DB Cooper

[skyjack71 0]

Jerry wrote:

Quote

Quote

377 You are correct and of course the chance's of me finding Cooper remains is slim .It was also a slim fact that they would ever find Emilly Smart. But miracles do happen. This is what happened with the Ingram's. Jerry

Georger replied: I sent you a parting email which you might want to read. Take care.
Georger

===================
?????????????????????????

Does this mean Georger has left the house? I do truly hope the Sweet Baboon is not gone as he is really an interesting person. Note, I say Sweet Baboon affectionately - but, he sure could turn into a Gorilla when I perplexed him with my ramblings. He never called me a liar or declared what I was saying was fiction or a figment of my imagination. He usually agreed to disagree most time in a polite way and put me in my place many times.

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[skyjack71 0]

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Mrs. Weber,

Please answer the following questions regarding your claim that the SW history page was suddenly altered:

Please provide some detail here. What web page are you talking about? Post a link to it. On what date was the history there, and when did it disappear? What information disappeared?

Thanks!

I will see if I can find it again. I just keyed in Sherwin Williams and kept going down the list on Explorer and AOL. One of them was what appeared to be an orginal SW page and history was there and then blank. On another page I did find some history, but no names were provided other than the two original owners.

P.S. To Snowman:
I tried to open those old archived pages you said DZ had, but like another time - it didn't open. I am not a computer person, I just barely get by.

P.S. To ALL:
I have spoke with several people who lived most of their lives in Wa and in the Washougal area.
As per the description I provided to Jerry in the very beginning and to the people who did the documentary in 2001 - and subsequently to a female truck driver before leaving Wa....they cannot conceive HOW or WHY Jerry could possible have missed what I was telling him.

Note: When I first contacted Jerry - he was NOT searching anywhere near Washougal and told me that my description of the area made no sense. Yet, after 2001 when I found the places he then shifted his own search area to Washougal.

Others have expressed their opinions as to why Jerry shifted his area - these ARE NOT participants of this forum, but people who have lived in the area - most if not all of their lives. Those aware of who he is, did not speak well of his motives or reasoning. What some said was not very kind - but everyone is entitled to their opinions.

Most of these people do not read this forum nor are they aware of it and some do not even use a computer.

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[JerryThomas 0]

Geoger . Please call me. Jerry

[JerryThomas 0]

Jo. I have always searched the washougal . My proof is Richard Seven from the seattle times He did a story on me and my search the date was Jan 1996 . Ralph and I have discussed my searches since 1989 It has alway's been the washougal since I met Ralph. This was way before you ever talked to me. Once again You just got caught in another failed atempt to discredit me. Jerry

[snowmman 3]

Richard Heenes and the balloon boy are in Fort Collins, CO, which is only 70 miles North of Aurora, CO, where Zazi lived.

There are two Sherwin Williams in Aurora
15390 E Alameda Pkwy, Aurora
2832 S Havana St, Aurora

and two in Fort Collins
2627 S College Ave, Fort Collins
2415 E Mulberry St, Fort Collins

(edit) georger may need to confirm this, but I think somehow they thought they could recreate the helium flash with the Large Hadron Collider and the helium balloon.

helium flash- Runaway and explosive helium fusion inside a star as it evolves off the main sequence and into the giant phase of evolution. Occurs when degenerate gas at the star's center reaches a temperature of about 108 K.

[snowmman 3]

in case 377 hasn't seen this:

(edit) Coincidently, it's proof of what I said about UFOs and the Cooper cow mutilations. Unless Jo can put a cow mutilation on Weber, I think her case has just gotten weaker.

(edit) I would also note people are making the connection between Balloon Boy and DB Cooper. see blogs here:
http://blogsearch.google.com/blogsearch?q=%22Balloon%20Boy%22%20%22DB%20COoper%22&oe=utf-8&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&hl=en&tab=wb

from rob thomas, on heene's plans:

http://gawker.com/5383859/abc-reality-series-proposal-from-richard-heene-and-rob-thomas#ufo

"Reality Series Proposal from Richard Heene and Rob Thomas

Below is a proposal drawn up by Robert Thomas on behalf of his friend, collaborator and sometime employer Richard Heene, father of Balloon Boy. Heene was trying to sell a reality science series to the producers of Wife Swap after he appeared on the show.

