skylord 1 #1 January 25, 2004 All, I wanted to start a new thread rather than post on page 5 of an established thread. I read every post that talks about skydiving and safety. I want to give a perspective that may explain some of the diversity on this issue. As a newcomer, I have many, many, natural preconceptions about what the f#$@ I'm doing throwing myself at a planet from two miles up. As a newbie, I tend to focus on the negative. The view I had of skydiving was that is was fun, but a near certain suicide attempt. Too much could go wrong. If you would have asked me before I looked into it, I would have surmised that maybe half of all skydivers died in accidents. My interest, no, more than that, my drive to try this sport was sorely tempered by my assumptions. You only hear/read about the stuff that goes wrong. That's why I took it up at 45, and only after rigorous review of the technology. Anyway, I need balance. From my perspective originally as a "near suicide attempt", yes, skydiving is much safer than that. I think that is where many of us come from when we newbies reply to polls or posts on the safety of skydiving. From those of you very experienced, I think the point of reference is exactly the opposite. You have realized it isn't automatic suicide, but bad shit can happen. You've made enough jumps to know that it is OK to jump out of an airplane, but also seen enough to know that things can go wrong. But due to your experience you have a MUCH more realistic view of how often and why things go wrong, and train yourselves to understand and realize that. So, for newbies and experienced jumpers to debate the safety of skydiving back and forth is a bit frustrating for both sides, I think. We blind people are on different sides of the elephant. I'll only speak for me. I have to tell myself I have a very good chance of a much more successful outcome than my imagination says. It is a proper defense mechanism for where I am at. I think for those of you more experienced in skydiving, there is a different mindset. You're comfortable going out the door, and to keep complacency from setting in your defense mechanism looks at the dive from a much different perspective. Does this make sense? Should I shut up and color? Just to re-emphasize, I have viewed my AFF training so far, down deep inside, as a dismal, pitiful failure. Why? I busted level 2, and tumbled my level 6 exit. Now, if you ask the experienced instructors, they have a much different view of my progression to date. But because I'm new and see it only from my perspective, I have a skewed view of the reality of my training. That's it. I'm safer laying in a hammock waiting for a heart attack, than working out so I can skydive well. But it is one hell of a lot less fun. And that just isn't me. BobBob Marks "-when you leave the airplane its all wrong til it goes right, its a whole different mindset, this is why you have system redundancy." Mattaman Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Shark 0 #2 January 25, 2004 Interesting perspective. Now when we gonna do Level 6? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skylord 1 #3 January 25, 2004 QuoteInteresting perspective. Now when we gonna do Level 6? As soon as I'm not infectious anymore...cough. BobBob Marks "-when you leave the airplane its all wrong til it goes right, its a whole different mindset, this is why you have system redundancy." Mattaman Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zoter 0 #4 January 25, 2004 Interesting viewpoint indeed... I have 50 ish jumps and went through AFF less than 5 months ago....I too definately felt during AFF ( and beyond) that I was almost certainly going to have something horrible happen to me everytime I jumped out.. During AFF, I relied on my instructers to keep me safe ...and that gave me a level of comfort.....and I think it must go in waves....on my own I got very nervous jumping out ...and then it got better....and then it got freaky again !......at only a few more jumps than you I now dont quite have that same anxiety before the jump...but I still get butterflies everytime ! If I didnt...Im sure it would detract from the overall experience. Things that helped me...number one becoming more and more familiar with equipment (jumping your first packjob is almost as anxious as your first jump itself!, but after that, you feel alot more relaxed...why? cause YOU packed it and you know you have had at least one of your packjobs open) Also talk to people at your same and just above your current level....get their experinces of your concerns and talk about what aspects are the most concerning...you realise fast you are not alone ! Oh yeah and jumps....lots...rather than a busy day and then leaving it for weeks....jump a little but frequently just my thoughts man.... take it or leave it By the way I fluffed 2 AFF levels as well....and what I did on them levels by accident ...I trying to learn consistantly now !! backflying !!...see what goes around (and up and down) comes around ( and up and down) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites mwabd1 0 #5 January 26, 2004 I always thought that the danger factor and the slight chance of death was part of the attraction. