DB Cooper

[olemisscub 547]

14 hours ago, FLYJACK said:

There is speculation and there is speculation..  what you said has zero to back it up.

What I am saying is not proven but has some support.

Not the same.

What on earth??

Cooper jumped in Clark County, Washington. That is an actual fact. I'm the one who has the fact based speculation here. Speculating about WHY he jumped WHERE he jumped is totally different from wondering why he DIDN'T jump somewhere he DIDN'T jump. 

You've taken one decision that Cooper made (going from asking for stairs lowered after takeoff to requesting stairs lowered at takeoff) and have spun it into an imaginative scenario. And I'm not here even arguing against because I think it actually may have some merit. 

Totally strange to accuse me of being MORE speculative than you when I'm speculating about WHY he jumped WHERE WE KNOW he jumped. You're compiling speculation (why did he change his mind on the stairs) upon speculation (why DIDN'T he jump further south). All of your deductions about how he was dressed and him looking Latin, reasonable though they are, are still wholly speculative. It's far, far more speculative than trying to figure out why he jumped where he DID jump. 

[FLYJACK 771]

This is so simple..

Why would Cooper demand a flight to Mexico with no stops in US.. if it was impossible and would be renegotiated. He must have believed the plane could make Mexico when he made the demand.

Either he is an idiot or his "fly dirty" demand was miscommunicated. 

WE know he had aviation experience so it is very unlikely he was wrong. He was knowledgeable about the fuelling procedure.

So, his demand was miscommunicated.

Now, rethink the entire hijacking with that in mind. Everything falls into place.

Initially, he wanted to fly to Mexico. 

He would have given path instructions in the air and airstairs lowered in the air.

When Reno was negotiated he decided to jump as soon as he could to avoid being on the plane at Reno.

His jump at 8:11 was not a targeted LZ by time or place. He had no input or prior knowledge of the planes location/path.

 

[olemisscub 547]

1 hour ago, FLYJACK said:

Ryan, you have the tie clip on the wrong side.

happy?

 

[olemisscub 547]

2 minutes ago, FLYJACK said:

This is so simple..

Why would Cooper demand a flight to Mexico with no stops in US.. if it was impossible and would be renegotiated. He must have believed the plane could make Mexico when he made the demand.

Either he is an idiot or his "fly dirty" demand was miscommunicated. 

WE know he had aviation experience so it is very unlikely he was wrong. He was knowledgeable about the fuelling procedure.

So, his demand was miscommunicated.

Now, rethink the entire hijacking with that in mind. Everything falls into place.

Initially, he wanted to fly to Mexico. 

He would have given path instructions in the air and airstairs lowered in the air.

When Reno was negotiated he decided to jump as soon as he could to avoid being on the plane at Reno.

His jump at 8:11 was not a targeted LZ by time or place. He had no input or prior knowledge of the planes location/path.

 

Why wouldn't he have hijacked a plane closer to the Mexican border? That's my main issue with this theory. 

[FLYJACK 771]

1 minute ago, olemisscub said:

What on earth??

Cooper jumped in Clark County, Washington. That is an actual fact. I'm the one who has the fact based speculation here. Speculating about WHY he jumped WHERE he jumped is totally different from wondering why he DIDN'T jump somewhere he DIDN'T jump. 

You've taken one decision that Cooper made (going from asking for stairs lowered after takeoff to requesting stairs lowered at takeoff) and have spun it into an imaginative scenario. And I'm not here even arguing against because I think it actually may have some merit. 

Totally strange to accuse me of being MORE speculative than you when I'm speculating about WHY he jumped WHERE WE KNOW he jumped. You're compiling speculation (why did he change his mind on the stairs) upon speculation (why DIDN'T he jump further south). All of your deductions about how he was dressed and him looking Latin, reasonable though they are, are still wholly speculative. It's far, far more speculative than trying to figure out why he jumped where he DID jump. 

Absolutely in this case to claim an accomplice or transportation...

All speculation is not created equal...

There is nothing to indicate those things ZERO. it is completely made up.

My theories have a foundation have logical inferences with support,,,  they are not completely made up.

Not even close.. 

[olemisscub 547]

1 minute ago, FLYJACK said:

Absolutely in this case to claim an accomplice or transportation...

All speculation is not created equal...

There is nothing to indicate those things ZERO. it is completely made up.