Of particular note is item 16, proposing an episode built around a publicity stunt involving a "homemade flying saucer."

..
Richard Heene
05/08/2009
ABC Reality Series Proposal
Breakdown of Experiments

...

16. Can we attract UFO's with a homemade flying saucer? We will modify a weather balloon, so that it resembles a UFO and will electrically charge the skin of the craft (Biefield-Brown Effect). We will capture the footage on film, and will utilize the media as a means with which to make our presence known to the masses. This will not only provide us with incredible footage, but will also generate a tremendous amount of controversy among the public, as well as publicity within the mainstream media. This will be the most significant UFO-related news event to take place since the Roswell Crash of 1947, and the result will be a dramatic increase in local and national awareness about The Heene Family, our Reality Series, as well as the UFO Phenomenon in general."

[1969912 0]

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I will see if I can find it again. I just keyed in Sherwin Williams and kept going down the list on Explorer and AOL. One of them was what appeared to be an orginal SW page and history was there and then blank. On another page I did find some history, but no names were provided other than the two original owners.

So you have no idea what the heck you were looking at before you made the "POOF" claim? Bet you don't find it...

"Once we got to the point where twenty/something's needed a place on the corner that changed the oil in their cars we were doomed . . ."
-NickDG

[skyjack71 0]

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Jo. I have always searched the washougal . My proof is Richard Seven from the seattle times He did a story on me and my search the date was Jan 1996 . Ralph and I have discussed my searches since 1989 It has alway's been the washougal since I met Ralph. This was way before you ever talked to me. Once again You just got caught in another failed atempt to discredit me. Jerry

This was NOT an attempt to discredit you, but what I was told by you in 1996 - you told me NO WAY Cooper landed anywhere near Washougal and that he landed way North / West of that area. Remember again - I do not live in Washington - exactly what do people mean when they say Washougal area?

To me the Washougal area includes the Lake LaCames area - I am talking Green Mt on 500 to the East side of the Washougal loop and that would go all the way to the stateline.
North from the Bonneville Camp to the Columbia on the south.

I have not resorted to the methology used by you to discredit me nor will I. If this goes over your head call me and I will spell it out for you...if you have pulled a few don't bother.

The Cooper Saga will soon be over, but there will be those who will not accept it and forever continue to present more suspects

Pipe Dream:
Would one of the 20 dollar bills with Dan Cooper written on it be proof Duane Weber was Cooper? No, it would not be if it was in the possession of someone else......and that person thought a member of their family was Cooper. The handwriting I saved might be all that will prove Duane Weber was Cooper.

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[georger 268]

Quote

Richard Heenes and the balloon boy are in Fort Collins, CO, which is only 70 miles North of Aurora, CO, where Zazi lived.

There are two Sherwin Williams in Aurora
15390 E Alameda Pkwy, Aurora
2832 S Havana St, Aurora

and two in Fort Collins
2627 S College Ave, Fort Collins
2415 E Mulberry St, Fort Collins

(edit) georger may need to confirm this, but I think somehow they thought they could recreate the helium flash with the Large Hadron Collider and the helium balloon.

helium flash- Runaway and explosive helium fusion inside a star as it evolves off the main sequence and into the giant phase of evolution. Occurs when degenerate gas at the star's center reaches a temperature of about 108 K.

funny. no connection between the two.

The metal foil on the baloon is interesting (an old principle) used to collect and discharge atmospheric electrons which can be used as a form of attractive ands repulsive steering and elevation control ...

Heene said one of his concerns was that his son
could be electrocuted ... ! not sure how real his
concern was ie. how this craft is constructed or
insulated.

News tonight is he's been charged and faces a stiff
bill. Woooooooops!

There is something about the family dynamic
that's a little bothersome to me - was this guy's
back yard the appropriate place to be storing this thing?

