and tensing all your muscles up will tire you out even if your sitting down. So concentrate on correct body position while maintaining your breathing and adjusting your muscle tension according to your flight. I guarentee you will see better times and flights and not be as smoked by days end.

"It's just skydiving..additional drama is not required"
Some people dream about flying, I live my dream
SKYMONKEY PUBLISHING

[ManBird 0]

I've wondered if you actually get stronger or just figure it out. Based on what I've heard Jari say, I believe it's the latter. After flying the S3 for a bit, you find that you can do big, fat flights fairly consistently without burning your arms off. There's this sort of point where your body and the suit come to an agreement, and you just go. Even then, you still start to taper off for the last couple thousand feet on that fourth or fifth flight of the day.

"¯"`-._.-¯) ManBird (¯-._.-´"¯"

Click

[jmfreefly 0]

Quote

If you are dizzy or cramping by the end of the flight you are doing it wrong

Or a bit hypoxic, in my case.


j

[mirochristie 0]

JAJAJA!!!! You sound just like my husband, and a good friend of mine.
They bought S3`s w/ only a couple of jumps in a Classig and GTI`s.
They look so funny flying the S3. They haven`t been able to max it out yet!

I know exactly how you feel (phisically), same thing happens to them.

LiquidSky
@(^_^)@

[verticalflyer 11]

How have people found the S3 to the Skyflyer in stepping up in performance, work on arms etc, I hold my wingtip maxed out for the whole flight but do get tired after 4-5 of these jump back to back. I have heard a lot of people saying its hard from GTi Classic to S3 but any views from skyflyer to S3?

Thanks for any info.

Fraser

Dont just talk about it, Do it!

[nicknitro71 0]

I've now put more jumps on my S3 and things start to get better. The thing I learnt the most is not to fight too much with the arm wings. You gotta find a compromize to what they want to do and how much strenght you can put into them. I found that pushing the elbows up, holding on the winglets, cupping the shoulders, and keeping the legs straight is the best position for both performance and energy conservation.

Also making turns with the legs gives you much less dive. The S3 loses a lot of altitude and picks up tremendous speed with arm turns, that can be fun in the sydiving enviroment but potentially deadly in the BASE one!

Memento Audere Semper

903

[gus 1]

I thought I'd drag this post up and add my experience from the weekend.

My S3 arrived in the week and Saturday was beautiful weather so up I went. I have about 80 or 90 previous jumps on my old GTi. The S3 is hard work! I did two jumps and was pretty ragged at the end of the second. But....I came down with a 41 mph average
Gus

OutpatientsOnline.com