DJL 235 #1 October 22, 2002 Has there been any testing on pilot chutes with hackeys attached at the same point as the bridle or in line with the bridle? Speculation would be as follows: 1. The hackey on the bottom creates a small burble within the pilot chute. (But couldn't be that much more than what the body is creating another 8 ft down. 2. Hackeys for anything other than BASE or CRW would have to be off-center; attached at the same point as the bridle, so that no bridle would be exposed to the airstream. Would create a little spin or additional flop in PC trailing behind canopy. 3. May interfere with PC collapse systems. 4. Would cause jumper at terminal to turn or roll if held in hand for too long. 5. If released to CLOSE to body may initially open but then get caught in burble. 6. Could cause bag to not open in line with jumper since PC held at arm's length to side of jumper would already be fully open and once it was released would travel straight up and open pin at an angle creating line twists. 7. More radical spinning and tumbling as main opens (if its hackey is attached at same point as bridle see #2) increasing likelyhood of PC over the nose or entangling with slider. I know the status quo is an effective method so let's leave that point out of the discussion. I think through my brainstorming here I've brought up some points that would prove an off-center mounted hackey an undesirable option. Still, does anyone have any experience with this? Any 'in-line-with-bridle-hackey-at-bottom' PC's available for BASE or CRW rigs? THANKS, Doug"I encourage all awesome dangerous behavior." - Jeffro Fincher Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
weid14 0 #2 October 22, 2002 a pull out system would be close to what you are describing, no? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhreeZone 20 #3 October 22, 2002 > Any 'in-line-with-bridle-hackey-at-bottom' PC's available for BASE or CRW rigs? Every thing you wrote sounds a lot like a pull out system. Only difference it its direct pin instead of indirect pin pulling.Yesterday is history And tomorrow is a mystery Parachutemanuals.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TomAiello 26 #4 October 22, 2002 I'm not sure I'm following you, but... Quote2. Hackeys for anything other than BASE or CRW would have to be off-center; attached at the same point as the bridle, so that no bridle would be exposed to the airstream. Would create a little spin or additional flop in PC trailing behind canopy. Why would a hackey handle for BASE be in a different location from skydiving? In general, handles are only used on terminal BASE PC's. Hackeys are generally not recommended for BASE, due to a potential to cause PC hesitation or choke-off. Still, if you do use a hackey handle for BASE (very few people do that now, especially after the fatality in Switzerland a few weeks ago), I can't see why you'd put it in a different location from a skydiving PC handle. Quote4. Would cause jumper at terminal to turn or roll if held in hand for too long. The jumper doesn't have to be at terminal. See fatality #17 on the list at http://juliabell.home.att.net/. This jumper died as the result of PC inflation at 3 seconds causing unstable deployment, followed by line twists and object strike. Quote5. If released to CLOSE to body may initially open but then get caught in burble. I am personally convinced that this sort of hesitation in the burble was the primary cause of the most recent BASE fatality. QuoteAny 'in-line-with-bridle-hackey-at-bottom' PC's available for BASE rigs? Nope. I can't see how they would be a good idea. Maybe I'm misunderstanding what you are driving at, though.-- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DJL 235 #5 October 22, 2002 QuoteHackeys are generally not recommended for BASE, due to a potential to cause PC hesitation or choke-off. It was actually your comment regarding PC hesitation w/ BASE on another thread that made me think of this. I was trying to remember if I'd even seen a hackey on the BASE PC's I've seen only on video. Thanks for the replies. Sounds like all is well in the world of PC's and hackeys. CRW would be the only application for this supposed invention but really, who cares. PEACE, Doug"I encourage all awesome dangerous behavior." - Jeffro Fincher Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tombuch 0 #6 October 22, 2002 A hackey might not be the best deployment handle. We had an incident a few months ago involving two very experienced and current skydivers doing some canopy proximity flying. As one parachute passed infront and slightly to the side of the other, the trailing hackey was entangled in the lines of the second parachute. The result was a nasty wrap. The investigation that followed clearly showed the cause being lines of one parachute tangled with the hackey of the other. Tom BuchananTom Buchanan Instructor Emeritus Comm Pilot MSEL,G Author: JUMP! Skydiving Made Fun and Easy Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