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites livnbored 0 #6 January 28, 2004 QuoteI think for those of you more experienced in skydiving, there is a different mindset. You're comfortable going out the door, and to keep complacency from setting in your defense mechanism looks at the dive from a much different perspective. This makes sense... for my first 50 or so skydives I'm not sure I would let my cognitive brain understand I was in an airplane, let alone jumping out of one. (Someone's calling the men in the white coats aren't they?) But, it was my defense mechanism. There was so much to take in and so much to think about every second that I didn't want my "old ideas" kicking in and distracting me. I think I had about 60 or 70 jumps when I could finally let myself be aware that I was jumping out of an airplane... funny though, the reality didn't change, it was just easier to deal with because I could trust my brain to function under those circumstances at that point. It justs gets better. Of course, I was a big scaredy cat...... by the way, I don't mean that i was brain dead everytime I jumped... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites skyyhi 0 #7 January 29, 2004 How did I miss this post. Yeah, I really like your perspective here. It fits me. Although now I don't get the "door anxiety", I still get the butterflies and on my way to the dropzone I have to talk myself into continuing to drive there and not turn around and go home. We have a lot in common starting late in life. We really have nothing to prove. My friend, I look forward to seeing you at the Instructor Event at Elsinore. . .we may finally be able to share that 2nd beer together. Take care my friend.________________________________________ Take risks not to escape life… but to prevent life from escaping. ~ A bumper sticker at the DZ FGF #6 Darcy Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites SpinDoctor 0 #8 January 29, 2004 QuoteOh yeah and jumps....lots...rather than a busy day and then leaving it for weeks....jump a little but frequently I would disagree or at least rationalise it depending what you are doing. As an FS / RW coach - I would suggest to a potential RW student, saving up time and money to jump lots over a weekend, rather than once a weekend for months. Each time they get back in the air (RW skills wise) they would have to 're-learn' what they would have already covered. Better to do many jumps in a weekend and progress further towards your goal. However, I can also see the benefit of jumping with regularity as a new student - to get used to the actual 'jumping' from a 'plane. Depends where you're at and what you are doing.----------------------- Connextion: British 8 Way Team www.bodyflight.co.uk ----------------------- Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites SpinDoctor 0 #9 January 29, 2004 I am just shooting off thoughts here - no particular order or response. No one was born in free fall with a rig on their back... NO-ONE There are a few things to overcome, and as a student, one seemingly have to do them all at the same time in the early stages. ...OH MY GOD! - I am about to jump out of a 'plane ...Will this damn thing open (repeat as necessary) ...Then there is the pressure of learning very new and necessary skills and being scrutinised by the intstuctors as to the ability of that individual to have picked those skills up successfully. ...Probably some more stuff in here too Some people fair better than others. I did AFF nearly 3 years ago - and failed some levels and had to repeat. Some people fly through all 8 (whatever) levels. Some don't. I ended up spinning like a mutha on one jump. Over time you will learn to trust your kit, training, ability - it just takes time for all of these things to line up all at the same time. Even when you think you have them (which you never should) something new comes along - and pushes your boundaries again - freeflying, wingsuit, even a different pair of gloves or jumping a different aircraft for the first time. Or maybe I'm just scared I think that is the crux - 'fear' of the first time (I think it has much to do with an inbuilt dread of buying beerIt's all good - jump and be happy----------------------- Connextion: British 8 Way Team www.bodyflight.co.uk ----------------------- Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Ron 10 #10 January 29, 2004 Good post... QuoteI think for those of you more experienced in skydiving, there is a different mindset. You're comfortable going out the