Finally tested my ....

[speedy 0]

Gatorz today Real free fall speeds have been a rarity of late due to the RSS installed on my gear. There was that head down number for 10 secs with Tobi once, but otherwise hop n pop was the norm. Anyways today the tops were higher than 5000ft and they started at 3500ft, and I could freefall through that white stuff before pullin .
I was impressed, the Gatorz provided adequate wind protection while allowing me to look totally cool for the whole 14 sec freefall time.

So to my question...
Do you (per degree of turn) lose more height with a long carving approach, or with a snap quick turn?
Assume we are doing a 270° turn with the left front riser, also assume you are going to complete the turn. Quick or slow to reduce height loss?

Dave

Fallschirmsport Marl

[Spizzzarko 0]

Who care about the gatorz,

I find that they actually have a slight distortion with my vision. I do not wear them skydiving, and I have 20/15 uncorrected vision.

As for the turn question, you are going to lose more altitude the longer you turn.

[ianmdrennan 2]

Quote

As for the turn question, you are going to lose more altitude the longer you turn.

Yep.

Performance Designs Factory Team

[mgattini 0]

You will lose less altitude with a faster turn but you might not reach your temanal velocity.

[Martini 0]

A long carving front riser turn loses more height than a snap turn but the difference isn't always that great, it depends on the canopy, wingload, weight shift etc. Generally the hook turn consensus seems to be that if you're a little high in the hook then slow down the turn, if a little low the turn needs speeding up. This does NOT imply that doing a snap hook if you are close to the ground is a good idea!!!!! Even if you do no turn at all you will lose altitude, this seems to me to be why the theory works in practice; i.e. more time in the turn = more altitude loss. Most swoopers that are dialed in appear to gradually increase the turn rate from a medium carve to a snappy ending, this method allows the turn rate and dive angle to match the speed increase that comes with the diving turn. This is a simplification of a pretty complex dynamic though, Now if I could only do all this consistently I'd be really happy, every jump is different, conditions change constantly. The ability to deal with the changes instinctively makes great swoopers. I was two for five good swoops today, there's apparently some room for improvement.

Sometimes you eat the bear..............

[Spizzzarko 0]

OK,

Let's throw something out there for the sake of conversation. What about entering your turn a little high. You do that long carving turn, but your so high, that your turn rate is not fast enough to keep the canopy diving. You are getting to the point that your fronts are building up a lot of pressure, but you can still work them. WHAT DO YOU DO??????????

Do you remember those stupid choose your own ending books that you read in grade school?

A. Continue with the harness turn, and hope that you make the gates? Turn to page 92.

B. Continue with fronts untill the build up so much that you cannot continue the dive? Turn to page 38.

C. Snap the turn around the rest of the way with double fronts as fast as you can, and hope that it gives you the dive that you need to make the gates. Turn to page 51.

So let's talk about this rather than sunglasses in this forum. I know what I would do, what would you do?

[Martini 0]

D. Add a 360 to lose more altitude. (only if you're really, really high)

E. Use toggles to finish the swoop

F. Turn past the entry point and carve back in.

Actually I'm very interested in what you would do as neither A,B or C work well and E and F have limited value. A lot depends on how much too high you are, at what point in the turn you figure this out and other stuff.

Sometimes you eat the bear..............

[speedy 0]

Adding a 360 is preferable, but, if you are misjudging your entry by that much you probaly have no business doing a 360.

If you treat a 270 or a 360 as nothing more than a series of 45's in sequence, then at various points during the turn you can always lengthen out some of them to lose more height.

Dave

Fallschirmsport Marl

[superstu 0]

G. chop that last swoop up into a learning experience and realize that your set up was messed up and hopefully you know what altitude you turned at cause now you have to start a little lower.

Slip Stream Air Sports
Do not go softly, do not go quietly, never back down

[j3zz 0]

quote chop /quote

I cannot see how chopping is going to in anyway add to your swoopage, you might hit the gate, but I am not sure that it even counts, either way you're dead so the score would not help you.

No I am not being serious and this is probably not the place for it but come on it was to tempting

"Now I know why the birds fly"
Hinton Skydivers

[Martini 0]

S'ok Jeremy, the forums could all stand a little more humor. Interestingly though 270 plus degree swoops often start high enough to chop survivably although I wouldn't suggest that its a good idea. I agree with Stu that starting way too high ends up being a lesson in setting up properly. It aint easy and more experience is a good thing. Back to the premise here, I still slow my turns down if a little high and speed 'em up if a little low which is where I'd rather be. Not a lot low (been there a time or two) but enough to allow a snappy turn at a safe altitude. I still like to do snap 180's because they feel so good and give plenty of speed, they're just hard to set up at the right height because there is little margin for error. (even less if you jump a Stiletto or similar). My personal demon is that I just don't jump enough and many of my jumps are on my wingsuit canopy.

Sometimes you eat the bear..............