[edit] Some here will have heard of 'spherics' (
spheric detectors and such) which rely on
electron balance and discharges in clouds; Henne was employing the same principles. We used to build these little spheric detectors (Amateur
Scientist/Scientific American) and listen to approaching storms and record the data on our
strip chart recorders) - similar data is still used
today by meteorologists.

[snowmman 3]

georger said "Heene said one of his concerns was that his son
could be electrocuted ... ! not sure how real his
concern was ie. how this craft is constructed or
insulated. "

Heene, in the 911 call, said this about voltages:


Dispatcher: So was it running then?
RH: Well it doesn't run, it's filled with helium. And it operates off of a million volts to move left and right — horizontal. And we were testing it to find out what effects we could get.

Dispatcher: OK. And so it was last seen 20 minutes ago?
RH: Um, probably. I'm gonna check the time. Probably, yeah.

Dispatcher: Ok. So there's no electronics on it, there's no tracking device, right?
RH: No, no. I don't know whether it's possible you guys could detect the electricity that it emits, but every five minutes it comes on for one minute, and uh, it emits a million volts on the outer skin. And uh, if he takes a ride in it he could get electrocuted.

Dispatcher: Ok, so every five minutes it comes on for one minute and then shuts off again.
RH: Right.

Dispatcher: And it does that to charge?
RH: No, no, no, no.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,567720,00.html


I think he had some idea of the Biefield-Brown Effect with his million volt spew.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biefeld%E2%80%93Brown_effect

(note the device didn't have any electronics on it, though, regardless of what he said to the dispatcher)

[377 22]

Quote

I have spoke with several people who lived most of their lives in Wa and in the Washougal area.
As per the description I provided to Jerry in the very beginning and to the people who did the documentary in 2001 - and subsequently to a female truck driver before leaving Wa....they cannot conceive HOW or WHY Jerry could possible have missed what I was telling him.

Jo,

Your consistent habit of holding back facts and just stating conclusions might explain the misunderstanding. To me, that seems a lot more plausible than concluding Jerry is part of a conspiracy to hide the fact that Duane was Cooper. Occam agrees with me.

In 2009 who would put any effort into hiding the truth about Cooper's identity? Why?

377

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[Orange1 0]

oh dear, what happened to the moratorium? things have really gone downhill here the last day or so.

i personally feel it is better to keep the forum quiet for a few days than post rubbish. just my opinion of course; to use an americanism, ymmv.

edited to add: reading back that may have sounded a bit harsh. i'm not sure whether i need to apologise though

Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun.

[snowmman 3]

I was thinking about this profile of Duane Weber
1) Terrorist - Flight 305 hijacking
2) connected with MLK and JFK murders.

It's likely he murdered other people.
And thinking about similar people, he probably frequented prostitutes.

Jo: Did Duane ever mention prostitutes or talk about any other murders?

[377 22]

Quote

oh dear, what happened to the moratorium? things have really gone downhill here the last day or so.

i personally feel it is better to keep the forum quiet for a few days than post rubbish. just my opinion of course; to use an americanism, ymmv.

edited to add: reading back that may have sounded a bit harsh. i'm not sure whether i need to apologise though

I thought we agreed to cease personal attacks on Jo, not pretend she doesn't exist.

Anyway, will try to make the forum more inviting for Orange. I think we all like her posts.

That electrostatic propulsion/attitude control scheme on the saucer balloon seems useless if there is any wind at all. You can actually measure altitude differences by reading natural field voltage. Stanford used this to make a wing leveling autopilot for a glider research project. It banked to minimize/equalize wingtip voltages. Saved a lot of weight compared to a gyro sensor.

I am still pondering Georgers and Snowmmans outlook on the Tena Bar money find. It just feels unlikely and staged, although it probably wasn't.

