my pullout system

[Steel 0]

I like it and I intend to stay with it but its not quite that simple.
Reasons I like it.
1. My pilot chute will never tow. Wellll... probably never. Since I can reach back and force my d-bag out and it will probably open after that even without an inflated pilot chute. {done this}
2. Its cool and less people will ask to borrow your equipment because many will freak out at the thought of something different.
3. Its obviously less likely to have a premature release.


Reasons I don't like it.
1. It sticks out less and you need to get a tighter gip on the pudd to pitch. This can get to be a pain when you have a small / short container that is riding high up on your back and you are constantly loosing flexibility on your arms from working out.

Anybody else have an opinion on the mater?

If I could make a wish, I think I'd pass.
Can't think of anything I need
No cigarettes, no sleep, no light, no sound.
Nothing to eat, no books to read.

[PhreeZone 20]

Floating Pud becomes a new malfunction to deal with.

Yesterday is history
And tomorrow is a mystery

Parachutemanuals.com

[davelepka 4]

My guess is that people won't ask to borrow your gear because your main is 55 sq ft. Anyone capable of jumping a 55 is capable of working a pull-out.

I would think that if your system is giving you a "harder pull", that would be a good reason to switch something. Maybe getting a throw out, or a container that sits a little lower on your back, or whatever.

I have a 99.99% of my jumps on a throw out, and have had no problems with the system.

[Steel 0]

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Floating Pud becomes a new malfunction to deal with.

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A couple of people told me that when I first got a pull out system. But 400 jumps later, with that never happening to me, I have come to the conclusion that it never will. I mean because ofcourse I will continue to open properly.

If I could make a wish, I think I'd pass.
Can't think of anything I need
No cigarettes, no sleep, no light, no sound.
Nothing to eat, no books to read.

[councilman24 37]

I've seen more pullout's packed wrong, causing an impossible pull, and dislodged, causing a floating handle than pull problems with a throw out or premature deployments. Especially when the curved pin and spandex pouches were invented most of the problems with the throw out went away. New pullout designes have helped eliminate floating handles and either can be packed wrong. But, especially taking into account the limited number of pullout's around, I've seen a lot more problems with them. And resale of the gear is easier with a throw out.

Either system can work reliably as long as it's maintained and used appropriately. But the key is training and understanding for whatever system you use.

Terry

I'm old for my age.
Terry Urban
D-8631
FAA DPRE

[Blahr 0]

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Reasons I don't like it.
1. It sticks out less and you need to get a tighter gip on the pudd to pitch. This can get to be a pain when you have a small / short container that is riding high up on your back and you are constantly loosing flexibility on your arms from working out.

Anybody else have an opinion on the mater?

I dont use a pullout but this flexibility issue you bring up doesnt seem to make sense to me.

I am a bodybuilder. I have 20" biceps and the rest of my upper body is well in proportion with this. I'm very well muscled and lift weights 5 days per week. This has not affected my ability to reach anything from my ass to the bottom of my right shoulder blade with my right hand.

Where is this pud located that you cant reach it easily?

[quack 0]

I've had one floating pud on mine. I reached back and was able to get the lanyard in my hand and pull the pin with it (I pull high so I had time to try once). If you pack it so the grommet to the lanyard on the pud is close to where the velcro is, then the pud is less likely to take off if floating.

As for hard pulls, the only time this should happen is if the lanyard grommet is tucked too far under the side flap when packing, and catches underneath it.

I love the system. Especially for CRW.

But you have to understand, mental illness is like cholesterol. There is the good kind and the bad. Without the good kind- less flavor to life. - Serge A. Storms

[diverdriver 7]

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I have come to the conclusion that it never will.

Famous last words.

[Steel 0]

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Quote

Reasons I don't like it.
1. It sticks out less and you need to get a tighter gip on the pudd to pitch. This can get to be a pain when you have a small / short container that is riding high up on your back and you are constantly loosing flexibility on your arms from working out.

Anybody else have an opinion on the mater?

I dont use a pullout but this flexibility issue you bring up doesnt seem to make sense to me.

I am a bodybuilder. I have 20" biceps and the rest of my upper body is well in proportion with this.

With all that, I have no problem at all reaching anything from my ass to the bottom of my right shoulder blade with my right hand.

Where is this pud located that you cant reach it easily?

--------------------------------------
20" biceps are pretty huge considering that Jay Cutler is about 22.5 and weighs 260 pounds at 5'9".
My highest with my biceps has been just barely over 17". But anyway just to answer your question. The angle from which you have to present your hand is what we are talking about. You obviously could not present your hand from the same angle just below your shoulder as you could just above your waist. I think if you tried on a small rig you would quickly understand.

