What would you have done?

[SniperCJ 0]

OK, there i was doing a tandem video. Flip on my back, vid the opening, flip back and toss.

Lineover.

Cutaway.

OK, so I'm good to go under the reserve. I spot my main and freebag and theyre both going down in a field 2 south of the DZ. Looks good for recovery. I can still make the DZ and finish out the tandem video that I'm getting paid for.

So...Do you recover you equipment or do you finish your job.

What would YOU do?

JC

[videointhesky 0]

Is the cost of your main and freebag more or less than the amount that your making on the Tandem Video

[Miami 0]

Finish the vid. I'm getting paid for a service that includes the hazard of having to cutaway. Unless I am unable to complete the service (can't get back to the dz) I would continue to do the job I was paid for. Hopefully another jumper on the load, or someone on the ground, would see the incident and go after the gear for me.

What did you do?

Miami

[ivanrockon 0]

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Is the cost of your main and freebag more or less than the amount that your making on the Tandem Video

No is not and it will never be that way. Unless you get paid $2,000+ per video then maybe I wouldn't care for the loss.

Now responding to the original question, I think that will depend if I'm not making it to the DZ. Twice I had to chop my main and with a lot of luck I have made it back to the DZ to finish the video. But in other occasions where the spot have been terrible or a sudden change in wind direction have made me land nowhere near the landing area in the DZ. Once on the DZ I apologize with the client give a brief explanation why I couldn't make it (by this time the tandem master have already explain the same thing that I do since he/she also is witnessing what I went through) and so far maybe one or two had have an issue with it but once they what you have edited for them is priceless. Now is very important that you do a very good editing job to compensate for you not making it back to capture the landing.

My .02 cents

Ivan "Rock On"

[SniperCJ 0]

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What did you do?

I spotted my gear and made it back to the DZ for a stand up landing in the peas and finished the job I was paid for.

I had one guy who I really respect at the DZ pull me aside a few days later and give me props for finishing the job. Really affirmed that I had made the right decision.

JC

[jimmytavino 16]

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What did you do?

I spotted my gear and made it back to the DZ for a stand up landing in the peas and finished the job I was paid for.

I had one guy who I really respect at the DZ pull me aside a few days later and give me props for finishing the job. Really affirmed that I had made the right decision.

JC

....Hmmmm... Interesting situation.....But yes... you did a good thing to # 1. spot your main and #2 be where you needed to be @ landing to complete your job...
But.... sometimes after a cutaway people think that they need to just "head for the landing area",,, and someone ELSE on the dive will locate the main and freebag....
I dunno... A friend of mine did a cutaway on sunday,, and headed for home,, under his reserve,,, while a few of us @ the DZ tried to "spot" where his gear landed,,,, all we could really do,, was "get a line "
on its location as it settled into some heavy woods east of the DZ... we looked and looked,, tramped around in the woods for HOURS.... and as the sun set..... had not recovered it
.....so we got to talking,, and sort of determined that it MIGHT be best to stay "out",,,, at least until the main has landed,,,, and since it should descend faster than you do under your reserve,,, to really get a GOOD look at EXACTLY where it hit,,, then refer to an aerial photo at the DZ to initiate a search party... especially in heavily wooded areas.......
If necessary,, and IF it is safe,,, landing near the main might make sense,,, rather than simply turning your back,, and "running for the DZ"...( he was NOT a camera person on a working jump)..... As far as a camera person is concerned,
an out landing can occur without a cutaway,,, and so as a team... we ALWAYS cover each other at the landing area and if someone is long and lands out,, we video the landing of THEIR student for them... Of course with an otter load we often have 3 or 4 or 5 cameras on the load,, and so this is easier than say a C 182 tandem with just ONE cameraperson...(of course, 4 or 5 tandems on the load,,, increases the likelihood of a strung out exit..and if the spot goes long and the TM / cameraperson fails to adjust the opening alt.... the vid person could wind up too low to get back ) That is where someone on the ground needs to be tuned in,,, and able to grab a handheld,, and "get the landing",,, ( keep a vid camera handy,, just like you would the radio,, for such cases ) ..... True the first jump student has paid for a video,, and naturally wants a complete
product,,,,,,, but In my mind that may have to take a back seat,,,, to MY wants,,,,,,which include the recovery of my main..........
feedback??????

