AFF Instructor Gear

[ChromeBoy 0]

What are the requirements when it comes to AFF Instructors gear. Can you use a closed face helmet or does if have to be open faced?
ParaChat anytime!

[quade 4]

NOT that I'm an instructor, but . . .
Open faced is prefered. I believe it's required at some DZ's by their own policies.
It's really diffificult to communicate facial expressions through a full face. Difficult to stick your tongue out. Difficult to perform a kiss pass.
I also believe it's prefered to wear clear goggles for the purposes of eye contact.
quade
http://futurecam.com

[SkymonkeyONE 4]

I personally use an open face helmet (BoneHead Mindwarp)for the reasons that Paul listed, plus the fact that it is preached in the course. Namely, you want your student to be able to read your facial expressions, and also that you can scream commands at them from close range and they can DEFINITELY hear you. I have buddies that don't give a shit about this,though, and always JM in their bug hat (full-face helmet) because they have been kicked in the face too often by flailing students.
Chuck
My webpage HERE

[markbaur 0]

There are no helmet requirements for AFF-Is. Instructors choose the level of protection they like: full-face (best protection), open-face (better communication), frap hat or no helmet (easier to put in a gear bag). The trend is toward full-face.
Mark Baur
AFF Designated Evaluator

[Hooknswoop 19]

Wear an open face at the course, then whatever you prefer for the real thing.. Do not dis-agree or even express your opinion at the course unless it is the same as the Evalutator's/director's. Realize that the AFFCC is different from real-life AFF. I have yet to see an AFF dive that is like the course, from prep, to how the actual dive is conducted, to the de-brief.
I personnally wear a full face. I have asked students if they could see my face and read expressions, and they all have said they could (w/ a factory diver). I have taken a nice shot to the chin from a student's foot on opening, I think the helemt made a significate difference between seeing a star or two and being stunned/unconscious.
Hook

[riggerrob 643]

PFF Instructors need:
a main large enough to "land out"
a reserve large enough to "land out"
a Cypres
gloves
1 or more visual altimeters
1 or more audible altimeters
Which brings us to the question of where to mount your audible altimeter and the whole helmet debate. Leather hats are hopelessly obsolete. Some type of hard-shell helmet is mandatory for survival.
I usually wear a Protec because it is comfortable and cheap. A Bonehead Mindwarp or the latest G3 would be ideal, but I can't afford them.
On dives that might result in a kick in the head (ie. early release dives) I wear a full face helmet. My full-face is actually an old Hansen camera helmet without a visor. It leaves my lips free for conversation, but its main function is to protect my jaw when I have to dock on the spinning student from hell.

[Hooknswoop 19]

The benifits of using a small canopy is getting to the radio to talk your student down quicker.
Hook

[PhreeZone 20]

Thats what the third person on the ground with the radio is for.... If I was a AFF-I there is no way I would jump a canopy I was'nt totally comfortible with just to beat the student down faster. The difference between a couple of seconds is'nt a big enough difference that I would put my neck on the line jumping something I was'nt capible of landing off with.
If once you start down the dark path, forever will it dominate your destiny, consume you it will....

[billvon 3,111]

>What are the requirements when it comes to AFF Instructors gear.
Only unusual requirement is the requirement for a visually accessible altimeter.
>Can you use a closed face helmet or does if have to be open faced?
Should be open, but there's no rule. An open face helmet allows better nonverbal communication (facial expressions tell a lot) and allows better emergency verbal communications (i.e. yelling at them to arch, or to climb back in if the reserve side leaves prematurely.) You may get kicked more often, but dodging is just something you learn after a while.
-bill von

[Hooknswoop 19]

A qualified third person on the ground w/ the radio is a luxury I haven't been afforded yet. That would be nice though. I didn't say jump a canopy you are not comfortable with landing off. I am comfortable landing off w/ my main and/or reserve.
I have watched a student land at almost the same time as the instructor, and the student landed before the instructor ever got to the radio. I get to the radio quick, in time to make sure they are headed to their holding area and remind them what canopy exercises they are supposed to be practicing on that jump.
Hook

[billvon 3,111]

>The benifits of using a small canopy is getting to the radio to talk your
>student down quicker.
One benefit of a larger canopy is that you can let it fly in brakes for a little while while you haul out the radio, get him oriented and turned towards the DZ, and then stow the radio and land. That's one reason I didn't get a Diablo five years ago - it was unstable with brakes stowed, and the last thing I needed was a canopy winding up while I was trying to get a student turned around and headed back to the DZ.
-bill von

[Hooknswoop 19]

"One benefit of a larger canopy is that you can let it fly in brakes for a little while while you haul out the radio, get him oriented and turned towards the DZ, and then stow the radio and land. That's one reason I didn't get a Diablo five years ago - it was unstable with brakes stowed, and the last thing I needed was a canopy winding up while I was trying to get a student turned around and headed back to the DZ."
Very true, but I wear a factory diver and can't talk on the radio under canopy.
Hook

[Jessica 0]

Quote

An open face helmet allows better nonverbal communication (facial expressions tell a lot)

One of my favorite visuals in my canon of memories is Mandy's smiling face on my AFFs. Every time I did a circle of awareness, I couldn't help but relax at her huge grin, and smile back as I obeyed her hand signals.

