Katana to Velocity

[ManBird 0]

I hate actually looking for real advice on the web. Unfortnately, I know that there are several people on here who are actually qualified to answer a question I have, and no one at my DZ has a lot of experience with both of these canopies. As a disclaimer, I'm thinking about a Velocity next year, when I'll likely have 350 - 400 Katana flights, 5 years in the sport, 1,200+ jumps, and the money for a new canopy. With that said...

Has anyone out there transitioned from a Katana to a Velocity (or back), or have at least a couple hundred jumps on both? I flew a Xaos-27 98 a few times this last weekend. I usually fly a Katana 97, so everyone told me that it'd feel slower due to cross-bracing, wing efficiency, etc. It felt like a dog compared to my Katana. Would I be looking at the same issue with a Velocity 96? My exit weight is 192 (about 2:1 on the canopies mentioned).

My question is this: Will a Velocity 96 feel as fast/faster than my Katana 97, or should I be looking at a Velo that's a size down from my Katana? If you can't advise, then maybe just share your experience. If you have flown these quite a bit or made this transition, I'd appreciate some feedback. Please just PM, as giving any sort of advice publicly generally results in a flamefest, especially in matters of canopy transition. FREAKS!

Thanks,
Steve

"¯"`-._.-¯) ManBird (¯-._.-´"¯"

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[Jimbo 0]

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Please just PM, as giving any sort of advice publicly generally results in a flamefest, especially in matters of canopy transition. FREAKS!

Don't keep it in PMs. The forums are here for a reason and it's likely that there are others with similar questions. Hell, I'd like to see the responses because I find it interesting. I'm sure that others would also.

-
Jim

"Like" - The modern day comma
Good bye, my friends. You are missed.

[ianmdrennan 2]

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Will a Velocity 96 feel as fast/faster than my Katana 97, or should I be looking at a Velo that's a size down from my Katana?

All depends what your goals are. For competition my advice (for a velo) is go as big as you can while it's still fun to fly. For me that was the 90/96 sizes. 84 was a blast and 103 was a dog (I felt). If you're going to want to have some fun and still be competative a 96 loaded a 2.1 is a nice canopy choice IMO. Also I don't think you'll find much difference in the arc of that canopy compared to the 97, just the speed.

Blues,
Ian

Performance Designs Factory Team

[ManBird 0]

Thanks, Ian. We have almost the same exit weight. When I went Sabre2 107 to Katana, I didn't feel much difference in speed of flight -- it felt doggy. If history repeats itself, a few hundred jumps from now I might find myself on a Velo 90 or 96+weight. I should have weights, anyway.

Either way, I'm looking at 2.1:1 to 2.2:1 when I finally get a Velo (or other X-brace, but most likely a Velo). For a 2.13:1 WL, it's either a Velo 90, or Velo 96 with 10 lbs of weight. I guess I'll find out which I like more next year.

FYI, I when I got my Sabre2 107 last year, I made a goal to get on a different shape and/or size (XF2 was my top candidate back then) after at least one year and at least 300 jumps. Mission accomplished (with an extra 50 jumps). It went so well, I'm pretty sure I'll be able to pull off the same one-year plan again.
So, at least 1,200 jumps before owning a cross-braced canopy loaded at over 2:1. Like two years ago, this was considered aggressive by most people. Nowadays, I have a lot of people telling me I'm a wuss for waiting so long. Weird.

"¯"`-._.-¯) ManBird (¯-._.-´"¯"

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[ianmdrennan 2]

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Either way, I'm looking at 2.1:1 to 2.2:1 when I finally get a Velo (or other X-brace, but most likely a Velo). For a 2.13:1 WL, it's either a Velo 90, or Velo 96 with 10 lbs of weight. I guess I'll find out which I like more next year.

I ended up with the 90 cause it was more fun to fly and I wear 8 pounds of weight. Given the same choices again I'd go with the 96 and more weight for better distance and it was still a boatload of fun to fly.