My candidate for the most amazing hijack is the mechanic who stole a USAF C 130 Hercules in the UK years ago. He was flying just fine when the plane disappeared into the sea. Rumors are that the USAF shot him down.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[Orange1 0]

Quote

Quote

oh dear, what happened to the moratorium? things have really gone downhill here the last day or so.

i personally feel it is better to keep the forum quiet for a few days than post rubbish. just my opinion of course; to use an americanism, ymmv.

edited to add: reading back that may have sounded a bit harsh. i'm not sure whether i need to apologise though

I thought we agreed to cease personal attacks on Jo, not pretend she doesn't exist.

Ah yes, there was that issue where showing her arguments make no sense was interpreted as a PA... i have this problem that i do this automatically so ..hey 377 i even challenged something you wrote the other day

off topic, had my daughter's 1st birthday party today! can't believe how time has flown!

Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun.

[377 22]

Happy birthday to Baby Orange!

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[SKYWHUFFO 1]

A baby orange, wouldn't that be a tangerine? HA Go enjoy that little one.

[snowmman 3]

yay for mini-orange!

I'm picturing the fast forward: Orange1 trying to use logic on the teenage mini-orange....and the reply, of course:
"Yeah, mom"

[georger 268]

That electrostatic propulsion/attitude control scheme on the saucer balloon seems useless if there is any wind at all. You can actually measure altitude differences by reading natural field voltage. Stanford used this to make a wing leveling autopilot for a glider research project. It banked to minimize/equalize wingtip voltages. Saved a lot of weight compared to a gyro sensor.

I am still pondering Georgers and Snowmmans outlook on the Tena Bar money find. It just feels unlikely and staged, although it probably wasn't.

377

I seriously doubt Heene's craft was sophisticated
(Biefold-Brown Effect)? Probably just a bag of gas.
A lot of people want a look to evaluate it. He chose
helium over hydrogen - less risky and readily available. There is something in this that doesnt
add up - and I guess Im not the only one saying
so.

As for Tina Bar I agree, it is suspicious unless one
can show it has an equal or greater probability of being a debris sight (within a certain radius of
something) to make it a likely place where C$
would turn up. I mean: if we took the Queen's
jewels and tossed some in at the north end of the
Washougal, some at the south end, some in other
places, and let them all work their way into the
Columbia, how long would Queen Mother stand at
Tina Bar waiting? not too long my my reckoning.

Or, lets make it brand new washing machines and
driers, free to whoever collects one, but only at
Tina Bar, after being released at various points
along the Columbia. Would the Fazios show up to collect?

All places are not equal, as viewed from the point
of view of the specific factors brought that money
to that bar. There is a reason for everything -

[snowmman 3]

georger: you're making things sound mysterious, for no good reason.

examples:

explain this (old post)
http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=3478575;search_string=oil%20spill;guest=62815156#3478575

later info, same incident:
http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=3273195;search_string=oil%20spill;#3273195

and an experiment that Orange1 can work the numbers on:
http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=3470665;search_string=oil%20spills;#3470665

(edit) Also: you seem to discount the dredge possibility and rely only on water movement in your wondering?

[snowmman 3]

on Nov 30, 2008 Orange1 responded to a post:

I said:
"Next you're going to tell me the US economy is actually going to make a full recovery in the future."

Orange1 said: "It is.
(but "the future" is a long time)"

Using VTSMX as a proxy for the US stock market....
VTSMX had hit a low of 18 on Nov 20, 2008
It broke that low on Mar 9, 2009 at 16.43

Last close 26.84

19.57 on Dec 1 2008, the earliest day after the Oracle spoke.

That's a 37% increase from the pronouncement till today (in <1 year)...I believe solely as a result of the Oracle's words.

So the question is: Does the Oracle say...just a bear market rally....or the US is on the path to becoming a banana republic with a deficit > 80% of the GNP...or is everyone in SA saying "Why the hell are we holding Not-So-United States treasury bonds?"

ahh..now there's risk!

Another question: Who thinks it's not possible for someone to run a marathon in the weather that Cooper jumped in?

[skyjack71 0]

Quote

Jo,
Your consistent habit of holding back facts and just stating conclusions might explain the misunderstanding.

What facts would I hold back from Jerry regarding the site I was describing? The facts I do hold back now are only what we are working on. I even put part of it out there hoping someone with the computer skills I do not have might be able to help.