My theories have a foundation have logical inferences with support,,,  they are not completely made up.

Not even close.. 

what is made up about him jumping in Portland? I'm trying to explain why he may have jumped in Portland i.e. that's where his car was (hello Robb Heady) or where his accomplice was waiting for him (hello McCoy). 

 

[FLYJACK 771]

Just now, olemisscub said:

Why wouldn't he have hijacked a plane closer to the Mexican border? That's my main issue with this theory. 

He didn't need to..

but, I believe/theorize 305 was not his primary target.. His primary target landed in Portland earlier that day probably UAL..  He aborted that one for some reason and selected 305. I wouldn't be surprised if he had luggage left on that first flight.

[FLYJACK 771]

1 minute ago, olemisscub said:

what is made up about him jumping in Portland? I'm trying to explain why he may have jumped in Portland i.e. that's where his car was (hello Robb Heady) or where his accomplice was waiting for him (hello McCoy). 

 

I am criticizing your claim that it was because he had an accomplice or transportation,,, completely made up.

ZERO indication of that...  in fact, the evidence goes against this.. he had no input or foreknowledge of the planes location.

He landed about 25 miles North of Portland.

[olemisscub 547]

3 minutes ago, FLYJACK said:

I am criticizing your claim that it was because he had an accomplice or transportation,,, completely made up.

 

So me theorizing that his car was parked in the area where his flight took off from or that an accomplice was somewhere in the area where the flight took off from is MORE speculative than this:

but, I believe/theorize 305 was not his primary target.. His primary target landed in Portland earlier that day probably UAL..  He aborted that one for some reason and selected 305. I wouldn't be surprised if he had luggage left on that first flight.

Edited June 7 by olemisscub

[FLYJACK 771]

18 minutes ago, olemisscub said:

So me theorizing that his car was parked in the area where his flight took off from or that an accomplice was somewhere in the area where the flight took off from is MORE speculative than this:

but, I believe/theorize 305 was not his primary target.. His primary target landed in Portland earlier that day probably UAL..  He aborted that one for some reason and selected 305. I wouldn't be surprised if he had luggage left on that first flight.

Absolutely,,,

The evidence does not support your idea,  it is very poor.. there is nothing to support this.

Cooper landed 25 miles N of Portland.. he had no foreknowledge or input of the planes location... that contradicts your "speculation".. You know this.

What don't you understand.

Speculation is necessary but bad speculation is a distraction.

He didn't even actually jump near PDX.

 

I also have three incompatible theories for TBAR, all fit the evidence.. clearly not all can be true.

 

Good, speculation needs to fit the evidence (yours did not)

be reasonable, plausible and based on logical inference.

 

Edited June 7 by FLYJACK

[olemisscub 547]

11 minutes ago, FLYJACK said:

 

What don't you understand.

The way your mind works lol

[FLYJACK 771]

12 minutes ago, olemisscub said:

The way your mind works lol

That is for sure. I apply Bayesian analysis, maybe you should try it.

You still can't back up your claim or explain the case incompatibility.

It is just made up nonsense.

Edited June 7 by FLYJACK

[Robert99 60]

11 hours ago, FunnyStuff said:

Aft stair light is on at 7:40 and jump is 8:13 at the absolute earliest. What does he do for 33 minutes if he's not waiting for a targeted LZ?

The FBI was preparing 302s a day or two after the hijacking that clearly, plainly, and correctly stated that 8:11 PST was the best estimate for Cooper's jump time.

This jump time puts him practically overhead of Tena Bar and is a perfect match for the flight path that the airliner was following.

The flight path was exhaustively analyzed on this site about 15 years ago and nothing has happened since that changes that analysis.

Of course, everything on this site, especially the speculations, get recycled about every two years.

[georger 268]

2 hours ago, FLYJACK said:

This is so simple..

Why would Cooper demand a flight to Mexico with no stops in US.. if it was impossible and would be renegotiated. He must have believed the plane could make Mexico when he made the demand.

Either he is an idiot or his "fly dirty" demand was miscommunicated. 

WE know he had aviation experience so it is very unlikely he was wrong. He was knowledgeable about the fuelling procedure.

So, his demand was miscommunicated.

Now, rethink the entire hijacking with that in mind. Everything falls into place.

Initially, he wanted to fly to Mexico. 

He would have given path instructions in the air and airstairs lowered in the air.