If I could make a wish, I think I'd pass.
Can't think of anything I need
No cigarettes, no sleep, no light, no sound.
Nothing to eat, no books to read.

[Remster 30]

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I have come to the conclusion that it never will.

Famous last words.

A local jumper had a reserve ride this weekend. Floating pod.

I dont jump a pod, but I though that if your heads up enough, you could reach it and still pull.

He's more then your average weekend jumper. If a guy with 10,000 jumps and ex-worldchamp couldnt find it, maybe you should re-thing the "never gonna happen" scenario.

Remster

[Blahr 0]

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20" biceps are pretty huge considering that Jay Cutler is about 22.5 and weighs 260 pounds at 5'9".

Thats cuz he is a freak of nature He is favored to take Mr. O from Ronnie this year.

20 isnt all that hard really if you have the nutrition and workout schedule right and you are dedicated.
And those 2 and a half inches he has on me are killers. Its easy (relatively speaking) to go from 17 to 18 inches. Its harder to go from 19 to 20 and only a VERY small percentage of guys can get in the 22 to 23 range because thats almost impossible.
The bigger you get, the harder it is to get bigger.

I wont ever be that big. I'm satisfied with 20. I dont compete.

[payback462 0]

some things i'd add are

-once you put the pin in the closing loop your pretty much done, all you have to do is tuck in the bridle.
with BOC you still have to fold and stow the PC and bridle

-no spandex to wear out (although theyre is a little peice of velcro thatll need replacement every couple hundred jumps.)

-everything is much lower profile and less likely to
snag.

some things i dont like about it
- it would scare me to use a packer i dont know to pack it (and even some i do know)

-when people who dont know what the fuck their doing try to give me gear checks (which i prefer to do for myself!) and try to tuck the grommet in as far in as they can!!!!!!

[champu 1]

I'm still a newbie so take what I have to say about more advanced deployment methods with a grain of salt, but here's my thinking.

lower profile, avoiding snag, horseshoe, and PCIT mals seem to be the main reasons for using a pull-out over throw-out, but at the expense of adding a floating handle mal, a more confusing pack-job, and re-introducing velcro when container manufacturers have gone through all the trouble they have to get rid of it, seems to me like you're just shuffling problems around.

To me the problems it aims to fix can be solved just as easily by performing the final stages of your pack job with care, something people should be doing anyway.

[hookitt 1]

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a more confusing pack-job, and re-introducing velcro

It's not more confusing than pull-out. It's different.

There is a piece of velcro on a flap that's easily replaceable on my rig. Even when it's worn out, it still holds the handle in place just fine.

Some manufacturers have designed a tuck tab system that works very well eliminating velcro altogether.

My grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto

[masher 1]

You don't have to reintroduce velcro.

I had a pullout on my racer when I got it, it had two pouches that each end of the pud slipped in to. It held it quite firmly.

--
Arching is overrated - Marlies

[skygod7777 0]

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Floating Pud becomes a new malfunction to deal with.

not really, i have had a couple (bumped on exit) and had no problem at all reaching back and finding it. now, i jump a small rig, but even on a big rig, it shouldn't be a problem.

and to go along with the post:

i love my pull-out. it just makes more sense to me, you can't have a horse shoe, and those scare the ever lovin shit out of me (my dad went in, and lived, from one). you don't really have to worry about a pilot chute in tow, and if your low, you know you'll have something above your head .

the only thing i don't like about it is, well, nothing really other than some manufacturers don't care for them, they make so many of the BOC's, and just don't get too many orders for pull-out.

i think everyone should try it, just to see if they like it, or hate it. i know a lot of people that talk about them, but have never even tried it.

later

[skygod7777 0]

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but at the expense of adding a floating handle mal, a more confusing pack-job, and re-introducing velcro when container manufacturers have gone through all the trouble they have to get rid of it, seems to me like you're just shuffling problems around.

like i said above, the floating pud isn't that big of a deal.

more confusing packjob, i guess it could be, but if you hadn't been taught how to pack a boc, wouldn't it be confusing??

velcro, well i don't have any on my rig (wings). i believe the mirage's don't either. javelin still does. i believe the infinity does also. i'm not sure which other manufacturers do, but it isn't a very big deal anyway. it's just a very small piece, that is covered by a piece of material anyway, do it can't hurt anything.

i'm not bashing you at all, and if i seam like i am, sorry. i'm just informing, and trying to push pull-out
later

[champu 1]

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i'm not bashing you at all, and if i seam like i am, sorry. i'm just informing, and trying to push pull-out
later

oh no, I take no offense, as I said I'm still a newbie.

