Tandem Mains

[SkymonkeyONE 4]

Well, you simply don't have the problems of line-overs unless you are PRO packing your tandems anyway. In my opinion it is pure vanity to PRO pack anything bigger than about 150 square feet. Hey, I'll take that 90 degree out-of-the bag initial opening anytime over the longer pack times and line-over possibility of PRO packing. I get a good laugh out of the crazy hooks and stuff packers use just to wrassle a tandem into a coccoon.

I roll pack every tandem and every single student or demo main I have ever touched in the past (at least) 15 years. No problems whatsoever and MUCH faster packjobs.

Chuck

[AggieDave 6]

Chuck, if we can get our hands on a tandem while we're at Eloy, I would love to show you how I pro-pack a tandem, then you can rip the packjob apart and look at the lines and stuff. No hooks, no gimmicks, just pure packing... Seriously though, I'd like to show you how I was taught to pack tandems, you might even like it. Oh, I can btw, I can take a Sigma tandem and pack it from start to finish in about 12 minutes, with a nice soft on heading opening. No mals yet (knock on wood), but I only have around 200 tandem packs, so those numbers don't really speak for anything.

How long does it take you to flatpack a tandem? (not trying to be sarcastic or an ass with that question, I'm honestly curious).

--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."

[JohnnyD 0]

Quote

I roll pack every tandem and every single student or demo main I have ever touched in the past (at least) 15 years. No problems whatsoever and MUCH faster packjobs.

Chuck

Not familiar with "roll packing". Could you explain it, or direct me somewhere?

[billbooth 10]

Chuck is right. If you side pack your tandems, you will probably NEVER have a line over malfunction. Line overs were unheard of before the advent of pro packing. I've got data from literally hundreds of thousands of tandem jumps that shows that DZ's who pro pack have a much higher malfunction rate than those who side pack. It's hard to find a DZ that pro packs with a rate better than 1 in 500. Side pack DZ's are all over 1 in a 1,000. One went 7,500 jumps between malfunctions. While pro packing may be allright for small canopies, it is just not a good idea for tandem canopies because of the great difference between the "A" and "D" line lengths, especially on our older tandem canopies where this difference is more pronounced.

[SkymonkeyONE 4]

Thanks, Bill. I got my rating from Paul Rafferty and if HE doesn't PRO pack, then I sure as hell won't ever. He will also not use tube stoes.

Anyway, to answer your question, Dave: I can get the job done in ten minutes if I don't bullshit. I have jumped PRO packed tandems and have had both crisp and slow openings, but the thought of having a line-over makes me nuts; thus my propensity for packing my own tandems when given the chance.

I am one of those people that has a very hard time accepting the fact that malfunctions are just a way of life. This is totally false. I have one friend with TWELVE tandem reserve rides due to "packers" hooking him up with line-overs. This at Elberta, then Skydive Las Vegas. I asked him why he hadn't killed the packer and he said that it had happened so often that he got sort of fond of reserve rides! Unbelievable...... As previously stated: I will take that 90 degree out-of-the-bag opening anytime. On heading should not mean anything to a tandem master opening at 5000 feet in clean air.

Chuck

[riggerrob 643]

I am going to disagree with Bill Booth.
At least with Strong F-111 tandem mains, PRO packing worked better than side packing.
At Hemet, during the mid-1990s we were side packing (according to the factory instructions) Strong F-111 mains and getting hard openings with a dismal malfunction rate.
Then Iron Mike took over packing. Iron Mike always PRO packed and was a fanatic about keeping lines neat. Openings went from painful to firm and our malfunction rate dropped dramatically. Since half of our malfunctions had been caused by broken lines or torn canopies, the softer openings made a big difference.
When Iron Mike quit packing at Hemet, the new packers continued PRO packing, but the malfunction rate went back up almost to previous levels. All that is history because most Strong TMs have retired their F-111 canopies.
I also remember openings as being miserable on the F-111, PD-360 canopies installed in early Vector I Tandems.
At Pitt Meadows, we have standardized on Strong SET-400 mains. Most of us PRO pack and our malfunction rate is less than 1 per 1,000 jumps. I attribute most of the reduced malfunction rate to inherently softer openings on SET canopies.

[billbooth 10]

Rob;

I can't disagree with you. I don't get much data about malfunction rates on Strong canopies. However, I can state for a fact, as I did above, that pro packing any of my 6 different tandem canopies does vastly increase malfunction rates. This data comes from reports of hundreds of users, making hundreds of thousands of jumps, over a period of 15 years. Some people can get decent malfunction rates pro packing, but apparently, most can't.

[riggerrob 643]

Okay Bill,
We can be gentlemen and agree to disagree on this issue.
You say that Vector canopies have more malfunctions when PRO packed, while I say that Strong canopies have fewer malfunctions when PRO packed.
I attribute most of the improvement to better packers who keep lines neater, ergo softer openings.