door, and to keep complacency from setting in your defense mechanism looks at the dive from a much different perspective. Which do you think has a better picture of the EVENT that is a skydive? The guy that has been in it for years and has done it many times, or the guy that is in AFF? QuoteDoes this make sense? Should I shut up and color? Just to re-emphasize, I have viewed my AFF training so far, down deep inside, as a dismal, pitiful failure. Why? I busted level 2, and tumbled my level 6 exit. Now, if you ask the experienced instructors, they have a much different view of my progression to date. But because I'm new and see it only from my perspective, I have a skewed view of the reality of my training. And we don't have a skewed view....You didn't fail...you lived and thats the main thing. you just didn't meet the TLO's for those levels....Guess what? No one will care in 2 years and 300 more jumps that you didn't pass AFF in 7 levels."No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites skyyhi 0 #11 January 29, 2004 QuoteWhich do you think has a better picture of the EVENT that is a skydive? The guy that has been in it for years and has done it many times, or the guy that is in AFF? That's a good question Ron. I don't really have an answer as I am too new in the sport and still on student status. I think that the question of "who has a better picture" may be less significant than what that picture looks like. During my first 6, no.. .make that 7 AFF jumps, just getting myself out the door was the BIG picture. Once out the door, for me, I was able to relax and get into the dive. I LOVE freefall. Now, as a solo student, my picture of this thing we do is MUCH different than it was during AFF. It doesn't make the picture better or worse, just different. That is infinitely more significant.________________________________________ Take risks not to escape life… but to prevent life from escaping. ~ A bumper sticker at the DZ FGF #6 Darcy Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites WeakMindedFool 0 #12 January 29, 2004 Ron...wanted to reply in the other thread but it was getting a little...pointless. Now I have very few skydives so my opinion counts for little to anyone but me (so now I'm going to give it anyway LOL). I agree with you absolutely! Anyone who thinks skydiving is "safe" isn't paying attention. The fact is that one of two things are going to happen when you jump out of an airplane, you are going to live or you are going to die. I know of no other activity where doing nothing will absolutely kill you (yah yah CYPRESS, it may or may not save you). Our emergency procedures must be implemented immediately and in the correct order or the consequeces WILL be...spectacular. Now here's the thing, I don't fear the environment. I have little or no anxiety about jumping and never have. My fear 'o' meter is broken, not just in skydiving but in about everything. Now I'm just guessing here but many people will equate fear to dangerous, this is wrong. I don't expect anyone to fear, but to make the jump from I don't fear to I am safe, is what I think your warning against. One should never forget that an environment is leathal. The moment you loose respect for the danger, Murphy will most definitly leave a mark! Peace!Faith in a holy cause is to a considerable extent a substitute for lost faith in ourselves. -Eric Hoffer - Check out these Videos Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Ron 10 #13 January 30, 2004 Quote I think that the question of "who has a better picture" may be less significant than what that picture looks like. You are kinda missing my point. To a student they are thinking about the big things. Mainly not dying. That point of view is valid, but missing the big picture. Sometimes they lie to themselves (or are lied to by others) and told that skydiving is safe....Its not. It is a very dangerous situation that you put yourself into. You have 1:30 seconds to stop a most certain death. To add in some fun we only try to stop it in the last 15-20 seconds. Name one sport where you start a chain of events that WILL end in your death if you don't do the right thing in 15-20 seconds. Now add in the fact that when you try to stop your death...things like malfuntions could happen that put you right back into a life a death struggle. Now more seasoned jumpers know this, and with training and equipment you can limit the risk so that it is acceptable. But never forget that you WILL die if you screw up...And even if you do everything right you could STILL die. Its not about the PERCEPTION of the event...To you a 1 min skydive where your main goal is to survive is very short....To me, If I did a solo...It would be the longets 1:30 you could imagine...Hell I might even get bored. Thats perception. The event is started when you put yourself in imediate harms way..And only training will save you. Do you see the difference?"