When Reno was negotiated he decided to jump as soon as he could to avoid being on the plane at Reno.

His jump at 8:11 was not a targeted LZ by time or place. He had no input or prior knowledge of the planes location/path.

 

Why would Cooper demand a flight to Mexico with no stops in US.  To keep law enforcement off his back. The problem with that theory is "time" becomes a real factor. Anything can happen. The Air Force can even decide to shoot the plane down! Cooper's best strategy for escape is a quick in-and-out before LE can even organise. LE and the pilots wont have time to even know where or when Cooper has bailed! Instinctively Cooper takes that route. Its a good tactical decision. A flight to Mexico with no stops in US may be a strong political stance by a guy with a grudge to express, but it is not a sound tactical escape decision. 

If Cooper does not know where he is he does have a sense of time, and he can see he is over land. He knows he is somewhere over Washington or Oregon and he can see the lights of cities coming up ahead. By identifying Tacoma from the air he has already told us he knows the geography of Washington. That is a given. The lights he is seeing ahead in the air will give him bearings on the ground. The tactical issue for Cooper is time. Staying two steps ahead of anything LE can do. Cooper's decision to bail NOW has given him time, the most precious asset he needs right now. Cooper jumps and vanishes into history - literally! Cooper has used the opportunities available to him to write a page into the history books.

Cooper knows. It is ourselves guessing fifty years later! By that standard Cooper escaped ... and won.    

Claims of a Bayesian analysis are superfluous. (not real)

Cooper is a man with priorities. Escape is a higher priority to Cooper than the money. That's what the bomb is all about. I think Cooper would prefer destruction to being caught. That may be why money was ever found on a sandbar miles from his LZ years later.

 

Edited June 7 by georger

[Kamkisky 12]

3 hours ago, FLYJACK said:

From Cooper's perspective he wouldn't know the crew misunderstood his demand. Like "telephone" comms go to Tina then to the crew..  one word can change all meaning.

Why skyjack PNW.. because that was not his first target. 

He stated Mexico City was his target destination (could refuel in Mexico) so that does not support the coastal route.

He rejected large airports.. why, if he was jumping in the PNW..

Forget BG,, it is not relevant at all.

Cooper could see lights... he jumped at 8:11 about 20 miles North of Portland.

The other hijackers gave directions, Cooper did not.. because his initial plan was to give those directions in the air. You don't give them on the ground and give away tour intentions.

 

From my notes...

Cooper’s initial demand was airstair's lowered inflight, FACT,,  he changed it later during negotiations with the crew and Reno was in play. FACT

During negotiations Cooper rejected large airports for US refuelling but accepted the smaller Reno FACT.. why, likely because he thought he was still going to be on the plane..  but he then decided to jump early. Otherwise, he wouldn’t care what size airport they used to refuel.

Cooper believed the plane could reach Mexico when he made his initial Mexico demand. This is a logical inference based on his aviation knowledge. It makes no sense to make a demand that was impossible and would be rejected. Ruse or not.

Cooper’s initial demand was given to Tina then relayed by her to the crew.

Cooper put on his chute after US fuelling stop negotiations.

Cooper’s initial demand (airstair's lowered inflight) suggests the gear down flaps down configuration when he ordered the airstair's lowered inflight not from takeoff. 

Cooper never intended to jump near Portland, when Reno was in play he wanted to jump ASAP but was delayed having trouble with the stairs.

Cooper gave no flightpath instructions. He did not know where the plane would be.

Cooper would have given directions later in the air. He did not jump where he had planned.

Cooper qualified the money as both “US” and “American”…   suggesting a non US domestic connection. 

Cooper was described as Latin.. features and characteristics. 

Cooper was not dressed for a wet/cold PNW jump.

Cooper could have flown anywhere and jumped anywhere and he ends up jumping where the hijacking started..  unlikely this is planned. It is ad hoc.

 

 

Did Cooper know the plane could fly to Mexico? If the answer is yes, then Cooper chose to negotiate refueling stops over flying straight to Mexico. You can argue it’s over a miscommunication but it’s what happened. Cooper was open to switching Mexico for Reno…when he knew the plane could make it to Mexico flying normally. Whatever understanding he had or the pilots had doesn’t change that Cooper walked in the plane knowing it go make it to Mexico and decided to change to Reno. 
 

