bodypilot90 0 #1 February 24, 2004 I did my 500th jump this weekend. Had a local camera flyer set up. He got real sick just before our 15 way. I walked to manifest and asked for to have camera. Mind you 11 of the people came to the dz to jump with me. Would your dz charge the tandem rate for the slot? It was a slow day for them. They did not have a tandem to do. I should have asked how much before. My fault, I just glad I didn't ask for stills. At this dz, the dz runs the video Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lister55 0 #2 February 24, 2004 Well I guess each DZ has the right to "ask" thier employees to charge whatever the DZ wants. But, camera flyers are generally sub-contractors. So if they want to fly a video slot at a discounted price then that is their business. Of course the DZ does not have to use them either. However I have never seen this as a problem, especially when friends are doing videos for friends. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freefalle 0 #3 February 24, 2004 I think could be a controversial issue. The DZ has a set price they charge a customer and a set rate they pay their staff. If you go to the DZ and ask for them to arrange someone to shoot your video, they are going to charge their price and pay the person who shoots the video their agreed upon rate for the service. From what I read, you feel the DZ should charge a regular fun jumper less for their video than they would a tandem. (STRICTLY PLAYING DEVILS ADVOCATE HERE) why should they? they, and the person shooting the video are providing you the same service they provide a tandem customer. Why then, other than the fact that you are a regular customer, should they charge any less; and who is to take the loss for the reduction in charge, the DZ who is arranging the service, The staff member who shoots the video or both? Although I do think its kind of wrong for your DZ not to tell you how much they were going to charge you for a service before rendering said service I think they have the right to charge their standard rate. What most people do is go directly to someone who shoots video and makes and agreement as to cost (usually much cheaper than what the DZ charges) Which brings up another point I would wonder about. Does the DZ have the right to tell a staff member who is not working but is at the DZ for they day that they cannot be paid privately to shoot a video? OR does the DZ have the right to tell someone who is not employed by the DZ that they cannot be paid privately to shoot a video for someone? I guess if you really think about it, everytime someone with a camera goes up and shoots a video for someone the DZ could feel that they are loosing money because the DZ offers the service. Okay Ive gone on long enough. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Deuce 1 #4 February 24, 2004 Well, my DZ has a video concession. The owner buys, maintains, and replaces all the dubbing and duplicating equipment. If you come in off the street and want your tandem or AFF level done, you pay the published price. And now to to double standard. We call being in the camera rotation, or the tandem rotation, or the AFF instruction rotation being "on the wheel" When you are on the wheel, everything is by the book. However, when the customers are gone and it's just fun jumpers like it usually is late in the afternoon, we can work something out. Especially if you brought beer . A nice offer is my slot plus a jump ticket. You provide the tape and we do a straight download, no editing. If you want to have some editing done, I feel obliged to pay the concession owner, cause that's not my gear. I'm surprised that at that jump number level you don't already know lots of people and camera fliers at the DZ who could take care of you. Or were you visiting? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lister55 0 #5 February 24, 2004 Which brings up another point I would wonder about. Does the DZ have the right to tell a staff member who is not working but is at the DZ for they day that they cannot be paid privately to shoot a video? OR does the DZ have the right to tell someone who is not employed by the DZ that they cannot be paid privately to shoot a video for someone? Quote I feel the DZ has no right to tell me I can not shoot a video for another experienced skydiver. However, as I said, They can tell me they will not use me anymore to shoot tandems and they can also deny me access to thier editing stations. As far as an upjumper who does even work for the DZ... The DZ has no say so here. Each jumper is paying for a slot on the plane. But again, the DZ owner does not have to let someone on his/her plane. This really boils down to ethics. My DZ only regulates tandem and AFF videos. If I want to shoot an upjumper they realize that everyone enjoys having a video and some pics of themselves. They also realize that these jumpers will make lots of jumps. My opinion is....keep the DZ out of it if it is between experienced skydivers. If it is a tandem or AFF let the DZ have its rule here. