Skailz 0 #1 April 20, 2004 I'm curious right now... A long time ago I saw a skydiver hook himself to a truck that was used as an anchor using a long rope. The rope was connected to the center of his chest strap. The Winds that day were gusting 20-30 mph. With the help of a few others, the wind lifted this guy up in the air like a kite. I would not do that.. but... I have a jeep and a 220 square foot canopy. In my head I'm thinking... how cool would it be to have someone pull me around in a large, flat field to see if I could get airborn at least a few feet. 5 - 10 feet is all I would hope for. On a zero wind day too. I've thought about purchasing an offroad skateboard or sled so that I would not have to run during liftoff.. and design the cable pulling me so that I could release it instantly if needs be and just float back down. Again this is all in my head. I have a radio controlled jeep and a parachute shaped kite, and that worked ok, givin that no one could steer the kite at that time. My question is, has anyone ever done that and what do you think? Maybe I'm nuts, but I think it would be safe if done properly and with common sense. Blue Skies, ~Skailz~ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Unstable 9 #2 April 20, 2004 QuoteMy question is, has anyone ever done that and what do you think? Maybe I'm nuts, but I think it would be safe if done properly and with common sense. This has been tried a number of times by bored skydivers on cloudy days. More than once this has resulted in a Fatality - Especially with a RAM air parachute, the chance of you doing any turn more than 15 degrees or so would auger you into the ground - - - - - Don't do it dude, please....=========Shaun ========== Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Unstable 9 #3 April 20, 2004 Perhapsing we could get this moved to the Bonfire....=========Shaun ========== Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AggieDave 6 #4 April 20, 2004 QuoteI think it would be safe if done properly and with common sense. There's a serious problem with this line. Common sense must not be used in order to do this, also it can not be done safe and definately can't be done "properly" except behind a boat with designed gear. Quite a few folks have been seriously injured doing this over the years at DZs, some have even died, some have had life altering injuries...basically the short story is: its not a good idea, if you do decide to do it, let me know since I'll could make some money by selling the soon to be very bad video to RealTV!--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Skailz 0 #5 April 20, 2004 That's all I need to know... :) Thanks guys.. I don't think I'll try it considering that info. I've never known anyone that tried cept for the one human kite guy about 5 years ago that I mentioned. I agree the RAM air could be tricky with no room for error. Blue Skies, ~Skailz~ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sdctlc 0 #6 April 20, 2004 Thread recently on the subject..... http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=994699;#994699 Scott C."He who Hesitates Shall Inherit the Earth!" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Skailz 0 #7 April 20, 2004 Uber, thanks for that thread link too. :) Blue Skies, ~Skailz~ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Skailz 0 #8 April 20, 2004 Has anyone gone running down steep hill and got it to lift off the ground for a few seconds? Just curious.. cuz I've thought about that too and have seen it done on video.. of course they got roughed up a little from falling and rolling, I expect that much. Blue Skies, ~Skailz~ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AggieDave 6 #9 April 20, 2004 Yup, that's actually a new and growing sport. There's a forum dedicated to it here: http://canopypiloting.tempwebpage.com/cgi-bin/gforum/gforum.cgi? Its more of a high-performance canopy pilot sort of thing in this regard. Or a paragliding thing otherwise. If you're really interested in it, you should look into paragliding. --"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Unstable 9 #10 April 20, 2004 PLENTY of skydivers (Myself Included) have tied a canopy to a creeper and zipped around on that - I have a video of myself doing that and shooting up 3 feet in the air, landing flat on my butt on the concrete, jamming my tailbone and screwing up my back. I'm going to try to get that video posted here....=========Shaun ========== Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Skailz 0 #11 April 20, 2004 Creeper? Never heard of that.. Blue Skies, ~Skailz~ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AggieDave 6 #12 April 20, 2004 A creeper. Sort of like a mechanic's creeper to slide under cars and such, but specially cut with better wheels for practicing RW on the ground and in the right orientation to earth.--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Skailz 0 #13 April 20, 2004 Ahh, I get it.. duh. I never think about creepers since I free-fly. I can imagine that would hurt your tail bone. Well, I thought about getting an off road skateboard, or making one, so that I can get momentum down a decent hill, be on my feet, and still have my hands free. I used to skateboard for about 5 years, so I would feel comfortable as possible trying that out... maybe wear some elbow pads and strap a pillow to my @ss :) I would think the hardest part would be to get the parachute up above you and on heading in the first place. They need off road roller-blades. Anyone know the best way to get a canopy up and on heading on your feet? I assume it can be done alone if needs be? I would guess to grab the front risors and run first. Ground launching is brand new to me... Blue Skies, ~Skailz~ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shropshire 0 #14 April 20, 2004 Hi All, If you are really serious about this..... Please visist your nearest Tow Launch PARAGLIDING site. They are properly equiped. You NEED a tow launch release in the line or you really can die! If you 'glider' rotates it can Lock-out and drill you into the deck (fast). (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
adamsr 0 #15 April 20, 2004 Lots of people practicing accuracy used to do it years ago, getting winch launches up to about 700 feet where they would disconnect the cable the do an accuracy landing, just worked out cheaper than jumping from aircraft, plus you dont have to pack!!! Accuracy canopies are completely different to modern sports canopies and generally loaded less than the average fun jumper's canopy so i wouldn't reccomend trying it with a sports canopy any time soon!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skybytch 273 #16 April 20, 2004 Quotethat's actually a new and growing sport. New? Ground launching has been done for years. There's a blurb about it in Poynter's Parachute Manual - volume 1 even. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