When I put things out there that are pertinent such as the BOEING connections - it is made fun of, yet this needs to go further than we have done at this time - I am looking for a man whose only name I know is Richard Weber and he was 4 yrs old in 1930. Then he seems to vanish along with his sister. As I have stated before - no matter what I come up with NO one is going to REALLY listen.

Senario Below: ONLY what could have happened, but what I believe happened from my very brief conversation with Tina yrs ago...she could not talk about Cooper and had this protective sound when she said to let it go "He was a very Sad man".

Say the Stockholm Syndrome but then put a fatherly syndrome into this. What was Tina's relation to her own father? I believe that something he said to her could have been a key to his identity. Remember the FBI converged on CA and military.
They had numerous calls - saying "I served with that joker" in Belgium or Holland or Jacksonvile or Georgia. The FBI checks this guy out with the bare essentials and others who may have served with him - it went no where. The name they had was either dead or he lived in let's say Chicago or Salt Lake (a respectible member of the Community who did not resemble Cooper except in a vague sort of way). They find the man and question him - he was with family on that day - it was after all the day before Thanksgiving...easy to remember.

Or the FBI may have found the man died before 1971. They stopped the search on this name and this person. It is also possible they had only a nickname - Dusty or Dutch - strange Duane stopped using his nickname immediately after the crime - No one from the 70's till Duane's death knew about that nickname but I did because of the tattoo.

Not one of you have presented any insight into the soul of Cooper and why or how he ended up doing what he did. Our searches for the answers have led ALL of us in the wrong direction. The only thing that has driven me is because I CANNOT erase what I saw and held in my hands nor what he showed and told me.

HAD IT NOT have been for the physical evidence for which no one has anything, but my word - I could have walked away and would have walked away yrs ago. I would not have used up this wonderful life in pursuit of a falsehood or as Jerry is famous for saying - a fantasy or lie.

An eyewitness account regarding Cooper is NOT going to happen, because of time. Physical evidence won't happen because Duane had all there was and now it is gone because I didn't know who Dan Cooper was.

When Duane said "Oh, F--- Let it Die with Me" that is exactly how it ended - because I didn't know who Dan Cooper was. Without the evidence there will never be a subject recognized and accepted as being D.B. Cooper (aka Dan Cooper).

If I was anyone other than the widow of Duane Weber - my arguments about Cooper would be accepted and explored as was done with the Waugh and Braden thing. When I did let go of some of what was being worked on with the Boeing thing, it was treated as a joke.

I have what I think is the grudge and the Boeing connection and the WA connection. When I spoke of Sherwin Williams I was not talking about a connection with a store (accept for the parents being provided with a francise to run in Huntington) but Corporate and Laboratories - this was in Ohio and Ill. I was talking about a man who I believe was a very important man within the Sherwin Williams operation in the 40's, 50's and 60's.

No one looks for motive - Cooper had a motive and he chose Boeing, the 727 and WA for valid reasons. I have put the trail out there, but no one wants to follow the crumbs that were found by myself and so many others.

Everyone looks for experience and the jump background. This is exactly WHY the crime was never solved...the damn FBI forgot about Motive - the amount of money asked for - should have gave any profiler reason to look beyond a simple hijacking. Maybe Cooper was taking what he felt he was cheated out of...also remember Cooper must have known exactly how much insurance was provided for airlines in such an instance.

This jump was about getting even and a man in dire straights with no one or anything to fall back on. This was a man whose connections to Boeing where outside of the perimenters the FBI explored. The FBI looked for someone within Boeing, but they didn't take that next step.

Why in the hell do any of you think they even checked on previous employees of Boeing - something was said on that plane that led them to do so, but the FBI didn't take the search to the next level...the family members of those who profited by family connections to Boeing and whose grudge was with those individuals and NOT with Boeing.

