Drug testing for DZ Instructors/TMs/Pilots

[diverdriver 7]

That's my point. I can argue from the same position against this. Just hope people realize the similarities. That was my intention.

Chris Schindler
www.diverdriver.com
ATP/D-19012
FB #4125

[sducoach 0]

Chris,

I'd never question your intentions, content yes, intent no!?!?!?

Just kidding brother.

I'll say it again. Why? First it's not legal, second it can get me killed, third it can get you killed, fourth if you want to kill yourself sit in the smoking section of the cafe.
Blues,
J.E.

James 4:8

[sducoach 0]

We still use the old "eight hours from the bottle to the throttle" rule at our DZ. Staff or customers and it is a zero tolerance rule.

James 4:8

[Shark 0]

You know I keep seeing this "UTI" and I keep thinking
about my ex and her urinary track infection.

[buzzfink 5]

Jimbo,
That statement says it all! Very well put!

Buzz

>>>>

[WeakMindedFool 0]

When we talk about drug testing, were not talking about seeing if someone is wasted, were talking about testing if someone gets wasted...which is complete bullshit! We have been suckered into the propaganda. Testing for metabolites (which is what your doing with the exception of alcohol) is useless in determining someones current state of mind. Now if your suggesting that we can determine someones fitness for an activity based on lifestyle...we probably aren't going to agree. Show me a way to test someone for impairment and i'll back it provided you have cause. We all know damn well when someone's impaired, drunk, stoned, fatigued, or even stupid. You can't effectively test for the substances that cause real lifestyle deterioration anyways. That is Stimulants, but it becomes pretty obvious pretty fast. So who are we going after? We are going after the people who generally aren't having a problem. The guy who smoked a joint last week. Are you truly afraid of this guy?

Faith in a holy cause is to a considerable extent a substitute for lost faith in ourselves.
-Eric Hoffer -
Check out these Videos

[billvon 3,107]

>Testing for metabolites (which is what your doing with the exception of
> alcohol) is useless in determining someones current state of mind.

Well, right. But I don't think anyone is claiming that drug testing stops impaired people from getting on the plane with a student. Heck, you could do drugs that morning, jump all day, and not get fired until the test came back a few days (or a few weeks) later. It's a deterrent; people who don't know how to beat the test will do drugs less often if they think they might get caught by a random drug screen. It's sorta like putting a "guard dog" sign in the window. A sign alone will do nothing to stop a thief, but if the sign makes him think he will be attacked after he enters the premises, and he can't beat a dog (i.e. he doesn't have a gun etc) he will look for an easier place to burgle.

[WeakMindedFool 0]

Quote

>Testing for metabolites (which is what your doing with the exception of
> alcohol) is useless in determining someones current state of mind.

Well, right. But I don't think anyone is claiming that drug testing stops impaired people from getting on the plane with a student. Heck, you could do drugs that morning, jump all day, and not get fired until the test came back a few days (or a few weeks) later. It's a deterrent; people who don't know how to beat the test will do drugs less often if they think they might get caught by a random drug screen. It's sorta like putting a "guard dog" sign in the window. A sign alone will do nothing to stop a thief, but if the sign makes him think he will be attacked after he enters the premises, and he can't beat a dog (i.e. he doesn't have a gun etc) he will look for an easier place to burgle.

I do see what you are saying, and I know i'm confusing the issue. I don't want anyone impaired taking my life in their hands! I have one of those jobs that everyone wants drug tested and are tested fequently. If we were not I absolutely would smoke pot. I prefer it to alcohol, always have, always will. I do not smoke because of the testing and so this does vindicate the point of view that testing is an effective deterent. The reason it is effective is because I'm a responsible individual who prizes his job over his recreation. Lets say for the sake of argument that prohibition ended tomorrow, those of us that were deterred begin smoking again...is our society less safe now? We're still responsible people! we make the same value judgments. I would be no more dangerous on the streets or in the air then i was when we had drug laws. Because we drink alcohol in this society does not mean we condone operating heavy machinery under the influence! I would never drink before skydiving and I would never impair myself in any way before doing something that could kill me! Could I beat a drug test? Easily, every day, with very little effort. This would be irresponsible! It's the people who are not deterred who you have to worry about, the people who will be dangerous no matter what. Drug testing stops the people you don't need to worry about anyways. That's all I'm saying.

Faith in a holy cause is to a considerable extent a substitute for lost faith in ourselves.
-Eric Hoffer -
Check out these Videos

[billvon 3,107]

>Drug testing stops the people you don't need to worry about anyways.

Yep. In this case it also stops Djan, who not only do you not need to worry about, but who is a huge asset to any DZ she's at. I don't worry about it too much because I think it will self regulate. A DZ will drug test, another one will follow suit, and all the people like DJan will end up at the third DZ. That one will have better student retention and make more money. The next time a DZ opens in that area the new DZO will take note of that effect. DZO's are still perfectly free to drug test (it is, after all, their business) as long as they're willing to live with the consequences.