steve1 5 #17 April 20, 2004 I don't think ram-air canopies are made for this. We used to do this sometimes with para-commanders. The first time I tried this was on a hot calm day. I ended up taking about 20 foot strides behind a car on a paved road. I never did get up. When I reached the point where my legs wouldn't keep up with the car I fell over and got drug on the pavement. I had a huge burn on the side of my face and bruised both heels so bad that I was walking on my toes for almost a month after. This is a good lesson in what not to do.....I might add I also put several large burns in my brand new para-commander that had to be repaired by a Master Rigger in Spokane. This took months and I had to jump a 28 ft. round in the mean time. Of course this was back when I was young and dumb and I'm a whole lot smarter now.....Steve1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Pammi 0 #18 April 20, 2004 Quote...if you do decide to do it, let me know since I'll could make some money by selling the soon to be very bad video to RealTV! OH! Good idea! I'll get our video out today! The lightening in the background was way cool for effect too! Not sure what kind of redneck that makes me that I did something Dave is advising against! Oh, and it wasn't standard gear. Huge-a$$ chute and even a cutaway rigged to kick loose with your foot when you were done. NO, I'm not saying go do it. Visited a DZ, looked like fun, did it, NOT recommending it! Pammi Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cvfd1399 0 #19 April 20, 2004 I have a 340sf that I want to try the same thing but over water with a boat. I figured I would not go over 5-10 feet high, and if something happens, it would be just like falling off a knee board. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pilotdave 0 #20 April 20, 2004 I posted a link to a 1968 technical paper on the development of ram air canopies in the history and trivia forum. Ground launching was actually one of the intended uses for ram air canopies originally. Here's a quote from the paper: "During tethered tests of an ND .7 (313) [313 square foot, 0.7 aspect ratio] para-foil at the University of Notre Dame in 1965, two graduate students were inadvertantly lifted into the air. Manned flight soon became standard practice. In the resulting ascending flight test program students were towed to altitudes of 500-1000 ft, first with and then later without the cart..., released from the tow line, and allowed to glide freely back to earth. By pulling suspension lines attached to the trailing edge, the student was able to conduct a flare-out maneuver and practically eliminate his horizontal and vertical velocity components and simply step down to a one-foot landing. The confidence gained through these early manned ascending flight experiences, and extensive unmanned deployment tests lead to the first manned aircraft jumps of the para-foil in 1966 at the Univeristy of Notre Dame..." It's definitely no new idea... it's exactly how we ended up jumping ram air canopies. Dave Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
flypunk 0 #21 April 20, 2004 It can be done safely with the right system and the right canopy. I've seen it done several times on windy days, however they were crw dogs or canopy demo pilots. Makes good video, but you have to be nuts to do it. ... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AggieDave 6 #22 April 20, 2004 I did not know that, so I learned something new today. Thanks!--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Merrick 0 #23 April 20, 2004 QuoteQuote...if you do decide to do it, let me know since I'll could make some money by selling the soon to be very bad video to RealTV! OH! Good idea! I'll get our video out today! The lightening in the background was way cool for effect too! Not sure what kind of redneck that makes me that I did something Dave is advising against! Oh, and it wasn't standard gear. Huge-a$$ chute and even a cutaway rigged to kick loose with your foot when you were done. NO, I'm not saying go do it. Visited a DZ, looked like fun, did it, NOT recommending it! Pammi ROFL - Yeah, there are a few things I've done since I started jumping that I'm not real proud of, and probably shouldn't have done (in retrospect)... but damn, it sure was fun! Just a little to add to Pam's post. We were using an old Unit 230 hooked to a harness that someone altered to be used specifically for this purpose. There was a three-ring release hooked to the attachment point that you could kick out of at any time. The tow rope was about 200' long, so we probably got up to about 100-150' or so. This DZ has done this several times and never had a problem. Granted, that doesn't mean that the danger isn't there.... And, it extends to the people in the towing vehicle. The video is pretty cool actually, and the way it launched was kind of unbelievable until I actually saw it. They had the towee stand facing in to the wind, with the canopy spread out behind them. two or three assistants would hold the canopy up to help inflate it, while the towee holds half brakes. The guy driving the truck punches it and you're lifted straight off the ground. It was actually a pretty smooth transition from land to air. Like I said, it's not something I would do again, or even suggest doing... but it was pretty fun. Blues! Merrick Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,118 #24 April 20, 2004 >I figured I would not go over 5-10 feet high, and if something >happens, it would be just like falling off a knee board. Two bad assumptions! Use a release if you're going to try it. Water can easily kill someone even under canopy - there was a fatality a few years ago in Rantoul when someone hit the swoop pond under canopy. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
calphoto 0 #25 April 20, 2004 During Air Force Pilot Training back in the 80's, we would spend two weeks learning PLF's from platforms in case we had to eject. Graduation from this stage of training was to take us out to a large open field, hook us up to a tow line, and start running to inflate the 28' canopy behind us. It seemed that I got up a couple of hundred feet, at which point the truck stopped and we came down under canopy to practice what we had learned. Instead of ankle/knee/hip/shoulder though, I did knees/chest/face. As I remember, one or two students suffered twisted ankles in the whole process, despite jump boots. Back in the 70's, the Navy did boat tows for aircrew, again taking us up a couple of hundred feet above San Diego Harbor before we pulled the cable release. We came down in the water and tried not to drown as the canopy covered us. This training also included being towed in harness by the boat, and floating around in the rafts shooting at other rafts with our pen flares. Thus I tell people I have four jumps but six landings. I have always thought that a truck tow would be great on a low cloud day, but ONLY under a round, probably a PC. Ever see a kite take a dive into the ground? With the inexperienced, THAT would be what a steerable square would do. Better the balanced lift of a round. It was a lot of fun. At Hartwood, we also did the PC hooked to a sled on a high wind day. Once we got the PC oriented properly, it really took off. Made some great videos.Hartwood Paracenter - The closest DZ to DC! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
