SkydiveNFlorida 0 #1 September 16, 2003 Ok, say in 10 or 20 more jumps, I want to purposely land crosswind a few times to learn to deal with it, is that normal/acceptable? thoughts? thx. angela . Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lazerq3 0 #2 September 16, 2003 SURE!! land crosswind , downwind , any wind....its all good for training..just make sure the DZO and people yourjumping with know your intensions and do it away form other jumpers, oron a hop n pop by yourself!! jasonFreedom of speech includes volume Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skybytch 273 #3 September 16, 2003 That's a great idea. Do it away from the main landing area so you don't create a traffic issue for others, and do your first one in a very light crosswind. I think they're kinda fun. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkydiveNFlorida 0 #4 September 16, 2003 Cool, thanks!! Hey, Lisa, when will you be in Sebastian? I'll probly be up this wknd:) thx! Angela. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skybytch 273 #5 September 16, 2003 QuoteHey, Lisa, when will you be in Sebastian? I'm here now. Stop by the store and say hi!! Hopefully my gear will be here by then, if it is we'll have to go do a jump together. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites mjosparky 4 #6 September 16, 2003 I think it would be a good idea. But you may want to wait until you are completely comfortable with normal landings and maybe get a briefing from an instructor. Good luck.My idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites SkydiveNFlorida 0 #7 September 16, 2003 Cool, i'll do that! I can't jump yet, tho, cuz I don't have gear and it's really expensive to rent there (and the smallest rental they have a 170sf and the rig is NOT freefly friendly). I borrowed a rig, but i'd have to borrow/rent a main for it (with risers)... Do you guys demo canopies? Soon, tho,... verrrry verrrry soon, i'll have my own gear, and i'd LOVE to make a jump with you! Angela. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites billvon 3,107 #8 September 16, 2003 An excellent idea. Some suggestions: -Start slow. Choose a light wind day and land 45 degrees off the wind line, then 60, then 90. -Get advice from local experienced canopy pilots as to where to try this, how to do it, etc. -Avoid the tendency to "put your hand out to break your fall." This almost always turns you downwind; it will seem to you as if a sudden gust of wind turned your canopy. Keeping your hands towards your crotch as you flare can help prevent this (and also helps protect your elbows.) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites michaelflying 0 #9 September 16, 2003 Just don't smeer your rig and be ready to plf. Enjoywww.skydivekzn.co.za Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites bmcd308 0 #10 September 16, 2003 We gave a buy at our dz grief about his canopy selection until he decided he was going to do an intentional downwinder to prove to all of us that he could land it regardless of the conditions and shut us up once and for all. This does not immediately sound like a bad plan, but the wind was HONKING. We all told him that he might be better off showing us that we were idiots on a little less windy day. He kind of halfway agreed, and I thought the issue was postponed until another day. Then, at about 1500 feet, I notice him below me setting up his downwinder at the edge of the landing area. Now he had my full attention. When he turned off his base leg well away from the landing area, I saw that the wind had picked up even more. He looked like Mario Andretti with Attilla the Hun after him. He comes hauling in between the hanger and the campfire area, passes the peas, and starts his flare about two-thirds of the way across the landing area. To his credit, he did everything as close to perfect as could be done. Scrubbed off a ton of horizontal speed a couple of feet above the ground, left himself a little lift to do some foot dragging, and appeared to get enough speed scrubbed off to run it out. If he was Jesse Owens. I'm at about 800 feet now, circling the carnage, when I see this roostertail of cut grass behind him turn into step....step....step.... SPLAT. The magnitude of the faceplant has not been seen since the Big Bellyflop Contest of 1962. I shit you not there was a big dustcloud when he hit on his chest, and there was grass flying from his outstretched hands all the way over the top of his canopy as what turned out to be the last 20 mph or so of his ground speed got absorbed by his chest. I felt a little sick until I saw him pop up and brush himself off. When we got back to the hangar, I felt so guilty for causing it that I really didn't say anything. But true to form, he came over and gave me a big "I told you so" (because he was not dead) and pointed out that while he was tempted to turn a few degrees off the wind line, he had decided that doing the absolute max downwinder was not really going to wind up being all that much worse. The moral to this story is, if you are going to practice your crosswinders and downwinders, make sure to announce them so that everyone will watch. I have a perfect still picture in my head of the moment he went over forward, sending a cloud of dust and grass behind him, and it is one of my most treasured skydiving memories. Brent ---------------------------------- www.jumpelvis.