[ChromeBoy 0]

Thanks for all of the information guys. Sounds to me like one should have both a closed and open helmet, audible and a regular altimeter and clear goggles. Also, the canopy should be fast enough to get you to the ground before the student but also be big enough for ones experience in case they have to land off.
A couple of other questions.
1. What type of suit do you generally wear for instruction?
2. What is the decision making process on whether or not the student wears a weight vest / belt?
ParaChat anytime!

[markbaur 0]

Quote

Wear an open face at the course, then whatever you prefer for the real thing.

I disagree. Don, Rick, and Glenn all wear full-face helmets. I don't know about Billy. I've helped with 5 AFFCCs in the past year, and nobody was graded on headgear or facial expressions in freefall.

Quote

Do not disagree or even express your opinion at the course unless it is the same as the Evaluator's/director's.

I disagree. If a candidate has a better way of doing things, I want to hear about it. How will I get better otherwise?

Quote

I have yet to see an AFF dive that is like the course.

Neither have I. What changes would you like to see?
Mark

[Hooknswoop 19]

"Wear an open face at the course, then whatever you prefer for the real thing.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I disagree. Don, Rick, and Glenn all wear full-face helmets. I don't know about Billy. I've helped with 5 AFFCCs in the past year, and nobody was graded on headgear or facial expressions in freefall."
Don was the CC at my course ans specifically recommended an open face helmet, he wore an open face at the course. During a de-brief, he mentioned to my partner, (he wore a full face), that "because of the full face helmet I couldn't hear you".
"Do not disagree or even express your opinion at the course unless it is the same as the Evaluator's/director's.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I disagree. If a candidate has a better way of doing things, I want to hear about it. How will I get better otherwise?"
That is great, but my experience was different. Suggestions were used as an opportunity to ridicule a candidate. I kept my mouth shut, believe it or not :-)
"Neither have I. What changes would you like to see?"
A course based in reality. What I was trained to do at the AFFCC is not how real AFF is done.
The course I attended used the old point system, 6 dives 0-4 points per dive. It was possible to "kill" 3 students, 3 zeros, and then score fours on three dives and still pass. But if you scored three 4's, that proved you could really fly. Today's system allows a candidate to marginally pass two dives and kill the third student and still pass, never demostrating a high skill level, and actually demonstrating a below standard flying. There are a lot of excellent evaluators out therre working to prevent this from happening, but DZs want more instructors.
I would like to see a mentoring program, where after passing the AFFCC, the new AFFI must make 25 +/- jumps with an experienced AFFI before being signed off to take solo AFF students.
I would like to see a bi-annual eval jump w/ an evaluator keep an AFFI rating current.
I would like to see the "I participated in a JM/I seminar at:____________on_____________" either taken off the annual membership renewal or actual seminars taking place at DZ's. In 7 years of jumping and 6 years of instructing I have never even heard of a JM/I seminar. Everyone pencil whips that section of the renewal.
Sorry for the rant
Hook

[rgoper 0]

**Sorry for the rant**
Hook:
not a rant, but some valuable ideas which could be utilized to "keep everybody on they're toes" Richard
"Gravity Is My Friend"

[bodypilot1 0]

Chromeboy,
You may want to check at your home DZ if there are any, but I can tell you from experience (AFF 1994) that you will wish you had a full faced helmet on some of your jumps if you ever get a student that spins! The feet and elbows start to come around fast at times and it's a good idea to have as much protection as possible, to avoid getting knocked out when you have to tackle them, and have to rely on the one thing a SMART AFF instuctor should have, and thats a Cypress. You can never tell how good a student will fly untill you jump with them. It's nice for a student to see an Instructor smiling at them, but use a open faced after you have seen how they fly!

[GroundZero 0]

spinning....
one hand out and after the sound of.... er... what is it....
Remember the card in your bicycle spokes? When the whir slows to a thump....thump.... you grab and do whatever....
Shit I love AFF!
I love those student smiles, that's what it's all about!
Chris

[eames 0]

Quote

I would like to see a mentoring program, where after passing the AFFCC, the new AFFI must make 25 +/- jumps with an experienced AFFI before being signed off to take solo AFF students.

