Stock class swooping

[mattjw916 2]

The Fusion, Nitro, and Nitron all have stock HMA linesets, that's kind of an unfair discriminator for the "stock" class IMHO.

I would be interested in a non-x-brace class of swoop-comps in the future though and it would set the stage for the next-gen of swoopers to start working on their skills. It would be awesome to see some people going big under their Stilettos, Samurais, Crossfires, etc...

NSCR-2376, SCR-15080

[vdschoor 0]

There is something like that in the works for here in NorCal. The NorCal Classic will have a "standard 9 cell" class, I dont have all the specifics yet, but once the date has been set for this event I'll post an update.

I could only compete in 1 CPC competition this year, and I did so on my Sabre2 135. I was nowhere near what the big guys did on their Velos, but I didn't finish last.
The competition is all about hitting the gates, every single time. If you do that and one of the other competitors verticals on one.. you got them beat.

Consistency is key in competition, after that it's the ability to go far, fast, or stop...

[proswooper 2]

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I meant that only to imply how much fun it would be to get to compete with the best. No pipe dreams of winning here, just the chance to learn from the experience and see the results. I'd be really fascinated to see how much is possible with this type of equipment piloted by the likes of Jay or any of the factory team pilots.

jay is beatable. it will take training focus and money and the right canopy. pipe dream maybe, but it is an awsome feeling when you relise your dreams can come true with dedication.



i would love to see some sort of stock class, maybe hosted by p.d. then one by areodyne, then one by icarus. and on and on.

if the same pilots came to each one, im willing to bet you would see a trend on who was on top and who wasnt.

JAy is Far from unbeaten, he is on top of his game right now and a good friend of mine with a very unique prototype above his head.

[marks 0]

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I meant that only to imply how much fun it would be to get to compete with the best. No pipe dreams of winning here, just the chance to learn from the experience and see the results. I'd be really fascinated to see how much is possible with this type of equipment piloted by the likes of Jay or any of the factory team pilots.

jay is beatable. it will take training focus and money and the right canopy. pipe dream maybe, but it is an awsome feeling when you relise your dreams can come true with dedication.



i would love to see some sort of stock class, maybe hosted by p.d. then one by areodyne, then one by icarus. and on and on.

if the same pilots came to each one, im willing to bet you would see a trend on who was on top and who wasnt.

JAy is Far from unbeaten, he is on top of his game right now and a good friend of mine with a very unique prototype above his head.

but your under a badass wing there also paul.

now that i got 20 or so jumps on it i can see that.

paul, i got a certificate for you in my bag. jim gave it to me to give to you. and i think we need to discuss a few things about next year.

[Helmut 0]

"There is something like that in the works for here in NorCal. The NorCal Classic will have a "standard 9 cell" class, I dont have all the specifics yet, but once the date has been set for this event I'll post an update."

I think that is a great idea just a 9 cell class or just a non crossbraced class would be easy to do. Gotta be alot more of those pilots around that would love to compete and a nominal entrace fee.

[ianmdrennan 2]

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I think that is a great idea just a 9 cell class or just a non crossbraced class would be easy to do. Gotta be alot more of those pilots around that would love to compete and a nominal entrace fee.

You do no need a cross brace to compete. My wife did just fine under her Katana 107 loaded @ 1.3 In fact she beat a few of the x-braced boys who verticalled or had a crappy turn (she was doing 90's). Also Louddan was doing well under his Sabre2 135 at the CPC finals.

If you'll only compete in a non-xbraced division then maybe competition just isn't for you.

Remember - it's about learning - not winning.

Blues.
Ian

Performance Designs Factory Team

[vdschoor 0]

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You do no need a cross brace to compete. My wife did just fine under her Katana 107 loaded @ 1.3 In fact she beat a few of the x-braced boys who verticalled or had a crappy turn (she was doing 90's). Also Louddan was doing well under his Sabre2 135 at the CPC finals.

If you'll only compete in a non-xbraced division then maybe competition just isn't for you.

Remember - it's about learning - not winning.

Blues.
Ian

I agree with you, and that's what I mentioned earlier, I did alright (not good.. but alright) when I competed against the crossbraced canopies here on my Sabre2-135 in CPC competion #1 in NorCal.

The idea for a regular 9 cell canopy competition is to put a podium place well within reach for the people on 9 cell canopies.

A lot of people asked me why I was competing, cause "the guys with the velos will win anyways" and my answer to that was I just want to find out how well I am doing, for myself.. as a learning experience.

Putting a 1st place more within reach because everybody is flying similar canopies to yours will motivate more people to compete.