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Ron 10 #14 January 30, 2004 QuoteNow I have very few skydives so my opinion counts for little to anyone but me If your opinion only mattered to you...Then I would not be reading it.... QuoteAnyone who thinks skydiving is "safe" isn't paying attention. The fact is that one of two things are going to happen when you jump out of an airplane, you are going to live or you are going to die. I know of no other activity where doing nothing will absolutely kill you Our emergency procedures must be implemented immediately and in the correct order or the consequeces WILL be...spectacular Bingo!!! You don't have to fear it...just respect it."No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Bodyflight.Net 0 #15 January 30, 2004 Interestingly similar to something I said once in regards to skydiving and how this newbie sees it: fear will paralyze you.. RESPECT will empower you.. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Ron 10 #16 January 30, 2004 QuoteInterestingly similar to something I said once in regards to skydiving and how this newbie sees it Yep, and I never said anything about it did I?"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites skyyhi 0 #17 January 30, 2004 QuoteDo you see the difference? Absolutely. . .but that is not what I thought you were talking about. That makes perfect sense. . .and I agree completely. Except that now soloing is the LONGEST dive in history. I can't wait to be able to jump with others again. but in my original answer, I was thinking more about the perception of the skydive you get once you are safely on the ground. . .what it actually means to you. . .that perception changes as your experience grows also. . .________________________________________ Take risks not to escape life… but to prevent life from escaping. ~ A bumper sticker at the DZ FGF #6 Darcy Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites skylord 1 #18 February 5, 2004 QuoteGood post...Quote Thanks, Ron. QuoteWhich do you think has a better picture of the EVENT that is a skydive? The guy that has been in it for years and has done it many times, or the guy that is in AFF? This is a great, great question. I had to think it over for a few days. Without a doubt, the vets win hands down. Much more realistic, without the visceral emotional reactions/defense mechanisms us newcomers attach to learning a sport against which the deepest part of your being rebels. QuoteAnd we don't have a skewed view....You didn't fail...you lived and thats the main thing. you just didn't meet the TLO's for those levels....Guess what? No one will care in 2 years and 300 more jumps that you didn't pass AFF in 7 levels. True point, and one my instructors reemphasize. Thanks for the reply, and I look forward to progressing through this journey! BobBob Marks "-when you leave the airplane its all wrong til it goes right, its a whole different mindset, this is why you have system redundancy." Mattaman Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Shark 0 #19 February 9, 2004 Bob, Remember this skydive? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites skylord 1 #20 February 10, 2004 QuoteBob, Remember this skydive? Oh, yeah! Thanks for the pics, Shark! As you can tell, my training wheels were stiff, so I was obviously reponsible for the stability of the entire formation on my own. I did just that with legs that to the untrained eye appear to be flailing, Actually, this is my AFF-1 dive with Shark and Tom. These pics don't worry me. I'm afraid of the Elsinore Instructor Burnout Boogie shots (oops, bad choice of words), uh photos....... Thanks again, man, for the pics, the support, and jumping with me!! BobBob Marks "-when you leave the airplane its all wrong til it goes right, its a whole different mindset, this is why you have system redundancy." Mattaman Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. 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mwabd1 0 #5 January 26, 2004 I always thought that the danger factor and the slight chance of death was part of the attraction. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
