kelel01 1 #1 September 22, 2003 Hey, everybody! I'm about to graduate the AFF program at my DZ, and I need to buy a rig. The rental rigs at my DZ are too long, and it makes me nervous when they slide down on me at deployment time. Does anybody have any suggestions for a good container and harness for shorties like me? It also needs to be able to hold around a 190 main, at least for a while. I've been looking at the classifieds, but I have no idea what would be good for me to buy. Thanks!! Kelly Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mr2mk1g 10 #2 September 22, 2003 you can buy new - they custom build it to your measurements - that would obviously fit perfectly. Not really many people recomend though untill you have more jumps as you are likely to want to change kit when you get a little exp. Its something to consider though if you cant find any second hand. Second hand gear comes in all sizes too though. There may well be some out there just right for you. Check harness sizes. Javelins for example use a system with a letter (usually C but can be B or D) to reflect the width - most people are C. And a number to reflect the length of the container. I have a C19 cos I'm tall. A short person may want a C14 or something (guess). Other manufacturers use similar systems and nomenclature - research them on line - put some search terms into google or something or check out the manufacturors web sites - all have sizing charts. If you buying from someone get the Main Lift Webbing length - this is the webbing that runs down the side of your body and is the best indicator for well it will fit you. As for what the right MLW is for you - try on a rig with a known MLW length and figure out from that how much smaller you would want your ideal MLW to be. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skybytch 273 #3 September 22, 2003 How tall are you? Are the rental rigs too long in the container (i.e. interfering with your arch) or too long in the harness (i.e. uncomfortable and loose)? If it's the container that's the problem take a look at a Wings. They tend to be shorter top to bottom than some other containers (they make up for it by being "fatter" front to back). If it's the harness that's the problem, you just need to find one that fits you correctly. If you're going to buy a new one you have no worries; have your dealer measure you up and the manufacturer will build the harness to fit you. If you're looking for used you'll need to determine roughly what size harness will fit you - let me know your height and inseam measurement and I can give you a size to work from. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites ojf1982 0 #4 September 22, 2003 I am 5'6 so I know about how uncomfortable those big rigs were. I would suggest a Mirage, because they make rigs for people that are 5'8 and shorter. They end up making the rig thicker, but shorter so it doesnt hang over your butt. I once had a Javelin and it was very uncomfortable (and it was made custom for me) under canopy and on the ground and would hand over my butt making it very discomforting.Unfortunately if you want a 190, the smallest "S" size that Mirage makes is for a 150.The edge ... there is no honest way to explain it because the only people who know where it is are those that have gone over - Hunter S. Thompson Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites kelel01 1 #5 September 22, 2003 Lisa, I am 5'2". The container itself is a little too long, but the biggest problem is the harness. It is loose, and I always feel like I'm going to fall out of it when I deploy. I would probably need to buy a used one. My inseam is 29". Thanks for all of your help! Kelly Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites skybytch 273 #6 September 22, 2003 Based on your height and inseam, I'd figure you need to look for a harness size of around 13". That's going to be hard to find used, especially to fit a 190 main. If it's at all possible financially I'd suggest getting a new custom container and fill it with used canopies (and a used Cypres if you decide you want one). Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites riggerrob 643 #7 September 22, 2003 How tall are you? What is your inseam measurement? How long is your torso? How much do you weight? Are your shoulders small, medium or football-player sized? How big are you around the waist? How big are you around the thighs? How big are you around the hips? Do you carry your weight high or low? All these questions must be answered before you can get a decent-fitting harness. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites pilotdave 0 #8 September 22, 2003 I think you're going to have trouble finding a used container big enough for a 190 main with a harness small enough to fit you. Might need to think about getting something new. On the other hand, if you find a container that'll hold a 190 but has a harness a little too long, you may be able to get it shortened. That's what I did. What size canopy do you think you'll be going down to in the relatively near future? Dave Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites jrcrackers 0 #9 September 22, 2003 Harness's can be resized for a very resonable price. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites kelel01 1 #10 September 22, 2003 I am just about to graduate from the AFF program, so I don't think I'll be going down below a 190 any time soon. I'll be going down TO a 190 very shortly. But I think I found a harness that fits pretty well that's for sale at my DZ, and if I could get it resized, that would be great. Does anyone know where I can get that done? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites kelel01 1 #11 September 22, 2003 By the way, at my DZ, they said a 190 can fit (very tightly) into a Javelin J2. Does that sound right to anyone? Also, is a PD 190 a good starter canopy? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites skybytch 273 #12 September 22, 2003 The J2 was originally designed to hold up to a 170 all F111 main, up to a 150 all zp main. You might be able to get a PD 190 (i.e. an all F111 canopy) into a J2 with some effort - I wouldn't recommend it if you're just learning to pack but it can be done. Putting an all zp 190 into a J2 would be insanity (imho, of course). PD 9 cells are great first canopies. They're far from high performance and the fabric makes them far easier to pack than a zp main. And since they aren't as popular as they used to be you can find them used at real good prices. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites kelel01 1 #13 September 22, 2003 Just a stupid question-- what does zp stand for? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites skybytch 273 #14 September 22, 2003 Quotewhat does zp stand for? Zero porosity. While not technically accurate, it is what most people call the fabric that most main canopies on the market today are built with. Also known as "slippery snot" for it's incredible ability to get away from you while you're trying to stuff it in the deployment bag. Oh... and the only stupid question is the one you didn't ask. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites hookitt 1 #15 September 22, 2003 Quote and the only stupid question is the one you didn't ask I was going to ask you a question, but never mind... ------- Seriously though.. depending on what you weigh, the 190 may or may not be a good size for you. I've been known to make a few harnesses ... lots even, so I agree with the questions asked by riggerrob, not only for the harness sizing, but for the parachutes you wish to fly as well. When you graduate to solo status, I'd venture to guess that you'll find some good advice on canopy sizing at your local DZ. Hope that helps.My grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites mouth 0 #16 September 23, 2003 I'm about your size heights and inseam wise. I actually found a Dolphin D-2 with a 15" webbing for my first gear. I think it is still floating around my DZ even. It help a PD 170 and was a great first setup because it only had 150 jumps on it when I got it. Keep looking around and you may find something. Put an ad in the classifieds section with a request for gear. Mirage makes a short version of their smaller rigs that is the S series but I don't think it goes up to the M2. Javeline makes a yokeless rig which helps across the shoulders. Because I'm small my Javelin in an A-14 which means it has the smallest width across the shoulders and the lift web is a 14. Both rigs are quite comfy for my size but realize they hold up to a 135 main / 126 reserve. -- Hot Mama At least you know where you stand even if it is in a pile of shit. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL. Insert image from URL × Desktop Tablet Phone Submit Reply 0 Go To Topic Listing
ojf1982 0 #4 September 22, 2003 I am 5'6 so I know about how uncomfortable those big rigs were. I would suggest a Mirage, because they make rigs for people that are 5'8 and shorter. They end up making the rig thicker, but shorter so it doesnt hang over your butt. I once had a Javelin and it was very uncomfortable (and it was made custom for me) under canopy and on the ground and would hand over my butt making it very discomforting.Unfortunately if you want a 190, the smallest "S" size that Mirage makes is for a 150.The edge ... there is no honest way to explain it because the only people who know where it is are those that have gone over - Hunter S. Thompson Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelel01 1 #5 September 22, 2003 Lisa, I am 5'2". The container itself is a little too long, but the biggest problem is the harness. It is loose, and I always feel like I'm going to fall out of it when I deploy. I would probably need to buy a used one. My inseam is 29". Thanks for all of your help! Kelly Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skybytch 273 #6 September 22, 2003 Based on your height and inseam, I'd figure you need to look for a harness size of around 13". That's going to be hard to find used, especially to fit a 190 main. If it's at all possible financially I'd suggest getting a new custom container and fill it with used canopies (and a used Cypres if you decide you want one). Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riggerrob 643 #7 September 22, 2003 How tall are you? What is your inseam measurement? How long is your torso? How much do you weight? Are your shoulders small, medium or football-player sized? How big are you around the waist? How big are you around the thighs? How big are you around the hips? Do you carry your weight high or low? All these questions must be answered before you can get a decent-fitting harness. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pilotdave 0 #8 September 22, 2003 I think you're going to have trouble finding a used container big enough for a 190 main with a harness small enough to fit you. Might need to think about getting something new. On the other hand, if you find a container that'll hold a 190 but has a harness a little too long, you may be able to get it shortened. That's what I did. What size canopy do you think you'll be going down to in the relatively near future? Dave Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jrcrackers 0 #9 September 22, 2003 Harness's can be resized for a very resonable price. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelel01 1 #10 September 22, 2003 I am just about to graduate from the AFF program, so I don't think I'll be going down below a 190 any time soon. I'll be going down TO a 190 very shortly. But I think I found a harness that fits pretty well that's for sale at my DZ, and if I could get it resized, that would be great. Does anyone know where I can get that done? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelel01 1 #11 September 22, 2003 By the way, at my DZ, they said a 190 can fit (very tightly) into a Javelin J2. Does that sound right to anyone? Also, is a PD 190 a good starter canopy? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skybytch 273 #12 September 22, 2003 The J2 was originally designed to hold up to a 170 all F111 main, up to a 150 all zp main. You might be able to get a PD 190 (i.e. an all F111 canopy) into a J2 with some effort - I wouldn't recommend it if you're just learning to pack but it can be done. Putting an all zp 190 into a J2 would be insanity (imho, of course). PD 9 cells are great first canopies. They're far from high performance and the fabric makes them far easier to pack than a zp main. And since they aren't as popular as they used to be you can find them used at real good prices. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelel01 1 #13 September 22, 2003 Just a stupid question-- what does zp stand for? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skybytch 273 #14 September 22, 2003 Quotewhat does zp stand for? Zero porosity. While not technically accurate, it is what most people call the fabric that most main canopies on the market today are built with. Also known as "slippery snot" for it's incredible ability to get away from you while you're trying to stuff it in the deployment bag. Oh... and the only stupid question is the one you didn't ask. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites hookitt 1 #15 September 22, 2003 Quote and the only stupid question is the one you didn't ask I was going to ask you a question, but never mind... ------- Seriously though.. depending on what you weigh, the 190 may or may not be a good size for you. I've been known to make a few harnesses ... lots even, so I agree with the questions asked by riggerrob, not only for the harness sizing, but for the parachutes you wish to fly as well. When you graduate to solo status, I'd venture to guess that you'll find some good advice on canopy sizing at your local DZ. Hope that helps.My grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites mouth 0 #16 September 23, 2003 I'm about your size heights and inseam wise. I actually found a Dolphin D-2 with a 15" webbing for my first gear. I think it is still floating around my DZ even. It help a PD 170 and was a great first setup because it only had 150 jumps on it when I got it. Keep looking around and you may find something. Put an ad in the classifieds section with a request for gear. Mirage makes a short version of their smaller rigs that is the S series but I don't think it goes up to the M2. Javeline makes a yokeless rig which helps across the shoulders. Because I'm small my Javelin in an A-14 which means it has the smallest width across the shoulders and the lift web is a 14. Both rigs are quite comfy for my size but realize they hold up to a 135 main / 126 reserve. -- Hot Mama At least you know where you stand even if it is in a pile of shit. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL. Insert image from URL × Desktop Tablet Phone Submit Reply 0
hookitt 1 #15 September 22, 2003 Quote and the only stupid question is the one you didn't ask I was going to ask you a question, but never mind... ------- Seriously though.. depending on what you weigh, the 190 may or may not be a good size for you. I've been known to make a few harnesses ... lots even, so I agree with the questions asked by riggerrob, not only for the harness sizing, but for the parachutes you wish to fly as well. When you graduate to solo status, I'd venture to guess that you'll find some good advice on canopy sizing at your local DZ. Hope that helps.My grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mouth 0 #16 September 23, 2003 I'm about your size heights and inseam wise. I actually found a Dolphin D-2 with a 15" webbing for my first gear. I think it is still floating around my DZ even. It help a PD 170 and was a great first setup because it only had 150 jumps on it when I got it. Keep looking around and you may find something. Put an ad in the classifieds section with a request for gear. Mirage makes a short version of their smaller rigs that is the S series but I don't think it goes up to the M2. Javeline makes a yokeless rig which helps across the shoulders. Because I'm small my Javelin in an A-14 which means it has the smallest width across the shoulders and the lift web is a 14. Both rigs are quite comfy for my size but realize they hold up to a 135 main / 126 reserve. -- Hot Mama At least you know where you stand even if it is in a pile of shit. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