Duane was a BAD egg - he didn't fit the mold. He didn't cut it with the Navy and the Army, he embarrassed the family by commiting a crime - he was a troubled young man. His Family in the 40's tried to help, but he had this knack for getting into trouble...which often happens with the baby of the family. He made the ultimate sacrafice for one member of the family, but he turned around and got in trouble again. He then spent around 8 yrs in a federal prison - when he got out NO ONE wanted him - his brother ordered him out of this mothers home. While in prison his father died and his uncle died. His daughter told him she never wanted to see him again. In 18 months he was back in prison - and when he got out of that prison in Colorado - he took a NEW name...was he still wanted under his real name or was this his stab at starting a new life?

Under the new name he was involved in some really bad things and when he went to CA and then to WA in approx 1966 before going into Jefferson - he went out there to settle a score and told his wife he was going to see about his inheritance. Well, that from what little I know didn't go well...he ended up in Jefferson.

I think the whole time he was in Jefferson - (he brewed about what was taken from him) this thing was on his mind and when he got out in 1968 - he again attempted to start over having to constantly look over his shoulder for fear he would be found out. He felt cheated out of his life.

During his life as John Collins he had acquired the knowledge he needed to pull it off along with his past "experience" with Boeings ...I don't think he even knew exactly what he was going to do, but he intended to get what he felt was due him and/or what was promised to him. When he found out about the kidney disease - he was MOTIVATED. The answers are there and Duane Weber was Cooper.

Just one time ignore what the FBI has said or done and have some faith that I have not conjured up this story and it is real - take it to the investigative level I will not be granted the time to do - I have given you the motive and the grudge and the accessibliity and the knowledge of Boeing 727's and the background of Weber. If you guys won't it will never be done. There was nothing about this hijacking that was complicated nor the man who committed it...just that he survived and no one ever knew who Cooper was...he had gotten his last chance at life.

Orange - just one time put yourself in my shoes and do not condemn me until you do so. I assure you and anyone else - I do not do this for my health and certainly not for money. If anything - my search for Cooper has cost me my health and the life I could have had. I don't want to leave until I have finished what fate assigned me, but this may be entirely out of my hands.

No one "enables" me - except the creator of life and whatever makes humans do what we do. There are good and there are bad. There are lairs and there are truthseekers and some in between. I have only one wish in this life - to be here long enough to see this thing through, but I fear that will not happen.

I wonder how many innocent people have been executed by the system. That is an odd ponderance, but it is just how I am thinking right now. Hopelessness is overwhelming, but I believe in miracles for whatever reason...and I guess that is exactly how they feel right up until the moment the needle goes into their arm...when the drip starts there is no hope, only resolution and acceptance.

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[377 22]

Jo,

Kindly explain how Duane knew that a 727 airstair could be successfully deployed in flight?

I have a complete Multi hundred page 727 flight manual and it doesn't address the issue.

Certainly an aircraft paint contractor/supplier would not need this kind of specialized system information.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[snowmman 3]

Would have been cool if Tina would have knifed Duane when he showed her the bomb.

[georger 268]

Quote

georger: you're making things sound mysterious, for no good reason.

examples:

explain this (old post)
http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=3478575;search_string=oil%20spill;guest=62815156#3478575

later info, same incident:
http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=3273195;search_string=oil%20spill;#3273195

and an experiment that Orange1 can work the numbers on:
http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=3470665;search_string=oil%20spills;#3470665

(edit) Also: you seem to discount the dredge possibility and rely only on water movement in your wondering?

somehow I missed that post but the point is well taken - exactly what I am driving at. The date of
the report is 2005, not 1971/74/79/80 .... so can
we conclude the same principles applied in the 70s
as happened in one single case in 2005? I dont
have the answer to that. Is there a current which
has consistently flowed between the points cited
in 2005, a current which has consistently flowed in that manner for decades? Again I dont know, but
it would be worth looking into. If such a current
exists and has functioned in the same area for
decades (or was just functioning in the 70s) then
perhaps we have our route through the Columbia
to Tina Bar via Catplr Isle .... courtesy of the
Willamette confluence? ... and that would be
good to know.

Are you suggesting this is the case?

I dont discount this is a possibility.

I just dont know that the single instance you cite
is a universal ...

Maybe this current has blue eyes too?