[marks 0]

this is a great idea, only if manufacturers bring out some demo's 10 of them and then mix and match them to wingloads.

it is too expensive for everyone to go out and get different canopies.

if you want to win "be the best" you have to compete against them. there is no way you can "win" "be the best" if you dont try and compete against them. there is no excuse for someone not wanting to compete except for they realize they dont have the experience "or" they dont want to get beat. you only get beat enough till you really start applying what you learn, and you wont learn if you dont compete.

hell, i dont ever practice. i just go to comps to learn. then i stay current by jumping every weekend. sometimes 2-3 times. and sometimes 10 times a weekend.

ive heard may many excuses, one of the true ones was. "i might as well just give you my money and not compete, your going to beat me anyway"

the peeps that you hear these sort of excusses from are the same one's you will see in last place, because they never tried harder and applyied what they learn at comps.

you know, there are quite a few of us that go head to head with pilots like jay mo, shannon, johnathan, hans, t.j. and the list goes on, maybee we all should just quit because they beat us anyways.

tell that to paul russouw! he beat them all in chicago, and got 2nd in the world just recently. guess what he beat them all, and he has beaten me more than once, and vice versa. it takes time dedication and money to travel, but it can be done. just start at the begining and work your way up.

the begining is the CPC. 500 jumps minimum. if you stay out one more year, you will be one year behind the guy or girl that didnt. and guess what guys, there is already 2 hottie girls with one year jump head start on you, and you better bet your ass they will be back next year. and they defianatly will be better.

[Widgeon 0]

You are completely missing the point of a competition circuit restricted to 9 cell canopies only. Some people just don't want to fly crossbraced canopies or aren't ready for them yet and would like to compete against others in a similar situation. To say that "oh well, you just gotta cowboy up and get your ass kicked while you learn" is a bunch of shit. Just because you had to, doesn't mean thats the way its got to be from now on. Swooping is constantly evolving. Records are being broken regularly. Hook turns weren't even allowed at most dropzones not that long ago. There are plenty of good pilots flying noncrossbraced designs that would be up for this who will be the one's to watch and learn from. If learning is what this is all about, than there it is. If safety is the concern, and that competitive swooping isn't for ametuers is the problem you have with this sort of division, then keep the present restrictions on jump numbers in place and have some kind of qualifying round as a preseason or exhibition meet. Why should canopy manufacturers need to provide demos for this sort of event????? Why would you want to compete with an unfamiliar wing? If time and resources aren't available to every canopy pilot out there to train and practice for the 9 cell events, than don't enter: simple. This class won't be for everyone and neither is the current CPC. Every other sport I can think of has a series of divisions for more even and fair competition. Auto racing, something you should be familiar with, has more classes for drag racing than I can think of. Pure street, Prostock, Pro Modified, Nitro/Funny Car, Top Fuel, etc. You don't see Richard Petty coming to Daytona International Speedway with his wife's Tahoe to drive against the $500,000 Dupont Chevrolet driven by Jeff Gordon. The piont to something like this will be to promote a more evenly competitive field where the piloting skills will be the difference. That doesn't mean I think I can beat you or Jim Slaton or Hans or Jay if I get my crossfire and you guys have to fly Spectres, it means we get to see how good the best swoopers on a 9 cell canopy are. There is obviously some interest in this and I just would really like to see it happen. Others have made mention that there will be these types of divisions in their regions next year, I would just not like to see it shot down here in Florida. I'm competing next year regardless. I don't plan on any space on the podium for me any time soon. I wouldn't feel like I 'beat' anyone if I placed and the only reason I won is because there were alot of verticals that day. When I get there, I'll be winning by the numbers, not because the best fucked up.

[vdschoor 0]

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this is a great idea, only if manufacturers bring out some demo's 10 of them and then mix and match them to wingloads.

it is too expensive for everyone to go out and get different canopies.

Mark, what I was referring to was a class for people that are currently flying regular 9 cells, people that are not ready for X-braced, not necessarily "downgrading" all the Velo pilots to regular 9 cells and have them compete.. I think that would be a recipe for disaster, you don't want to compete on a canopy you haven't jumped in a 1,2,3 or 5000 jumps..

Think of it in a way like Nationals for 4 way, there would be the Open (the Pros), Advanced (amateurs on X braced), and Intermediate (9 cell class)

This way people can start competing flying their Sabre2s, Pilots, Safire2s, Stilettos and Katanas and move up in the ranks as the experience grows.

It would definately be something that would bring the "younger swoopers" on board in the competitions earlier.
The minimum for CPC is 500 jumps, I think that is a very reasonable minimum, but someone with 500 jumps can be extremely intimidated by the distances and speeds set by the Velo pilots (which someone with 500 jumps has no business on)

Just an idea

Iwan

[AggieDave 6]

Ok, I want to derail some myths about what I was talking about.

Firstly, I wasn't thinking of this as a "beginners" swooping class, I saw this purely as an experienced swooper competition. Simply only on canopies that are "stock mid-range" canopies such as Sabre2s, Pilots and Safire2s.

Why? Simply to level the playing field. No RDS, no crazy wingloadings, just your basic semi-elliptical 9-cell at a "normal" wingloading for your weekend swooper, such as 1.6-ish.

The CPC, though, would be good to have a x-braced and non-xbraced classes within their normal open CPC competitions.

--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."

[CanuckInUSA 0]

If there is a demand for it in a region, I think having a traditional 9 cell class is a great idea. Since the CPC is the minor league system for the Pro Swoop Tour, this can be the minor league system for the CPC. The bottom line is that if someone wants to be a competitive swooper, they need to learn how to run the gates and personally I think people need to be running gates in the lower stress realms of practice before they run them in competition to avoid the dangers of object fixation.