This is where your theory hits a wall. If Mexico is the goal he gave up on it real easy when he didn’t have to. Cooper could just demand they fly directly to Mexico and no funny stuff. Simple. Done deal…305 goes to Mexico. 

In my theory he just wants south so he don’t give up on anything. He gains the jump configuration he wants to be operational the whole time…he secures his only line of escape AND keeps the direction he wanted. 

[FLYJACK 771]

17 minutes ago, georger said:

Why would Cooper demand a flight to Mexico with no stops in US.  To keep law enforcement off his back. The problem with that theory is "time" becomes a real factor. Anything can happen. The Air Force can even decide to shoot the plane down! Cooper's best strategy for escape is a quick in-and-out before LE can even organise. LE and the pilots wont have time to even know where or when Cooper has bailed! Instinctively Cooper takes that route. Its a good tactical decision. A flight to Mexico with no stops in US may be a strong political stance by a guy with a grudge to express, but it is not a sound tactical escape decision. 

If Cooper does not know where he is he does have a sense of time, and he can see he is over land. He knows he is somewhere over Washington or Oregon and he can see the lights of cities coming up ahead. By identifying Tacoma from the air he has already told us he knows the geography of Washington. That is a given. The lights he is seeing ahead in the air will give him bearings on the ground. The tactical issue for Cooper is time. Staying two steps ahead of anything LE can do. Cooper's decision to bail NOW has given him time, the most precious asset he needs right now. Cooper jumps and vanishes into history - literally! Cooper has used the opportunities available to him to write a page into the history books.

Cooper knows. It is ourselves guessing fifty years later! By that standard Cooper escaped ... and won.    

Claims of a Bayesian analysis are superfluous. (not real)

Cooper is a man with priorities. Escape is a higher priority to Cooper than the money. That's what the bomb is all about. I think Cooper would prefer destruction to being caught. That may be why money was ever found on a sandbar miles from his LZ years later.

 

um, because he actually did demand a flight to Mexico nonstop... 

Now, you are claiming to know his inner thoughts...

 

It is clear you do not grasp this issue.. 

Cooper boarded 305 with a plan to jump South of the US,, his initial demands were slightly misunderstood, that caused Reno to be in play, he then decided to jump as soon as he could to avoid Reno. That was at 8:11 about 25 miles N of Portland..  making his jump not targeted and ad hoc. No accomplice, no transportation waiting, nothing to do with PDX...

This is supported by evidence and contradicted by none.

I get that people want to add layers of unsupported speculation.. it makes for fun conversation but does not help to advance the case. 

 

[FLYJACK 771]

3 minutes ago, Kamkisky said:

Did Cooper know the plane could fly to Mexico? If the answer is yes, then Cooper chose to negotiate refueling stops over flying straight to Mexico. You can argue it’s over a miscommunication but it’s what happened. Cooper was open to switching Mexico for Reno…when he knew the plane could make it to Mexico flying normally. Whatever understanding he had or the pilots had doesn’t change that Cooper walked in the plane knowing it go make it to Mexico and decided to change to Reno. 
 

This is where your theory hits a wall. If Mexico is the goal he gave up on it real easy when he didn’t have to. Cooper could just demand they fly directly to Mexico and no funny stuff. Simple. Done deal…305 goes to Mexico. 

In my theory he just wants south so he don’t give up on anything. He gains the jump configuration he wants to be operational the whole time…he secures his only line of escape AND keeps the direction he wanted. 

It does not hit a wall because we don't know exactly why Cooper did or didn't do something.. your logic is backasswards.

He also did not demand a knapsack when he didn't get one. We don't know why that is..

Maybe he thought they have to refuel in Mexico anyway so he'll allow them to refuel in the US and be on the plane. But, decided screw it I can just jump I have the money..

Point is you are rejecting a sound theory based on your own assumption,, very bad logic.

You don't have to accept a theory but never reject on an assumption. 

 

[Kamkisky 12]

26 minutes ago, FLYJACK said:

It does not hit a wall because we don't know exactly why Cooper did or didn't do something.. your logic is backasswards.

He also did not demand a knapsack when he didn't get one. We don't know why that is..

Maybe he thought they have to refuel in Mexico anyway so he'll allow them to refuel in the US and be on the plane. But, decided screw it I can just jump I have the money..

Point is you are rejecting a sound theory based on your own assumption,, very bad logic.