livnbored 0 #6 January 28, 2004 QuoteI think for those of you more experienced in skydiving, there is a different mindset. You're comfortable going out the door, and to keep complacency from setting in your defense mechanism looks at the dive from a much different perspective. This makes sense... for my first 50 or so skydives I'm not sure I would let my cognitive brain understand I was in an airplane, let alone jumping out of one. (Someone's calling the men in the white coats aren't they?) But, it was my defense mechanism. There was so much to take in and so much to think about every second that I didn't want my "old ideas" kicking in and distracting me. I think I had about 60 or 70 jumps when I could finally let myself be aware that I was jumping out of an airplane... funny though, the reality didn't change, it was just easier to deal with because I could trust my brain to function under those circumstances at that point. It justs gets better. Of course, I was a big scaredy cat...... by the way, I don't mean that i was brain dead everytime I jumped... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skyyhi 0 #7 January 29, 2004 How did I miss this post. Yeah, I really like your perspective here. It fits me. Although now I don't get the "door anxiety", I still get the butterflies and on my way to the dropzone I have to talk myself into continuing to drive there and not turn around and go home. We have a lot in common starting late in life. We really have nothing to prove. My friend, I look forward to seeing you at the Instructor Event at Elsinore. . .we may finally be able to share that 2nd beer together. Take care my friend.________________________________________ Take risks not to escape life… but to prevent life from escaping. ~ A bumper sticker at the DZ FGF #6 Darcy Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SpinDoctor 0 #8 January 29, 2004 QuoteOh yeah and jumps....lots...rather than a busy day and then leaving it for weeks....jump a little but frequently I would disagree or at least rationalise it depending what you are doing. As an FS / RW coach - I would suggest to a potential RW student, saving up time and money to jump lots over a weekend, rather than once a weekend for months. Each time they get back in the air (RW skills wise) they would have to 're-learn' what they would have already covered. Better to do many jumps in a weekend and progress further towards your goal. However, I can also see the benefit of jumping with regularity as a new student - to get used to the actual 'jumping' from a 'plane. Depends where you're at and what you are doing.----------------------- Connextion: British 8 Way Team www.bodyflight.co.uk ----------------------- Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SpinDoctor 0 #9 January 29, 2004 I am just shooting off thoughts here - no particular order or response. No one was born in free fall with a rig on their back... NO-ONE There are a few things to overcome, and as a student, one seemingly have to do them all at the same time in the early stages. ...OH MY GOD! - I am about to jump out of a 'plane ...Will this damn thing open (repeat as necessary) ...Then there is the pressure of learning very new and necessary skills and being scrutinised by the intstuctors as to the ability of that individual to have picked those skills up successfully. ...Probably some more stuff in here too Some people fair better than others. I did AFF nearly 3 years ago - and failed some levels and had to repeat. Some people fly through all 8 (whatever) levels. Some don't. I ended up spinning like a mutha on one jump. Over time you will learn to trust your kit, training, ability - it just takes time for all of these things to line up all at the same time. Even when you think you have them (which you never should) something new comes along - and pushes your boundaries again - freeflying, wingsuit, even a different pair of gloves or jumping a different aircraft for the first time. Or maybe I'm just scared I think that is the crux - 'fear' of the first time (I think it has much to do with an inbuilt dread of buying beerIt's all good - jump and be happy----------------------- Connextion: British 8 Way Team www.bodyflight.co.uk ----------------------- Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ron 10 #10 January 29, 2004 Good post... QuoteI think for those of you more experienced in skydiving, there is a different mindset. You're comfortable going out the door, and to keep complacency from setting in your defense mechanism looks at the dive from a much different perspective. Which do you think has a better picture of the EVENT that is a skydive? The guy that has been in it for years and has done it many times, or the guy that is in AFF? QuoteDoes this make sense? Should I shut up and color? Just to re-emphasize, I have viewed my AFF training so far, down deep inside, as a dismal, pitiful failure. Why? I busted level 2, and tumbled my level 6 exit. Now, if you ask the experienced instructors, they have a much different view of my progression to date. But because I'm new and see it only from my perspective, I have a skewed view of the reality of my training. And we don't have a skewed view....You didn't fail...you lived and thats the main thing. you just didn't meet the TLO's for those levels....Guess what? No one will care in 2 years and 300 more jumps that you didn't pass AFF in 7 levels."No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skyyhi 0 #11 January 29, 2004 QuoteWhich do you think has a better picture of the EVENT that is a skydive? The guy that has been in it for years and has done it many times, or the guy that is in AFF? That's a good question Ron. I don't really have an answer as I am too new in the sport and still on student status. I think that the question of "who has a better picture" may be less significant than what that picture looks like. During my first 6, no.. .make that 7 AFF jumps, just getting myself out the door was the BIG picture. Once out the door, for me, I was able to relax and get into the dive. I LOVE freefall. Now, as a solo student, my picture of this thing we do is MUCH different than it was during AFF. It doesn't make the picture better or worse, just different. That is infinitely more significant.