Try not to worry about the things you have no control over

[raymod2 1]

I agree with Ian and Mark. Just get out there and compete. It's not like the CPC is so crowded right now that you need to split it off into multiple classes. Hell, if you competed in the Illinois region this year you would have gotten third place just for showing up at all the meets.

And I think that drawing a line between crossbraced canopies and non-crossbraced canopies is ridiculous. If you think you are going to double your swoop distance when you go out and buy your first crossbraced canopy you are in for a disappointment.

[marks 0]

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To say that "oh well, you just gotta cowboy up and get your ass kicked while you learn" is a bunch of shit

i didnt even read your whole post, just this. i will read it later, i already know your missunderstanding me from the conversation we had on the phone.

just get out there and do it, you will be surprized on how may of those cross braced canopies out there are not being flown properly. you will amazr yourself with who you do, and dont beat. the cpc is set up for you, so take advantage of it. it is somthing i didnt have and wish i did. mike, you will be surprized at how few crossed braced canopies are in your reigion next year.

sometimes you take the lunch money. sometimes you donate. but you always learn.

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I'm competing next year regardless. I don't plan on any space on the podium for me any time soon.

get to training mike, the difference between you and me is i know alot of the peeps thinking about competing here next year, you dont. if you dont think you have a chance, train a little and you will be VERY surprized.

[vdschoor 0]

I'm going to stop responding to all these.. it's either my language skills (with english being my second language) or people only read what they want to read, and skip through the rest.

Next season I'm competing in the CPC, in all competitions and not just one, on my Sabre2, cause I have no issue competing against crossbraced pocketrockets.

All I was saying is have a class for people that dont fly crossbraced yet.. like I said earlier, the way Nationals is set up for 4 way for example.

You can say just go ahead and go compete in 4 way open with your rookie team with an average of 6 points, who cares if you end up last cause there's no way you can beat Airspeed right now anyways..
It will not be motivating for a lot of people, that's why I mentioned the stock class.

Same goes for AggieDave's idea, I think it is an awesome idea.. the only issue I see here is that a lot of people that are currently flying velos, VXs and all that are super-uncurrent on those stock class canopies probably (of course with some exceptions.. I know Skymonkeyone flies his Sabre2 a lot.. )

Over and out

Iwan

[CanopyPiloting 0]

These topics, including weight categories and weight restrictions have been in development for two years and are on the agenda for the committee of the World Swooping Association. The WSA is the organization that will be responsibile for delivering changes to the USPA, IPC and FAI on canopy piloting issues worldwide. The WSA asks for your voice. If you want to add your comments on these topics please E-mail the committee at committee@WSAworldtour.com Hope to hear your feedback...Jim

[marks 0]

there are lots and lots of idea's. for the most part, peeps flying crossed braced canopies in the cpc, are for the most part, only inhibiting what they could be learning. just get in and compete. it will make you feel REALLY good about yourself when your ahead at the end of the season.

[chayes12 0]

You are right phree. You brought up a 9 cell class a year ago and we tried it in the first year of the Florida league. Alot of people sounded interested but not that many people showed up for the meet to compete in the 9 cell class. Loud Dan was one of them and he has continued to swoop. Maybe wrong time. I still think it is a good idea. I don't know how to make this a working link, (help) but this is the first post about the 9 cell class from last year. I would be willing to try it again next year in Florida if there is interest. Anyone want a 9 cell class this year?

http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=1309001;#1309001

[marks 0]

http://www.Dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=1309001;#1309001

[Widgeon 0]

PM sent.

[LoudDan 0]

The 9 cell class was, I thought, a geat idea, Chris got us some shwag from the sponsors, the pros payed a lot of attention to the three of us, we got a lot of great advise, and a lot of direction for improvement. I'd love to see Rory and Angela come back and spank that ass in the 9 cell class, they did it to me last year.

The three of us were truly beginners, but I was really surprised that a lot of the very experienced 9 cell pilots didn't turn out. Maybe they just didn't want to club the baby seals.

Coming soon to a bowl of Wheaties near you!!

[dharma1976 0]

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You are right phree. You brought up a 9 cell class a year ago and we tried it in the first year of the Florida league. Alot of people sounded interested but not that many people showed up for the meet to compete in the 9 cell class. Loud Dan was one of them and he has continued to swoop. Maybe wrong time. I still think it is a good idea. I don't know how to make this a working link, (help) but this is the first post about the 9 cell class from last year. I would be willing to try it again next year in Florida if there is interest. Anyone want a 9 cell class this year?

http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=1309001;#1309001

I would be interested if I lived in florida, but I guess I will jsut have to try to get something kicking up here in NY instead ;)

Dave

http://www.skyjunky.com

CSpenceFLY - I can't believe the number of people willing to bet their life on someone else doing the right thing.

[jeiber 0]

Count me in. Can't promise to make every meet, but I'll make as many as possible.

J

Shhh... you hear that sound? That's the sound of nobody caring!