[Miami 0]

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But.... sometimes after a cutaway people think that they need to just "head for the landing area",,, and someone ELSE on the dive will locate the main and freebag....
I dunno... A friend of mine did a cutaway on sunday,, and headed for home,, under his reserve,,, while a few of us @ the DZ tried to "spot" where his gear landed,,,, all we could really do,, was "get a line "
on its location as it settled into some heavy woods east of the DZ... we looked and looked,, tramped around in the woods for HOURS.... and as the sun set..... had not recovered it
.....so we got to talking,, and sort of determined that it MIGHT be best to stay "out",,,, at least until the main has landed,,,, and since it should descend faster than you do under your reserve,,, to really get a GOOD look at EXACTLY where it hit,,, then refer to an aerial photo at the DZ to initiate a search party... especially in heavily wooded areas.......
If necessary,, and IF it is safe,,, landing near the main might make sense,,, rather than simply turning your back,, and "running for the DZ"...( he was NOT a camera person on a working jump)..... As far as a camera person is concerned,
an out landing can occur without a cutaway,,, and so as a team... we ALWAYS cover each other at the landing area and if someone is long and lands out,, we video the landing of THEIR student for them... Of course with an otter load we often have 3 or 4 or 5 cameras on the load,, and so this is easier than say a C 182 tandem with just ONE cameraperson...(of course, 4 or 5 tandems on the load,,, increases the likelihood of a strung out exit..and if the spot goes long and the TM / cameraperson fails to adjust the opening alt.... the vid person could wind up too low to get back ) That is where someone on the ground needs to be tuned in,,, and able to grab a handheld,, and "get the landing",,, ( keep a vid camera handy,, just like you would the radio,, for such cases ) ..... True the first jump student has paid for a video,, and naturally wants a complete
product,,,,,,, but In my mind that may have to take a back seat,,,, to MY wants,,,,,,which include the recovery of my main..........
feedback??????

Would you really want to land a canopy you are really not familiar with at a less than desirable location? Would the people at the dz know that the person who just used the reserve was alert and oriented if they flew away from the dz when they could have made it back to the intended landing area?

I know it sucks tromping through the woods looking for a chopped main, I've been there a few times, but it really sucks trying to find a canopy and a jumper cause you don't know if they are ok.

Usually the chopped main will fall faster than most of the people on a load. If another jumper cannot go after the equipment they should at least be able to spot it's landing area and get a good idea of where it is to use as a reference on an aerial photo.

Just like we tell students and new jumpers...gear can be replaced, they cannot. I really believe a post mal jumper should try to land in the safest area possible, which would usually be the dz, if at least so they can get on their way to the package store to get their rigger a fifth!

Miami

[jimmytavino 16]

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Would you really want to land a canopy you are really not familiar with at a less than desirable location?
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well,,, unless the reserve is REAL small and the conditions real bouncy,,,,,yes..if I was familiar with the 'outs" around my dz.... I think I CAN handle an off field landing...
Depending on what altitude I get my reserve out,,,, I may not even have the time to get back... Plus if I mal,,, and then cutaway, and the people who are in the air with me are paying attention,,,,, when i land safely,,,, i would sure,,, get up,,, move around,,, wave to those flying home,,, over the top of me,,, ( to let 'em know I'm ok ),,, and then ....... especially if i got a decent look at where the main or freebag landed,,,,, I'd go retrieve my gear!!!!!!..
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Would the people at the dz know that the person who just used the reserve was alert and oriented if they flew away from the dz when they could have made it back to the intended landing area?
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As stated above,,,, those who are still under canopy should be tuned into the fact that I landed OK..
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I know it sucks tromping through the woods looking for a chopped main, I've been there a few times, but it really sucks trying to find a canopy and a jumper cause you don't know if they are ok.***
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True enough Miami,, and you may be correct for students and novices.... maybe they should land @ the dz if they can..... But experienced jumpers may decide on the best procedures,,, for themselves...
Of course,,,, i should add that my thoughts on the subject are based on the fact that my reserve,,, is actually a little bit bigger than my Main.hahahha
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Usually the chopped main will fall faster than most of the people on a load. If another jumper cannot go after the equipment they should at least be able to spot it's landing area and get a good idea of where it is to use as a reference on an aerial photo.
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Yes.... IF !!!!!... but sometimes... we think our buds
are covering for us,,,,
and they land and say,,, " What Cutaway" ???!!!! ..... so I will look out for myself,, thanks, and since there is only one brief instant in time when a main settles to the ground after a breakaway.... I believe I will be keeping MY eyes on it so as to take a snapshot in my mind, ( if not with my video ) when it does "land"... . especially if it is NOT in an open accessible area...
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Just like we tell students and new jumpers...gear can be replaced, they cannot. I really believe a post mal jumper should try to land in the safest area possible, which would usually be the dz, if at least so they can get on their way to the package store to get their rigger a fifth!

