Ok so now I am a <300 Jump Wonder So When does it end?

[Ron 10]

Quote

But, with me it is when you quit walking into a reataurant, bar, etc. and think everyone who doesn't skydive should bow down and worship you because you do. It is when you quit skydiving for all the other people and how it makes you feel and start skydiving for yourself. You also become a much better skydiver and person soon after!

Yes, it kills me when new jumpers run around telling people that they jump...then trying to get the whuffos to go with them to the DZ....Hell I did it, I think we all did. We try to get them to experience this sport...But all we do is piss them off.

When you skydive for you, and only you....When it is something you do, and not a definiton of who you are. You have achieved a higher level......And in doing so, you really do become a skydiver.

Crutch that was perfect......This kind of knowledge can only come from years.

I really do wish we could bottle it.

Skills without egos.

Ron

"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

[Ron 10]

Quote

Next question - should 2600-3000 jump wonders listen to beginners every once in a while?

Of course, but you know that....

What makes a XXX-jump wonder is when you think your knowlegde is so great that you don't listen.

It is more common when you have less jumps...I listen more now than when I had 500 jumps.

Its like the old joke: Teenagers! Tired of having to listen to your parents? Move out now and get a job while you still know everything!

Same can be said for some 300 jump wonders.

They think they know more than folks with 10X their experience, and they don't listen to well ment advice.

"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334

[happythoughts 0]

Quote

This kind of knowledge can only come from years.

Dungbeetle, you may leave the temple.

[dterrick 0]

Quote

my non riding/non jumping friends still think that I will die.. but there is no helping whuffos now is there?

Well, Age, that's only because of your insane concept of taking the ricerocket to C-23-D speeds and then deploying your chute to attempt the swoop of all swoops .

Dave

PS: I'm alive again...

Life is very short and there's no time for fussing and fighting my friend (Lennon/McCartney)

[masher 1]

Quote

30....Holy shit!!!! What was Jesus's 10 second delay really like?

One of our instructors was dispatched by Leonardo, and flown by Wilbur on his first jump....

--
Arching is overrated - Marlies

[Tonto 1]

I'm a 4000 jump wonder!

I wonder every weekend if I will ever know as much about skydiving as I thought I knew when I had 150 jumps.

Education is a long, slow process of revealing your own ignorance.

t

It's the year of the Pig.

[DanglesOZQld 0]

Jump numbers mean little if someone does stupid things. "Stupid is as stupid does" I have heard from some sources more than once! BSBD -Mark.

"A Scar is just a Tattoo with a story!!!"

[murps2000 86]

Quote

Next question - should 2600-3000 jump wonders listen to beginners every once in a while?

Yes! Definitely!
I realised a while ago that the hardest thing to learn in skydiving is anything you have to learn from someone with less experience than you. I've seen 4000, 5000, 6000, & 7000+ jump wonders, who cannot learn to freefly unless they learn it from someone who has more jumps than them. It's kind of sad, really. Not to many coaches out there with that much experience, but plenty with less, and a lot to teach. I hope I never become like that.

[diverdriver 7]

Quote

Quote

Next question - should 2600-3000 jump wonders listen to beginners every once in a while?

Yes! Definitely!
I realised a while ago that the hardest thing to learn in skydiving is anything you have to learn from someone with less experience than you. I've seen 4000, 5000, 6000, & 7000+ jump wonders, who cannot learn to freefly unless they learn it from someone who has more jumps than them. It's kind of sad, really. Not to many coaches out there with that much experience, but plenty with less, and a lot to teach. I hope I never become like that.

You know, it might not be jump numbers getting in the way of instructing. It might be the instructor not being able to relate to the student who has more jumps than they do. That, and the neon blue hair and endless piercings might also be a distraction to professional instruction.

Message sent is not always message recieved and a good instructor will be able to adjust to help the student learn.

Chris Schindler
www.diverdriver.com
ATP/D-19012
FB #4125

[Michele 1]

I have a question.

There is a 3000 jump number person, who has said "thing X".
There is a 2500 jump number person, who has said "thing Y".

I look at both positions - both have validity, but are directly opposed to each other. Because the 2500 jump number person knows me, understands my thought process, and knows my abilities, his "thing Y" makes more sense.

But the 3000 jump number person gets all bent outta shape, and yells to the world "someone" is not being safe, gets exasperated and frustrated and thinks he is being ignored.

So, what does one do then???

(My former instructor, who is also my rigger, has already given me my answer...I am just curious as to what the general opinion would be here?)

Ciels-
Michele

~Do Angels keep the dreams we seek
While our hearts lie bleeding?~

[happythoughts 0]

Quote

So, what does one do then???

Talk to the dz S&TA. That is this persons responsibility. Ask their opinion. Quote that opinion and the source.

[murps2000 86]

Quote

You know, it might not be jump numbers getting in the way of instructing. It might be the instructor not being able to relate to the student who has more jumps than they do. That, and the neon blue hair and endless piercings might also be a distraction to professional instruction.