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites freefalle 0 #6 February 24, 2004 i agree with you lister Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites PhreeZone 20 #7 February 24, 2004 For stills the price would be more, but just for video the standard fee at my DZ is slot, maybe packjob and required eer at the end of the day. None of us funjumpers are in it to make a living and the fact that we get beer is even better since that gives an excuse for bonfires. The tandem crew is usually just us fun jumpers that got pulled in to help the one or two full time tandem video people we have. Normally the video includes a single VHS dub that the person has to provide the blank tape for. If you wanted something other then RW footage then the pool of people goes down quite a bit and the price might go up (luckly I can shoot all but HD and stills and my price is slot and beer). As for the tandem videos at the DZ, the DZ sells them for one price but I've done deals for friends or friends of jumpers to shoot it for way less. I shot ScottBre's relative for slot last year, and have had other video guys shoot videos for my family for their slot. The DZ family atmosphere at my DZ puts the friendship above the $ in most cases.Yesterday is history And tomorrow is a mystery Parachutemanuals.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites piisfish 140 #8 February 25, 2004 I would have invited the cameraman, paid his slot and BASTA. or ask the DZO etc to join in too, and do everything for free.scissors beat paper, paper beat rock, rock beat wingsuit - KarlM Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites linestretch 0 #9 February 25, 2004 first of all, I wouldn't have gone to manifest and asked for a camera person. Your best bet would have been to look for someone that could/would fill the slot. Tell them you are going to pay thier slot, and say 10 bucks on top. I've done this a lot for others. Getting the DZ involved in this was a mistake...in my opinion. But, every DZ is different.my pics & stuff! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites BETO74 0 #10 February 25, 2004 When everything fails ,y ou can always count on me!!!!! Carloshttp://web.mac.com/ac057a/iWeb/AC057A/H0M3.html Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites bodypilot90 0 #11 February 25, 2004 QuoteWhen everything fails ,you can always count on me!!!!! Carlos Carlos, first off thanks. Believe me I will not make the same mistake the 2ed time. I had a camera flier set up but he was about to puke on the 30 min call. I did run around the dz and look for a non-staff person. I did not find one. I went in to the video room and asked for camera before going to manifest. I should have known to get out the ky jelly when they told me I had to go through manifest. I didn't ask how much because in all honesty I was panicked about not getting video and dealing with family and our group. I intended to buy staff a case of their own beer along with some for my group as well. In the past the dz has given us the camera slot on our bigger groups. I would not have as much to say but the video was more like a team jump video than a tandem video. Camera man did not show up till we were almost boarding, didn't turn camera on till just before climb out. Video did not contain a title screen. Maybe he was sick as well. It just didn't seem to rate $75 I'm as pissed at myself for not asking as I am them. I will be no longer helping with tandems when they land. I felt I was family there, guess they don't feel the same. I will be e mailing the dz manager in the next day or two. thanks guys for the input Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites bodypilot90 0 #12 February 25, 2004 QuoteI would have invited the cameraman, paid his slot and BASTA. or ask the DZO etc to join in too, and do everything for free. both of the dz managers were on the load, one was in our group, go figure Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites jalisco 0 #13 February 25, 2004 Ouch. Is this your usual DZ? How long have you been jumping there? How many jumps there? Have you recently returned there after a long absence? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites wingnut 0 #14 February 26, 2004 at my dz the video concesion is run by the dzo. if you want a v ideo and you talk to him you will pay the 45 just like a tandem does.. if you talk to a video guy and you know him he wil most likely do it for slot and a beer... probly wn't even need the beer though.... i've done friends of other jumpers tandem video's just for slot but that was cuz i'm helping out the friend.. the thing that makes tandem video harder is the editing you have to do to it and i shoot my video so that i have to do very little editing but it still takes time... aff jumps are my favorite... no editing persay other than a slo mo of the entire jump and music..... but if it was a stranger coming up to me and asking me to do video of a jump that was really improtant to them i would probly charge em a little cuz of the added stress i would have to "get the shot". same way i feel about tandems. ______________________________________ "i have no reader's digest version" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites bodypilot90 0 #15 February 26, 2004 Quote this your usual DZ? How long have you been jumping there? How many jumps there? Have you recently returned there after a long absence? did aff there and mostly jump there. Only live 2 miles away so why drive. There have been a change in dz management. But I've known even the new ppl in charge for a long time. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites bodypilot90 0 #16 February 26, 2004 there was no real edit, exit to break off and a group shot after landing. Like I said my fault for not asking how much. But disappointing just the same. Next time the dz truck breaks down I'll remember this. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites BETO74 0 #17 February 26, 2004 Sorry about that I did not know they charge you that much, but anyway now I'm piss at you for not inviting me for you 500th. With all seriousness call me anytime you have something fun plan me and Marco are jumping hard FF mostly but we love big RW formations too I'm making your tape right know, next time I see you remind me Hope Isee you soonhttp://web.mac.com/ac057a/iWeb/AC057A/H0M3.html Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites BETO74 0 #18 February 26, 2004 The problem I see with this is that is not only about the money It's like killing the chiken when you need the eggs, Now you're piss so you won't bring more bussiness to the DZ and they lose. Just talk with them maybe they change their mind if they don't don't kill yourself now you know better.http://web.mac.com/ac057a/iWeb/AC057A/H0M3.html Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites bodypilot90 0 #19 February 27, 2004 QuoteSorry about that I did not know they charge you that much, but anyway now I'm piss at you for not inviting me for you 500th. LOL well the "old guys" set it up and you know how scared they are of freeflyers Good new is we'll be allowed to do beach jumps again. Maybe you and I can open at break off and bump canopies over the beach QuoteWith all seriousness call me anytime you have something fun plan me and Marco are jumping hard FF mostly but we love big RW formations too ok I'll let you know for sure. Was suppose to be a nice 8 way but I guess I got more friends than I thought QuoteI'm making your tape right know, next time I see you remind me ok I owe ya a beer as well, see ya soon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. 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freefalle 0 #6 February 24, 2004 i agree with you lister Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhreeZone 20 #7 February 24, 2004 For stills the price would be more, but just for video the standard fee at my DZ is slot, maybe packjob and required eer at the end of the day. None of us funjumpers are in it to make a living and the fact that we get beer is even better since that gives an excuse for bonfires. The tandem crew is usually just us fun jumpers that got pulled in to help the one or two full time tandem video people we have. Normally the video includes a single VHS dub that the person has to provide the blank tape for. If you wanted something other then RW footage then the pool of people goes down quite a bit and the price might go up (luckly I can shoot all but HD and stills and my price is slot and beer). As for the tandem videos at the DZ, the DZ sells them for one price but I've done deals for friends or friends of jumpers to shoot it for way less. I shot ScottBre's relative for slot last year, and have had other video guys shoot videos for my family for their slot. The DZ family atmosphere at my DZ puts the friendship above the $ in most cases.Yesterday is history And tomorrow is a mystery Parachutemanuals.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
piisfish 140 #8 February 25, 2004 I would have invited the cameraman, paid his slot and BASTA. or ask the DZO etc to join in too, and do everything for free.scissors beat paper, paper beat rock, rock beat wingsuit - KarlM Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
linestretch 0 #9 February 25, 2004 first of all, I wouldn't have gone to manifest and asked for a camera person. Your best bet would have been to look for someone that could/would fill the slot. Tell them you are going to pay thier slot, and say 10 bucks on top. I've done this a lot for others. Getting the DZ involved in this was a mistake...in my opinion. But, every DZ is different.my pics & stuff! