BPA canopy progression system unveiled.

[andyflylife 0]

I think that CP1 does mean that.. in theory. But i think its down to the CCI to inforse it using judgment. If your being sensible and not overstretching your capabilities, low experience level and safety margin i would say you will probably be ok. If someone of a similar jump number is trying to swoop, diving in head first and scaring everyone on the dropzone to death with his/her lack of skill then i think the CP1 enforcement will come into play.
In theory anyone swooping now, however good they are should require CP1 but again, common sense and discretion is forced to be used.
After all, these new guidelines are being introduced to try and stop people who haven't got the skill, having a go and killing themselves.

Hope i made sense!

"swooper 24/7, 365!"
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[yoink 321]

I think so... I'm in the same boat.

there may be some leeway for a little, but I wouldn't bet on it.

[mr2mk1g 10]

At the AGM the specific question "can you define a swoop" was asked. In answer we were told that for the purposes of these rules “swoop” was to mean any input into your canopy designed to increase it's forward speed – they specifically mentioned that would include double front riser landings.

Thus even your double front approaches are banned till you get your CP1.

Re carving for CP2 - they pointed out the rules were not finalised yet but that they would most likely be whatever the IPC required.

[Pendragon 1]

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Thus even your double front approaches are banned till you get your CP1.

I can't see why that is unreasonable. A potential exception to that approach might be for those "B" licence holders that are demo rated, as they have proven landing abilities to some degree, but that's only going to be a very small number.

In terms of what it means, I agree with Vicki's previous comment that it'll probably do little to prevent the irresponsible from trying anyway. However, would it make grounding of such individuals more likely?

As far as introducing all these qualifications and restrictions, is the CCI required then to endorse all people who are currently performing high-speed landings (like myself doing 90 degree front-riser turns) before April? How exactly will that work? What about people who get coached abroad?

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BASE #1182
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[spoons 0]

It's just in my situation it seems quite unfair however in a more broad sense it's a good idea.

As for giving CP1 to people who are demo rated - a way round the jump number limits would be good but just because you can land within a certain (albeit small) distance i feel does not prove you are ready to use speed inducing maneuvers on landing.

[livenletfly 0]

this is a step in the right direction. 3 cheers for all who put together this system. could someone explain what all these new letters stand for? im assuming ch= canopy handling, cp= canopy progression? ext.... cci? i dont want to assume id rather know.
also as a side note. i do think 200 jumps is a bit high for a simple double front landing. anyone else feel the same? just a year ago a jumper with 200 jumps was considered a fully proficient skydiver worthy of a D license!!!! now its the min. requirment to do a simple front riser dive. hmmm. ironic, no?

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[Jumpmunki 0]

CCI = Centre Chief Instructor
CP = Canopy Piloting
CH = Canopy Handling

BPA = British Parachute Association (who rock.. no arguments)

i think that as time has gone on the level of "woohaaa lets have it" among new jumpers has gone up......

i have been doing double and turning approaches for a while now, however i think maybe i should have learned in a different way rather than having a go myself.

i think 200 jumps for someone who has had no official canopy coaching is a good benchmark for starting HP landings.

however on the other hand i also think more training for those who want it should be at hand on canopy handling and progression, an actual single qualified person to go to and learn about what you would like to learn about rather than going round and asking a few different people.

[mr2mk1g 10]

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As for giving CP1 to people who are demo rated - a way round the jump number limits would be good but just because you can land within a certain (albeit small) distance i feel does not prove you are ready to use speed inducing maneuvers on landing.

I agree and yet I can see points to disagree with you. If you aren't fully aware of how each control input effects your flight, including front and rear riser input, you are unlikely to be able to achieve the level of accuracy involved in getting your demo clearance. (note I say "unlikely" - not simply “wont")

I know I made a lot of use of fronts, rears and toggles in getting cleared... the skills I learnt in the process of getting cleared translate very well to many methods of "speed inducing maneuvers” on landing. I feel there is a good crossover of many, if not all, of the skills between the two ratings.

However as I indicated, I agree with you. Demo clearance probably ought not be a trigger for grandfathering people into CP1... there's a lot to “swooping” that isn’t necessarily learnt prior to getting demo clearance. Besides - if you're good enough for CP1 then just demonstrate those skills and get the rating... if you're not good enough then you don't deserve the rating - regardless of what stickers you already have.

I suspect in practice a middle ground will happen, as is the way with these thigs. Demo cleared jumpers will still have to satisfy the CCI that they’re worthy of CP1 but will be given a degree of latitude in what they have to demonstrate before being awarded it.

[Jumpmunki 0]

i also think *call me radical if you want*

people shouldn't be grandfathered into any of the ratings..

i think there should be a grace period in which to demonstrate these skills under canopy before you get the sticker CH1 included ... for those who have just came out the back of the system and those who still don't know enough...

what do you guys think?

[SkymonkeyONE 4]

I agree with you, pardoning current tangible certifications/qualifications. Do you not have a PRO rating in the UK? I really don't know; that's why I am asking. That is how we in the US prove we are capable to jump demos. Likewise, a current PST/IPC canopy competitor is certainly qualified for what will be your CP2 rating. Note that I said "current." PST ratings are null if you go a year without competing.

[mr2mk1g 10]

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Do you not have a PRO rating in the UK?

Yes and no - we have "demo clearance" which is discussed above. The accuracy requirements are pretty much identical to the US PRO rating IIRC but there's no need to go into flags/smoke etc just to get the rating.