Edit: Jay works on keeping his wingloading at 2.1 just FYI. Since I dropped mine from 2.3 there's been a marked improvement in my distance.

Blues,
Ian

Performance Designs Factory Team

[ManBird 0]

Cool. I've received several PMs, and the consensus seems to be 96 + weights. Somewhere down the line, I might want something smaller just for fun and going fast, as well as being on the other end of wingsuit/canopy RW.

Thanks for sharing your experiences!

"¯"`-._.-¯) ManBird (¯-._.-´"¯"

Click

[ianmdrennan 2]

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Somewhere down the line, I might want something smaller just for fun and going fast

Yeah I hear ya. I've always said if I had a couple of grand to waste (yeah right!) I'd get a 75 or something teeny for purely the WOOOT factor.

Of course that isn't going to happen anytime soon so I try and stick with choices that allow me to be competitive (other than suckage piloting ) and still enjoyable for everyday jumping.

Blues,
Ian

Performance Designs Factory Team

[ManBird 0]

If I had unlimited funds, I'd have four rigs:

1. My everyday wingsuit rig, basically what I have now (KA97, PDR126, Wings)
2. A pond rig (VE96, PDR126, ????)
3. Tiny rig (VE??, PDR106, ????)
4. Low deployment wingsuit rig (Fox 185, PDR193, Mirage or Vector (for flatness))

That's not even mentioning BASE gear. I'd Skyhook them all. And maybe throw a Cypres on rig 1. Now to dig up like $18,000 of expendable funds. Hmmmm... to dream.

"¯"`-._.-¯) ManBird (¯-._.-´"¯"

Click

[CanuckInUSA 0]

Hey guys if you want fast landings without buying a new canopy, come visit us here in Colorado. Just be prepare to complete your flare as you're going to lose lift a lot sooner than you normally would. If the PST ever came to Colorado (or Skydive NM in Belan) you know all of the speed records would be shattered. But the distance records would remain intact.

Try not to worry about the things you have no control over

[ianmdrennan 2]

It'd be a unique experience that's for sure
Blues,
Ian

Performance Designs Factory Team

[ManBird 0]

I thought about this, too. A 96 with weights would be a good choice down here at 300'. When I go to jump at higher MSLs, I can just ditch the weights and not scare myself, as I might on canopy loaded at 2.2 or greater.

"¯"`-._.-¯) ManBird (¯-._.-´"¯"

Click

[CanuckInUSA 0]

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and not scare myself

Just don't do a downwind landing through the swoop course with no fear. I learned that lesson earlier this summer. The downwind part wasn't the problem. The no fear part was. I ran it out, but hurt my foot in the process and missed a good months worth of jumping. And I'm not jumping a cross-braced canopy loaded at 2.0 or greater.

Try not to worry about the things you have no control over

[CanuckInUSA 0]

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I wonder what the turn altitude would be if I typically turn around 700 ft...900?

I can't answer this as I don't jump a cross-braced canopy. But there are a few people in the state (some of whom do post here) who could. It's my understanding that you guys on your cross-braced canopies have more control as to how much you want your canopies to dive. But unless you've got your shit dialed in (which most PST qualified people should ) I'm sure you wouldn't crater. You might want to take a few jumps to slowly build up to first, before you go big.

Try not to worry about the things you have no control over

[ianmdrennan 2]

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You might want to take a few jumps to slowly build up to first, before you go big.

Most definately, a given at any new DZ, but even more important at a MSL so drastically different from my home.

I'll have to make it out to CO sometime for some jumpy jumpy
Blues,
Ian

Performance Designs Factory Team

[Spizzzarko 0]

I'm about 900 or a little abve that with the velo 103, and I'm bringing it higher and higher but making the turn rate slower each successive jump for a 270 turn to final. I do a 270 at about 800 on the vx 98 as it doesn't lose as much altitude in the dive, as the velo does.