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites davelepka 4 #11 September 16, 2003 Thats quite a story. I think the one point you are missing, is that if you intend to land in an alternate direction to the smart people, you need make provisions so that you are the absolute last one down, tandems included. It is not safe to have people landing in the same area going different directions. Your story indicates that you watched from under canopy, indicating that this jumper did not wait to land last, which puts others at risk from his stupid behavoir. What a jackass. Just to clarify, I do intentional downwind landings from time to time. I am not opposed to that, but when I do them other jumpers are notified, and I will pull high enough to make sure I am the last one down. Also I am not trying to prove anything to anyone. I have a thousands of jumps, with almost as many high performance landings, and the downwinders are just a fun change of pace. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites bmcd308 0 #12 September 16, 2003 He landed off to the side of the normal landing area, and we were jumping a Cessna, so there were only five of us landing anyway. It was not as dumb a move as I may have made it sound. It was funnier to watch than I could have possibly made it sound. ---------------------------------- www.jumpelvis.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites davelepka 4 #13 September 16, 2003 I'd say the fact that others questioned his canopy selection, then he decided that a downwind landing was a sufficient indicator of skill needed to silence the objectors, and that he did it on a day when the winds were "honking" is dumb enough; traffic problems notwithstanding. My advice to you is to file this story away in the back of your mind, and remember it in any situation where you be have to rely on this jumpers judgement for one reason or another. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites CanuckInUSA 0 #14 September 16, 2003 Is it just me or do other people agree. I don't like the title of this thread. I don't consider crosswind (and even downwind) screwed up landings. They are just another direction to land and a competent canopy should be able to land in any direction. As far as Angela is concerned, if you want to learn how to land crosswind, do one of three things: 1) Go do a hop n' pop and land crosswind and yes start off with light winds. The beauty of hop n' pops is that you have the airspace all to yourself. 2) Do a high altitude hop n' pop. This is similar to a hop n' pop except that you get more time to play with your canopy. This last weekend I was breaking in my new Crossfire2 canopy and I did ten high altitude hop n' pops and I really enjoyed chasing down the tandems and AFF students. The tandems knew I was there, but the AFFs were clueless (but I didn't try docking on either as I knew that might get me into trouble). 3) Announce to the load ahead of time that you're going to do a crosswind or a downwind landing if so inclined and land off away from everyone else. Crosswind landings aren't all that big of a deal. Just start with low winds and work your way up. Good luck and keep us posted. By the way, when is you canopy control course with Scott Miller? Try not to worry about the things you have no control over Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites jdog 0 #15 September 16, 2003 I love to land 90 degrees crosswind, when it is windy, and then carve back into the wind at the end of my swoop. This allows you to get a nice long swoop even when it is windy. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites SkydiveNFlorida 0 #16 September 16, 2003 Well, um, for me it'll probly be a screwed up landing. but, maybe not:) I wanted to hop n pop from alti, but they told me i'm not experienced enough:( I suppose maybe a combination of cloudiness and air traffic, then uppers being a bit strong, probably had something to do with it. thx, I will try after a few more jumps on the 150sf. Angela. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL. 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mjosparky 4 #6 September 16, 2003 I think it would be a good idea. But you may want to wait until you are completely comfortable with normal landings and maybe get a briefing from an instructor. Good luck.My idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkydiveNFlorida 0 #7 September 16, 2003 Cool, i'll do that! I can't jump yet, tho, cuz I don't have gear and it's really expensive to rent there (and the smallest rental they have a 170sf and the rig is NOT freefly friendly). I borrowed a rig, but i'd have to borrow/rent a main for it (with risers)... Do you guys demo canopies? Soon, tho,... verrrry verrrry soon, i'll have my own gear, and i'd LOVE to make a jump with you! Angela. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,107 #8 September 16, 2003 An excellent idea. Some suggestions: -Start slow. Choose a light wind day and land 45 degrees off the wind line, then 60, then 90. -Get advice from local experienced canopy pilots as to where to try this, how to do it, etc. -Avoid the tendency to "put your hand out to break your fall." This almost always turns you downwind; it will seem to you as if a sudden gust of wind turned your canopy. Keeping your hands towards your crotch as you flare can help prevent this (and also helps protect your elbows.) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
michaelflying 0 #9 September 16, 2003 Just don't smeer your rig and be ready to plf. Enjoywww.skydivekzn.co.za Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bmcd308 0 #10 September 16, 2003 We gave a buy at our dz grief about his canopy selection until he decided he was going to do an intentional downwinder to prove to all of us that he could land it regardless of the conditions and shut us up once and for all. This does not immediately sound like a bad plan, but the wind was HONKING. We all told him that he might be better off showing us that we were idiots on a little less windy day. He kind of halfway agreed, and I thought the issue was postponed until another day. Then, at about 1500 feet, I notice him below me setting up his downwinder at the edge of the landing area. Now he had my full attention. When he turned off his base leg well away from the landing area, I saw that the wind