You don't have to accept a theory but never reject on an assumption. 

 

I’m just trying to live in your theory. 
 

Cooper is flying around looking for a flight to skyjack and take to Mexico. He selects 305. He demands the money, chutes, etc and to go to Mexico. He then changes his plan while he is getting everything he wants. I’m not seeing why he would do that when he knows a fully fueled 727 can make it to Mexico.
 

Cooper initial said no US stops. He clearly didn’t want Reno or any of the others. Cooper selected to abandon straight to Mexico *when he didn’t have to.* He knew the plane could make it there, he knew it had a fresh full tank. What does he gain by abandoning his main goal so easily? It appears in your theory he gains the opportunity to jump into randomness and hope. It’s on you to explain why he decided to pick jumping randomly over a simple sentence…”fly directly to Mexico and I’ll give further instruction then.”

Edited June 7 by Kamkisky

[FLYJACK 771]

54 minutes ago, Kamkisky said:

I’m just trying to live in your theory. 
 

Cooper is flying around looking for a flight to skyjack and take to Mexico. He selects 305. He demands the money, chutes, etc and to go to Mexico. He then changes his plan while he is getting everything he wants. I’m not seeing why he would do that when he knows a fully fueled 727 can make it to Mexico.
 

Cooper initial said no US stops. He clearly didn’t want Reno or any of the others. Cooper selected to abandon straight to Mexico *when he didn’t have to.* He knew the plane could make it there, he knew it had a fresh full tank. What does he gain by abandoning his main goal so easily? It appears in your theory he gains the opportunity to jump into randomness and hope. It’s on you to explain why he decided to pick jumping randomly over a simple sentence…”fly directly to Mexico and I’ll give further instruction then.”

He said no stopping in US for any reason, can refuel in Mexico,,  to fuel in the US is his the change/acceptance, it is minor.. the flight would still be going to Mexico. His main goal is not compromised.

The evidence is clear.. he did not know where the plane would be where he jumped. He gave no directions.. it was ad hoc.. After Reno was in play, he altered his demand from airstairs lowered inflight to down on takeoff indicating a plan alteration...  he was convinced to up on takeoff.

The fact that Cooper gave no directions seals it... that would have been done inflight just like the other hijackers.

The evidence is there... I don't need to explain anything else.

 

You will never get this if you still think Cooper knew where the plane would be and targeted his LZ.. He didn't, there is no evidence or argument that makes that work.

 

 

Edited June 7 by FLYJACK

[olemisscub 547]

3 hours ago, FLYJACK said:

That is for sure. I apply Bayesian analysis, maybe you should try it.

You still can't back up your claim or explain the case incompatibility.

It is just made up nonsense.

What does Bayesian analysis have to do with this any of this?  I think you’ve forgotten how this all started. 

I said Cooper may have been trying to jump back where he started.

You asked me why would he want to do that.

I responded:

“Because that’s where his transportation was, either his own car or an accomplice, if we assume that he began his day in Portland.”

How is that made up nonsense? How is it a “claim”? If we assume he started his day in Portland, what is “made up nonsense” about what I wrote?  

[georger 268]

1 hour ago, Kamkisky said:

I’m just trying to live in your theory. 
 

Cooper is flying around looking for a flight to skyjack and take to Mexico. He selects 305. He demands the money, chutes, etc and to go to Mexico. He then changes his plan while he is getting everything he wants. I’m not seeing why he would do that when he knows a fully fueled 727 can make it to Mexico.
 

Cooper initial said no US stops. He clearly didn’t want Reno or any of the others. Cooper selected to abandon straight to Mexico *when he didn’t have to.* He knew the plane could make it there, he knew it had a fresh full tank. What does he gain by abandoning his main goal so easily? It appears in your theory he gains the opportunity to jump into randomness and hope. It’s on you to explain why he decided to pick jumping randomly over a simple sentence…”fly directly to Mexico and I’ll give further instruction then.”

You may have Cooper's psychology wrong ?

From your viewpoint he changed his mind. Are you saying he is not allowed to change his mind ?  People say things then do something else all the time. Especially during crises.

Cooper is under no compulsion to do as you say today! You are 50 years late. Next lets pipe you in to Cooper so he can follow your instructions based on your theory of him! 

Me? I prefer to let Cooper be Cooper. He can and will do whatever he wants.