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.......yes indeed... but when I walk back,, or catch a ride back,,, i intend to have my main and hopefully my freebag,,,, in hand...... then we can all share
the fifth,,,, with my rigger,,, instead of having to just start organizing a search party............ But I will concede that your suggestion may be right for students,,, or anyone using a small,, small reserve,,,, and maybe for the first time....

[PhreeZone 20]

If the items are headed for an easy recovery head for the best landing spot. The TM's (myself included) all follow our video guys down as long as they land in a spot we feel is safe for a tandem too. If its headed for a nasty situation like the middle of a corn field or Farmer McNasty's place... Follow the main, the TM will take care of the tandem.

Same thing on long spots. The videographer goes for the best landing area and if the TM can land there its a successful skydive, otherwise the Tandem lands at the DZ and the student is told their videographer is a few miles away

If a tandem chops the tandem after them will usually try to keep an eye on the gear for easy recovery. If the tandem after has video its the videographers call if they go after the tandem gear or not.

Yesterday is history
And tomorrow is a mystery

Parachutemanuals.com

[Miami 0]

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well,,, unless the reserve is REAL small and the conditions real bouncy,,,,,yes..if I was familiar with the 'outs" around my dz.... I think I CAN handle an off field landing...

It's not a question of whether or not you can handle an off dz landing with your reserve, but whether it is the best option.

The situation you mentioned about the jumper who chopped and headed home while people on the ground spotted a line as to where the gear went out of view... If the gear landed in heavy woods would you have landed next to the woods then go tromping through them with your reserve in tow?

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Depending on what altitude I get my reserve out,,,, I may not even have the time to get back...

Of course that could happen, but like I said before, I think the best option is to land in the safest area possible.

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Plus if I mal,,, and then cutaway, and the people who are in the air with me are paying attention,,,,, when i land safely,,,, i would sure,,, get up,,, move around,,, wave to those flying home,,, over the top of me,,, ( to let 'em know I'm ok ),,, and then ....... especially if i got a decent look at where the main or freebag landed,,,,, I'd go retrieve my gear!!!!!!..

If you are concerned that they will not spot your gear for you what makes you think they will spot you?

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True enough Miami,, and you may be correct for students and novices.... maybe they should land @ the dz if they can..... But experienced jumpers may decide on the best procedures,,, for themselves...
Of course,,,, i should add that my thoughts on the subject are based on the fact that my reserve,,, is actually a little bit bigger than my Main.hahahha

Thats awesome that you don't feel the need to get some little brick of a rig, I wish new jumpers would follow your example. With the experience like you or I have our actions may be a little different. My work rig has a Raven 218 for the reserve, and my actions would definitely be different on it rather than on my other rigs that both have MicroRaven 120-mz's.

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Yes.... IF !!!!!... but sometimes... we think our buds
are covering for us,,,,
and they land and say,,, " What Cutaway" ???!!!! ..... so I will look out for myself,, thanks, and since there is only one brief instant in time when a main settles to the ground after a breakaway.... I believe I will be keeping MY eyes on it so as to take a snapshot in my mind, ( if not with my video ) when it does "land"... . especially if it is NOT in an open accessible area...

And if there is an injury? If you land off so you could spot where you main went down but injury yourself on landing...even though your reserve is bigger it still may be unfamiliar. If everyone else on the load has no idea there was a cutaway would they know there was an injured jumper?


There are all sorts of what if's that could be thrown around in a situation like this. Any experienced jumper will make their own decision as to what they are going to do. As the S&TA of my dz here this is the info I pass on to our jumpers, if they want it. I'm not trying to get into a debate or anything like that, its just the feedback I am throwing your way from the scenario you gave.

Miami