had picked up even more. He looked like Mario Andretti with Attilla the Hun after him. He comes hauling in between the hanger and the campfire area, passes the peas, and starts his flare about two-thirds of the way across the landing area. To his credit, he did everything as close to perfect as could be done. Scrubbed off a ton of horizontal speed a couple of feet above the ground, left himself a little lift to do some foot dragging, and appeared to get enough speed scrubbed off to run it out. If he was Jesse Owens. I'm at about 800 feet now, circling the carnage, when I see this roostertail of cut grass behind him turn into step....step....step.... SPLAT. The magnitude of the faceplant has not been seen since the Big Bellyflop Contest of 1962. I shit you not there was a big dustcloud when he hit on his chest, and there was grass flying from his outstretched hands all the way over the top of his canopy as what turned out to be the last 20 mph or so of his ground speed got absorbed by his chest. I felt a little sick until I saw him pop up and brush himself off. When we got back to the hangar, I felt so guilty for causing it that I really didn't say anything. But true to form, he came over and gave me a big "I told you so" (because he was not dead) and pointed out that while he was tempted to turn a few degrees off the wind line, he had decided that doing the absolute max downwinder was not really going to wind up being all that much worse. The moral to this story is, if you are going to practice your crosswinders and downwinders, make sure to announce them so that everyone will watch. I have a perfect still picture in my head of the moment he went over forward, sending a cloud of dust and grass behind him, and it is one of my most treasured skydiving memories. Brent ---------------------------------- www.jumpelvis.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
davelepka 4 #11 September 16, 2003 Thats quite a story. I think the one point you are missing, is that if you intend to land in an alternate direction to the smart people, you need make provisions so that you are the absolute last one down, tandems included. It is not safe to have people landing in the same area going different directions. Your story indicates that you watched from under canopy, indicating that this jumper did not wait to land last, which puts others at risk from his stupid behavoir. What a jackass. Just to clarify, I do intentional downwind landings from time to time. I am not opposed to that, but when I do them other jumpers are notified, and I will pull high enough to make sure I am the last one down. Also I am not trying to prove anything to anyone. I have a thousands of jumps, with almost as many high performance landings, and the downwinders are just a fun change of pace. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bmcd308 0 #12 September 16, 2003 He landed off to the side of the normal landing area, and we were jumping a Cessna, so there were only five of us landing anyway. It was not as dumb a move as I may have made it sound. It was funnier to watch than I could have possibly made it sound. ---------------------------------- www.jumpelvis.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
davelepka 4 #13 September 16, 2003 I'd say the fact that others questioned his canopy selection, then he decided that a downwind landing was a sufficient indicator of skill needed to silence the objectors, and that he did it on a day when the winds were "honking" is dumb enough; traffic problems notwithstanding. My advice to you is to file this story away in the back of your mind, and remember it in any situation where you be have to rely on this jumpers judgement for one reason or another. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CanuckInUSA 0 #14 September 16, 2003 Is it just me or do other people agree. I don't like the title of this thread. I don't consider crosswind (and even downwind) screwed up landings. They are just another direction to land and a competent canopy should be able to land in any direction. As far as Angela is concerned, if you want to learn how to land crosswind, do one of three things: 1) Go do a hop n' pop and land crosswind and yes start off with light winds. The beauty of hop n' pops is that you have the airspace all to yourself. 2) Do a high altitude hop n' pop. This is similar to a hop n' pop except that you get more time to play with your canopy. This last weekend I was breaking in my new Crossfire2 canopy and I did ten high altitude hop n' pops and I really enjoyed chasing down the tandems and AFF students. The tandems knew I was there, but the AFFs were clueless (but I didn't try docking on either as I knew that might get me into trouble). 3) Announce to the load ahead of time that you're going to do a crosswind or a downwind landing if so inclined and land off away from everyone else. Crosswind landings aren't all that big of a deal. Just start with low winds and work your way up. Good luck and keep us posted. By the way, when is you canopy control course with Scott Miller? Try not to worry about the things you have no control over Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jdog 0 #15 September 16, 2003 I love to land 90 degrees crosswind, when it is windy, and then carve back into the wind at the end of my swoop. This allows you to get a nice long swoop even when it is windy. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkydiveNFlorida 0 #16 September 16, 2003 Well, um, for me it'll probly be a screwed up landing. but, maybe not:) I wanted to hop n pop from alti, but they told me i'm not experienced enough:( I suppose maybe a combination of cloudiness and air traffic, then uppers being a bit strong, probably had something to do with it. thx, I will try after a few more jumps on the 150sf. Angela. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