[FLYJACK 771]

8 minutes ago, olemisscub said:

What does Bayesian analysis have to do with this any of this?  I think you’ve forgotten how this all started. 

I said Cooper may have been trying to jump back where he started.

You asked me why would he want to do that.

I responded:

“Because that’s where his transportation was, either his own car or an accomplice, if we assume that he began his day in Portland.”

How is that made up nonsense? How is it a “claim”? If we assume he started his day in Portland, what is “made up nonsense” about what I wrote?  

because you have no evidence, no logical inference, no argument, no idea that support in any way shape or form that Cooper had an accomplice or transportation at PDX.. 

Further, he jumped about 25 miles N of PDX...  

Cooper did not target PDX..

Your response to my question is nonsense.  

[FLYJACK 771]

13 minutes ago, georger said:

You may have Cooper's psychology wrong ?

From your viewpoint he changed his mind. Are you saying he is not allowed to change his mind ?  People say things then do something else all the time. Especially during crises.

Cooper is under no compulsion to do as you say today! You are 50 years late. Next lets pipe you in to Cooper so he can follow your instructions based on your theory of him! 

Me? I prefer to let Cooper be Cooper. He can and will do whatever he wants.

Huh, he did change his mind, that is the point.

Why do you spin this to attack me.

[Kamkisky 12]

4 minutes ago, georger said:

You may have Cooper's psychology wrong ?

From your viewpoint he changed his mind. Are you saying he is not allowed to change his mind ?  People say things then do something else all the time. Especially during crises.

Cooper is under no compulsion to do as you say today! You are 50 years late. Next lets pipe you in to Cooper so he can follow your instructions based on your theory of him! 

Me? I prefer to let Cooper be Cooper. He can and will do whatever he wants.

I’m going based off what Fly says was his goal, Mexico… and comparing that to what actually happened. 

What I’m missing is why he gave up on his goal *when he didn’t have to*? He knew the plane had the fuel and range to get to Mexico.  

Couple scenarios: 

1 - Cooper insists on his original goal. He tells them to fly straight to Mexico. In this scenario Cooper gets what he wants. 
 

2 - Cooper agrees to stop in Reno, which in turn causes him to jump into randomness before landing in Reno. In this scenario he doesn’t get what he wants.  
 

Why pick option two? He gains nothing. He loses his main goal according to Fly. He ends up jumping and hoping at random. All of this when he could have just said a single sentence…fly straight to Mexico and I’ll give future instructions. If Fly is right and Mexico is his goal he is one sentence away from achieving it. Yet….
 

This situation makes more sense IMO if you take the request to go to Mexico not as his goal but as a way to drag out the search area and increase his get away time. With this understanding his openness to negotiate Reno makes sense, it still accomplishes what he wanted. 
 

I like a simple Cooper. Point A to B and back to A. Know the terrain, read the signs viable from the air. Jump into farmland. The plane can continue on to Mexico or Reno…he doesn’t care. 

[olemisscub 547]

25 minutes ago, FLYJACK said:

 

After Reno was in play, he altered his demand from airstairs lowered inflight to down on takeoff indicating a plan alteration...  he was convinced to up on takeoff.

This whole theory seems to rely on you thinking he changed his overall plan when he demanded stairs down at takeoff. You don't know what was in his mind at that point. I find it much more likely that it went like this

C: we will lower stairs after takeoff but I need the girl

305: how about we lower them halfway and you let the girl go

Soderlind: can't be done, they are only open or closed. No intermediate setting

Tina: sorry sir, now they're saying they don't have an intermediate setting, so they can't do that. 

Cooper: (inspired by the idea of them taking off with stairs halfway down realizes that it wouldn't be such a bad idea to have them down completely at takeoff to ensure he isn't trapped in an aluminum jail cell) OK, well let's take off with stairs down. 

Here's another thing. And this isn't a dig at your support for Hahneman. But, believing that Cooper was Hahneman, you're naturally going to view things through that prism. So why would Cooper be so afraid of a refueling stop in America when 7 months later Hahneman is the one who requests a refueling stop in New Orleans? They weren't flying dirty when they left D.C. They could have easily made it to Honduras in that configuration from D.C. New Orleans really wasn't even a necessary stop to reach his DZ, yet HE is the one who asked for a refueling stop. 

Explain this incongruence and don't you dare say something about having some off the record knowledge that would explain this if we ONLY knew what you know.