I've not jumped a pullout but I saw someone in florida using one and inquired about it since throw out and ripcord were all I'd seen before. It was on a javelin so it had velcro. if someone has made a secure tuck-in pud that's great.

It just seemed to me it's main advantages were preventing mals that were generally caused by not paying attention to things like closing loop size/wear. and could be avoided. But I guess at the end of the day, if your rig has one less thing to go wrong regardless of how careful you are that's a good thing right?

[murrays 0]

A floater isn't a big deal...like the man said. I've had 3 or 4 in 2,000 pull-out jumps and found it within 2-3 seconds. Once I even intentionally dropped the handle to do a quick 2-way when I was about to pull after a PFF dive.

BOC has done away with a lot of throw-out related bounces that happened due to misrouted bridles, pilot chutes in tow, entanglements or people not pulling their reserve because they were busy diddling with the PC in tow.

Our club has had a rash of hard pulls on BOCs that have resulted in reserve rides. Packing a throw-out pilot chute seems to be fairly difficult based on our recent experience.

Right now I am jumping a rig with a throw-out and one with a pull-out. I have to tell you that waiting for the pin to get pulled vs. pulling it myself bothers me. I am undecided whether I will convert the newer rig to a pull-out. The fact that I am considering getting a wingsuit is one reason I haven't...maybe the only reason as overall I would still rather jump a pull-out.

--
Murray

"No tyranny is so irksome as petty tyranny: the officious demands of policemen, government clerks, and electromechanical gadgets." - Edward Abbey

[usmcdannyboy 0]

i just recieved my new wings and i got to tell you all i love it but there was 2 options i got that do not go well together. the first option is the PUD, the other is the "birdman option" the bird man option consists of not stitching up the bottom corners on the inside of the container all the way, so the container flaps are looser and open wider. well this presented a little problem, the flaps were a little looser once packed and the pud didnt fit properly in the tuck pouch. well easily fixed. just got the rigger(wonderful guy) to put the stiches back in. the moral of the story, dont get a wide opening container with a pud.. but i also got to say i love pulling my pud

I am the light my son...What you seek is fire

[usmcdannyboy 0]

oh and the reason i posted to begin with...

The first jump i made with my pud i was bet a dollar that i would have a reserve ride..they thought i would drop my pud. but i understand why..its different and just because you feel it give a little on the inital tug doesnt mean you pulled your pin. i see how the guy who bet me needed to use his reserve the first time he used a pud. but i won and i still got that dollar, i think i'll frame it..but I got it because it is low profile and less chance of a total mal. but also because its different and i think you need to try a little of everything just to see what you think of it and how it works for you...i hear of too many people in the world today that just repeat what they have heard and dont try it for themselves..now if you will more than likely kill yourself doing something then dont try it but if its different from your norm. give it a try and make your own opinion...the reason i say this is because the local skygod has been going around the DZ telling all the newbies his opinion on gear and they need to listen to him because he know what he's talkin about...but thats a different topic.

I am the light my son...What you seek is fire

[Remster 30]

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you can't have a horse shoe

YES you can. A horseshoe is the PC or briddle touching any part of the body/rig. You could have one with a pod, say, if the briddle entangles with you arm, or leg.

EDIT: actually, if any part of the parachute still touches you, not just the briddle/PC.

Remster

[skymedic 0]

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just recieved my new wings and i got to tell you all i love it but there was 2 options i got that do not go well together. the first option is the PUD, the other is the "birdman option" the bird man option consists of not stitching up the bottom corners on the inside of the container all the way, so the container flaps are looser and open wider. well this presented a little problem, the flaps were a little looser once packed and the pud didnt fit properly in the tuck pouch. well easily fixed. just got the rigger(wonderful guy) to put the stiches back in. the moral of the story, dont get a wide opening container with a pud.. but i also got to say i love pulling my pud

Do you have a pull out or do you have the freefly handled BOC?

Marc
otherwise known as Mr.Fallinwoman....

[usmcdannyboy 0]

i got the pull out...

I am the light my son...What you seek is fire

[skygod7777 0]

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YES you can. A horseshoe is the PC or briddle touching any part of the body/rig. You could have one with a pod, say, if the briddle entangles with you arm, or leg.

your right, i was wrong saying you "can't" have a horse shoe, but it would be a hell of a lot harder. the only way i could think of it would be if it was tied of to something, or you pull unstable and it gets wraped around your leg (which this would still happen if you had BOC).

later