USPA rated coaches can already take category G and H students solo, and nowadays there is a 10 coach jump requirement on the AFF proficiency card. So it's really taken care of at a lower level.
Jason

[riggerrob 643]

Jumping a tiny canopy just so you can land before your student to radio him down is a lame excuse. You should jump a mid-sized canopy, and spiral as if the devil was after you to land before the student.
Secondly, you do not need a full-blown AFFI to talk down students. Any Instructor A (Canadian term) who has demonstrated competence at talking down first jump students should be able to talk down an AFF student.
Thirdly, I found that publically dis-agreeing with an AFF Course Conductor established an adversarial relationship that I was never able to over come. It does not matter that my attitude towards hand-deploy pilotchutes eventually became standard policy at many American DZs, that adversarial relationship prevented me from earning an AFF rating.
The adversarial relationship was not totally the course conductor's fault. In childhood I never learned how to trust authority figures, and all those weird head games carried over into adulthood.
I later earned a CSPA PFF Instructor rating, but that is another story.

[billvon 3,111]

>I would like to see a mentoring program, where after passing the AFFCC, the
> new AFFI must make 25 +/- jumps with an experienced AFFI before being
> signed off to take solo AFF students.
This was effectively implemented at my DZ, and I think at most DZ's around the country. My first 10-12 AFF's were reserve side level I's. After that I moved on to main side level I's and main side level III's (complete release for MS in our program.) Then I started on level 7's. It wasn't until I had 50 AFF's or so that I started on the 'hard' levels (4 and 5.)
>I would like to see the "I participated in a JM/I seminar
>at:____________on_____________" either taken off the annual membership
> renewal or actual seminars taking place at DZ's. In 7 years of jumping and 6
> years of instructing I have never even heard of a JM/I seminar. Everyone pencil
> whips that section of the renewal.
We have a 10 minute - 1 hour meeting every Sat morning where we go over operational and safety issues. The 10 minute meetings are just reviews of what happened last week, new procedures, and comments from I's - the 1 hour meetings are on topics like "what's in the trauma box" or "how to handle the new otter."
Whenever I renew I just use the date of the last meeting - so at least some of us don't pencil whip it.
-bill von

[billvon 3,111]

>You may want to check at your home DZ if there are any, but I can tell you from
> experience (AFF 1994) that you will wish you had a full faced helmet on some of
> your jumps if you ever get a student that spins!
Don't stick your hand (or your head) in the fan. Stop rapidly spinning students with your legs. They're larger and stronger, and can take more impact.
>It's nice for a student to see an Instructor smiling at them, but use a open
>faced after you have seen how they fly!
I think that open face helmet might just _prevent_ a few spins to begin with. I've never gotten hit by a spinning student (1200+ AFF jumps) but have gotten hit on exit and at pull time. Since I'm getting paid to teach them, and an open face helmet helps me to do that, I consider it my job to avoid those hits without resorting to a full face.
-bill von

[billvon 3,111]

>1. What type of suit do you generally wear for instruction?
Depends on the student. You need suits that will let you fall at the speed you need to fall at. I've used everything from my 4-way suit to a baggy student XXL suit for extra drag.
>2. What is the decision making process on whether or not the student wears
>a weight vest / belt?
For me it's easy - never. We are within 1 mile of a lake, and the risk of a student drowning while trying to take off a weight vest/belt is too high. In addition, weight vests increase loading of the parachute and increase impact force when they land, both of which might contribute to injury.
-bill von

[bodypilot1 0]

Thank you for you opinion Bill, But it is just that, "YOUR OPINION". His question was" what are the requirements" and every Instructor has their own......
>You wrote;
>I think that open face helmet might just _prevent_ a few >spins to begin with.
Tell us all in what way does an open faced helmet have anything to do with "preventing" a spin? The only thing a full faced helmet prevents is being able to stick your tonuge out at them for legs out, or do you just yell at them also?
>You wrote;
>I've never gotten hit by a spinning student (1200+ AFF >jumps) but have gotten hit on exit and at pull time.
We all have gotten hit on exit and at pull time, but if you have never had to agressively stop a student that is going into a rapid spin, then I'd say you have been pretty lucky I guess huh? I have had a few over the (1500+ AFF jumps)
>You wrote;
>Since I'm getting paid to teach them, and an open face >helmet helps me to do that, I consider it my job to avoid >those hits without resorting to a full face.
We all concider our job as an AFF Instructor a VERY serious one, and the safety of our students and ourselves shouldn't be taken lightly. We want to see the student progress and enjoy what we love, and also jump for a long time and being safe keeps you able to do that!
Again, thanks for your opinion!
Ed