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BETO74 0 #10 February 25, 2004 When everything fails ,y ou can always count on me!!!!! Carloshttp://web.mac.com/ac057a/iWeb/AC057A/H0M3.html Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bodypilot90 0 #11 February 25, 2004 QuoteWhen everything fails ,you can always count on me!!!!! Carlos Carlos, first off thanks. Believe me I will not make the same mistake the 2ed time. I had a camera flier set up but he was about to puke on the 30 min call. I did run around the dz and look for a non-staff person. I did not find one. I went in to the video room and asked for camera before going to manifest. I should have known to get out the ky jelly when they told me I had to go through manifest. I didn't ask how much because in all honesty I was panicked about not getting video and dealing with family and our group. I intended to buy staff a case of their own beer along with some for my group as well. In the past the dz has given us the camera slot on our bigger groups. I would not have as much to say but the video was more like a team jump video than a tandem video. Camera man did not show up till we were almost boarding, didn't turn camera on till just before climb out. Video did not contain a title screen. Maybe he was sick as well. It just didn't seem to rate $75 I'm as pissed at myself for not asking as I am them. I will be no longer helping with tandems when they land. I felt I was family there, guess they don't feel the same. I will be e mailing the dz manager in the next day or two. thanks guys for the input Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bodypilot90 0 #12 February 25, 2004 QuoteI would have invited the cameraman, paid his slot and BASTA. or ask the DZO etc to join in too, and do everything for free. both of the dz managers were on the load, one was in our group, go figure Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jalisco 0 #13 February 25, 2004 Ouch. Is this your usual DZ? How long have you been jumping there? How many jumps there? Have you recently returned there after a long absence? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wingnut 0 #14 February 26, 2004 at my dz the video concesion is run by the dzo. if you want a v ideo and you talk to him you will pay the 45 just like a tandem does.. if you talk to a video guy and you know him he wil most likely do it for slot and a beer... probly wn't even need the beer though.... i've done friends of other jumpers tandem video's just for slot but that was cuz i'm helping out the friend.. the thing that makes tandem video harder is the editing you have to do to it and i shoot my video so that i have to do very little editing but it still takes time... aff jumps are my favorite... no editing persay other than a slo mo of the entire jump and music..... but if it was a stranger coming up to me and asking me to do video of a jump that was really improtant to them i would probly charge em a little cuz of the added stress i would have to "get the shot". same way i feel about tandems. ______________________________________ "i have no reader's digest version" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bodypilot90 0 #15 February 26, 2004 Quote this your usual DZ? How long have you been jumping there? How many jumps there? Have you recently returned there after a long absence? did aff there and mostly jump there. Only live 2 miles away so why drive. There have been a change in dz management. But I've known even the new ppl in charge for a long time. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bodypilot90 0 #16 February 26, 2004 there was no real edit, exit to break off and a group shot after landing. Like I said my fault for not asking how much. But disappointing just the same. Next time the dz truck breaks down I'll remember this. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BETO74 0 #17 February 26, 2004 Sorry about that I did not know they charge you that much, but anyway now I'm piss at you for not inviting me for you 500th. With all seriousness call me anytime you have something fun plan me and Marco are jumping hard FF mostly but we love big RW formations too I'm making your tape right know, next time I see you remind me Hope Isee you soonhttp://web.mac.com/ac057a/iWeb/AC057A/H0M3.html Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BETO74 0 #18 February 26, 2004 The problem I see with this is that is not only about the money It's like killing the chiken when you need the eggs, Now you're piss so you won't bring more bussiness to the DZ and they lose. Just talk with them maybe they change their mind if they don't don't kill yourself now you know better.http://web.mac.com/ac057a/iWeb/AC057A/H0M3.html Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bodypilot90 0 #19 February 27, 2004 QuoteSorry about that I did not know they charge you that much, but anyway now I'm piss at you for not inviting me for you 500th. LOL well the "old guys" set it up and you know how scared they are of freeflyers Good new is we'll be allowed to do beach jumps again. Maybe you and I can open at break off and bump canopies over the beach QuoteWith all seriousness call me anytime you have something fun plan me and Marco are jumping hard FF mostly but we love big RW formations too ok I'll let you know for sure. Was suppose to be a nice 8 way but I guess I got more friends than I thought QuoteI'm making your tape right know, next time I see you remind me ok I owe ya a beer as well, see ya soon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
