kevin922 0 #1 September 19, 2002 So a guy in my group had his 3rd cutaway in 70+ jumps.. i happened to be on the jump for the 3rd one, i saw the canopy right before he cut it and it did have the "v" formation indicitive of a lineover (which he said was what happened). Here is my question, if you have plenty of altitude is it possible to fix your lineover by chopping the line that is over? -- if you can do this, what would you estimate the cost and downtime to fixing a cut line? Can a rigger fix that or does it have to go back to the mfg.? Kevin Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rgoper 0 #2 September 19, 2002 QuoteCan a rigger fix that or does it have to go back to the mfg.? Kev: i could be wrong, (i'll be wrong again) but i don't think so, and i'm sure you'll get more informative responses after this on. if it's a line on your main, a senior rigger can repair it, if it's your reserve, a master rigger must make the repairs, which in most cases it is a good idea to send it back to the mfgr. downside there is 10-14 day turn-around. as to your question of either chopping a line-over, or cutting the offending line, "if" it cannot be "cleared" before hard deck, id chop it, instead of cutting the offending line(s) then you just looking at a reserve repack, not a line set as well, then you have both canopies down, instead of one. i could be full of it, i'm no rigger, this is just "my take" good luck.--Richard-- "We Will Not Be Shaken By Thugs, And Terroist" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhreeZone 20 #3 September 19, 2002 In addition to just Line damage if you cut the line, the longer you let a line wear on the canopy the greater the risk of burn holes in the canopy. Trying to clear a line over might save you a repack, but could cost a lot to fix the canopy. Techincally, only a master rigger is to do line work since the failure of the component would result in system failure. Thats why senior riggers can not sew patches on seams on canopies. But that being said... a lot of senior riggers can, will, and do line work. Cost? Depends on the line cut, if you only had to cut the steering line the material cost might be under 15 and then 35-75 for labor plus the repack, total turn around time depends on if you have a weekend rigger or a full time rigger. But if you get a little too happy with the knife and snagged more then a few lines then a new line set is 150-175 plus 50 to install at most places. Turn around time from a factory depends on if the line set is in stock. If it is you might only need to wait 2 weeks, if not it might take 4 weeks to repair the canopy.Yesterday is history And tomorrow is a mystery Parachutemanuals.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,103 #4 September 19, 2002 >if you have plenty of altitude is it possible to fix your lineover by > chopping the line that is over? It is possible; it is also extremely unlikely. Derek tried that a few months ago, and even though he knew which line he'd have to chop, and was ready for it, he couldn't do it. It is essentially never done on main parachutes, and the only reason it's done on reserves is that you might as well try something. (Note - there _is_ a situation on BASE rigs where a line is released to fix a lineover, but this is designed into the riser system - you do not use a knife.) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Cajones 0 #5 September 19, 2002 A rigger does not have to be used - legally - to work on a main. You can work on your own main, if you really want to. If you have the altitude and ability to "fix" any type of malfunction - do so. I am a firm believer in the: "Your reserve may be as bad off, or worse than the problem with your main." If you can fly and land it safely, why risk a problem with your reserve? Clearing the lineover is the first course of action (pulling on toggles, suspension lines, risers, etc.). The next plan is to cut the offending line and perform a controllability check. Cutting a line on the opposite side of the canopy can sometimes restore symmetry and controllability, also. Bottom line: "Can this parachute fly and land me safely?" The laws of physics are strictly enforced. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,103 #6 September 19, 2002 >Clearing the lineover is the first course of action (pulling on toggles, > suspension lines, risers, etc.). Agreed. > The next plan is to cut the offending line and perform a > controllability check. This can indeed be done, but I strongly recommend that you try it under ideal conditions first (i.e. a cutaway rig) before you add it to your arsenal of possible responses to a malfunction. It is not as simple as it sounds. In addition, lineovers usually lead to spinning mals. Spinning mals on HP parachutes may lead to near-freefall-speed descents, and you often have limited times of useful consciousness due to G-forces. Be sure that you take the most effective possible action in the limited time you have. >Cutting a line on the opposite side of the canopy can sometimes > restore symmetry and controllability, also. Warning - this will make any lineover _worse_ and will waste time. If you have the time (i.e. you had a premature on a PD230 and get a lineover at 12,000 feet) and a hookknife you may want to spend the time trying to identify and cut the line that's over the top, but cutting other lines will _not_ restore controllability to the parachute. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
fasterfaller 0 #7 September 19, 2002 ***A rigger does not have to be used - legally - to work on a main. You can work on your own main, if you really want to. Quote Wrong , You can legally build your own main but a rigger must be used to repair it . Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Hooknswoop 19 #8 September 20, 2002 QuoteClearing the lineover is the first course of action (pulling on toggles, suspension lines, risers, etc.). The next plan is to cut the offending line and perform a controllability check. Cutting a line on the opposite side of the canopy can sometimes restore symmetry and controllability, also. Like Bill V. mentioned, I intentionally packed a line over on a PD-170. I did a hop and pop and pulled out my hook knife and tried to cut the line-over. I knew which line it was, I was expecting it, I knew I had time/altitude to mess w/ it and I still couldn't get it done. Even had I cut the line, I would have had to release the other steering line, after possibly inducing line twists from having only one brake stowed, kick out of the line twists, and do a controllability check w/ the rear risers. That is a lot to get done before deciscion altitude. The main can be easily damaged by the lin-over and obviuosly one steering line will have to be replaced. Under even a moderately loaded elliptical, this process wouldn't be feasible as a course of action. If you have a line-over cut away and pull your reserve. If the line is just on the end cell and you have the altitude/time to make an attempt to clear it, sure give it a whirl. After experiencing how fast that PD-170 at about a 1:1.12 wingloading slung me around, I wouldn't sepend a second to think before chopping a line-over. I had a line-over on an FX-79 a few years ago. When I cut away (with tunnel vision from the "G's"), I looked over my shoulder and the main was BELOW the horizon. Hook Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL. Insert image from URL × Desktop Tablet Phone Submit Reply 0
Hooknswoop 19 #8 September 20, 2002 QuoteClearing the lineover is the first course of action (pulling on toggles, suspension lines, risers, etc.). The next plan is to cut the offending line and perform a controllability check. Cutting a line on the opposite side of the canopy can sometimes restore symmetry and controllability, also. Like Bill V. mentioned, I intentionally packed a line over on a PD-170. I did a hop and pop and pulled out my hook knife and tried to cut the line-over. I knew which line it was, I was expecting it, I knew I had time/altitude to mess w/ it and I still couldn't get it done. Even had I cut the line, I would have had to release the other steering line, after possibly inducing line twists from having only one brake stowed, kick out of the line twists, and do a controllability check w/ the rear risers. That is a lot to get done before deciscion altitude. The main can be easily damaged by the lin-over and obviuosly one steering line will have to be replaced. Under even a moderately loaded elliptical, this process wouldn't be feasible as a course of action. If you have a line-over cut away and pull your reserve. If the line is just on the end cell and you have the altitude/time to make an attempt to clear it, sure give it a whirl. After experiencing how fast that PD-170 at about a 1:1.12 wingloading slung me around, I wouldn't sepend a second to think before chopping a line-over. I had a line-over on an FX-79 a few years ago. When I cut away (with tunnel vision from the "G's"), I looked over my shoulder and the main was BELOW the horizon. Hook Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