Message sent is not always message recieved and a good instructor will be able to adjust to help the student learn.

There may be some validity to what you say, but I can't agree with you completely because in the situations to which I refer, it did not reach a point where any information was even attempted to be gleaned. Some of the very experienced jumpers I knew had decades of RW experience, and were interested in this new fad of freeflying, even to the point of purchasing new freefly suits before they had really done any freefly jumps. But they simply wouldn't accept any offers for pointers from us 500 jump wonders, even though they were just starting out, and were at a level where basic instruction from anyone would have helped. They instead had to get coaching from the Flyboyz, and Adrien Nicholas, and paid $75 a jump to have those guys chase them around the sky. We jump wonders chuckled when we saw the videos, and just shook our heads. It was sad, because they had coached us on our bellies years earlier, and we would have been happy to return the favor, and chase them around for free. And what's worse, they finally just gave up and sold their nice new suits. So I stand by my statement. It's hard to learn from someone with less experience, and I hope I never become like that. In fact, I want to learn some CRW, and I hope one of my tandem students that I send off to AFF will come back one day and maybe teach it to me.

[sdgregory 0]

You know this XXX-jump wonder thing should actually read XXX-blah blah wonder thing. For example someone pointed out motorcycles and someone mentioned children.

If I have learned anything it is (and I know I have said this in some other post before) experience matters. It does not matter what you are doing, there is always going to be someone who is too full of themselves to listen to anyone. Hell, I even think that if we all looked at every aspect of our lives there will be some instance where we thought we knew more than we did and would not listen to the voice of experience. I think that the problem here is that, in skydiving, when someone blows that voice off, they are not just putting themselves at risk they are putting us all at risk.

On the other side there are those with great experience that are so full of themselves that they will not listen to the voice of reason. Again every aspect of life could be covered by the XXX-blah blah wonders.

I only hope that if I think about doing something stupid (like swooping on my very next jump- I only have 31) that one of you will smack me upside the head and say "Knucklehead, you think about doing that and I will burn your rig so you cannot jump."


Oh and on the kid thing I never had anyone say "You have 3? Wait till you have XX . . . I have three and what I was told (and it is true) is 'once you have three you might as well keep going because you are outnumbered anyway'. Maybe I should have stopped at 2 . . .

[diverdriver 7]

Sounds like very situational position. As a matter, I have had pilots with more hours than me come for advice on flying skydivers. I guess some people can deal, and some can't.

Chris Schindler
www.diverdriver.com
ATP/D-19012
FB #4125

[murps2000 86]

Quote

Sounds like very situational position. As a matter, I have had pilots with more hours than me come for advice on flying skydivers. I guess some people can deal, and some can't.

Yes, it is a situational position, from situational experience. As is yours. And I could recount a few more experiences, as well. What stands out most in my mind, however, is the fact that I've felt the sting of the pride stab, myself, when a less experienced jumper has taught me a trick or two in the packing area, and in the air. But I recognized the logic in accepting what they taught me regardless of how I felt about it. So I guess you're last statement pretty well sums it up. Some people can't deal, and I hope I always can. The day I can't is the day I stop learning.

[skypuppy 1]

Quote

Quote

Quote

Next question - should 2600-3000 jump wonders listen to beginners every once in a while?

Yes! Definitely!
I realised a while ago that the hardest thing to learn in skydiving is anything you have to learn from someone with less experience than you. I've seen 4000, 5000, 6000, & 7000+ jump wonders, who cannot learn to freefly unless they learn it from someone who has more jumps than them. It's kind of sad, really. Not to many coaches out there with that much experience, but plenty with less, and a lot to teach. I hope I never become like that.

You know, it might not be jump numbers getting in the way of instructing. It might be the instructor not being able to relate to the student who has more jumps than they do. That, and the neon blue hair and endless piercings might also be a distraction to professional instruction.

Message sent is not always message recieved and a good instructor will be able to adjust to help the student learn.

You know there might be something else involved here too, like lacking muscle memory of desired positions and movements, fighting against years and thousands of jumps of other muscle memory... I encounter the same things myself after a couple of thousand jumps doing rw, crw and accuracy, freeflying just doesn't seem to come naturally to me... And it's easy to get discouraged and give up when you seem to be simply wasting your money and what's worse, your jumps and time... Being an old guy ain't easy...

If some old guy can do it then obviously it can't be very extreme. Otherwise he'd already be dead.
Bruce McConkey 'I thought we were gonna die, and I couldn't think of anyone

[diverdriver 7]

Quote

You know there might be something else involved here too, like lacking muscle memory of desired positions and movements, fighting against years and thousands of jumps of other muscle memory... I encounter the same things myself after a couple of thousand jumps doing rw, crw and accuracy, freeflying just doesn't seem to come naturally to me... And it's easy to get discouraged and give up when you seem to be simply wasting your money and what's worse, your jumps and time... Being an old guy ain't easy...

Well.....then there's that too.