________________________________________ Take risks not to escape life… but to prevent life from escaping. ~ A bumper sticker at the DZ FGF #6 Darcy Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
WeakMindedFool 0 #12 January 29, 2004 Ron...wanted to reply in the other thread but it was getting a little...pointless. Now I have very few skydives so my opinion counts for little to anyone but me (so now I'm going to give it anyway LOL). I agree with you absolutely! Anyone who thinks skydiving is "safe" isn't paying attention. The fact is that one of two things are going to happen when you jump out of an airplane, you are going to live or you are going to die. I know of no other activity where doing nothing will absolutely kill you (yah yah CYPRESS, it may or may not save you). Our emergency procedures must be implemented immediately and in the correct order or the consequeces WILL be...spectacular. Now here's the thing, I don't fear the environment. I have little or no anxiety about jumping and never have. My fear 'o' meter is broken, not just in skydiving but in about everything. Now I'm just guessing here but many people will equate fear to dangerous, this is wrong. I don't expect anyone to fear, but to make the jump from I don't fear to I am safe, is what I think your warning against. One should never forget that an environment is leathal. The moment you loose respect for the danger, Murphy will most definitly leave a mark! Peace!Faith in a holy cause is to a considerable extent a substitute for lost faith in ourselves. -Eric Hoffer - Check out these Videos Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ron 10 #13 January 30, 2004 Quote I think that the question of "who has a better picture" may be less significant than what that picture looks like. You are kinda missing my point. To a student they are thinking about the big things. Mainly not dying. That point of view is valid, but missing the big picture. Sometimes they lie to themselves (or are lied to by others) and told that skydiving is safe....Its not. It is a very dangerous situation that you put yourself into. You have 1:30 seconds to stop a most certain death. To add in some fun we only try to stop it in the last 15-20 seconds. Name one sport where you start a chain of events that WILL end in your death if you don't do the right thing in 15-20 seconds. Now add in the fact that when you try to stop your death...things like malfuntions could happen that put you right back into a life a death struggle. Now more seasoned jumpers know this, and with training and equipment you can limit the risk so that it is acceptable. But never forget that you WILL die if you screw up...And even if you do everything right you could STILL die. Its not about the PERCEPTION of the event...To you a 1 min skydive where your main goal is to survive is very short....To me, If I did a solo...It would be the longets 1:30 you could imagine...Hell I might even get bored. Thats perception. The event is started when you put yourself in imediate harms way..And only training will save you. Do you see the difference?"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ron 10 #14 January 30, 2004 QuoteNow I have very few skydives so my opinion counts for little to anyone but me If your opinion only mattered to you...Then I would not be reading it.... QuoteAnyone who thinks skydiving is "safe" isn't paying attention. The fact is that one of two things are going to happen when you jump out of an airplane, you are going to live or you are going to die. I know of no other activity where doing nothing will absolutely kill you Our emergency procedures must be implemented immediately and in the correct order or the consequeces WILL be...spectacular Bingo!!! You don't have to fear it...just respect it."No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bodyflight.Net 0 #15 January 30, 2004 Interestingly similar to something I said once in regards to skydiving and how this newbie sees it: fear will paralyze you.. RESPECT will empower you.. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ron 10 #16 January 30, 2004 QuoteInterestingly similar to something I said once in regards to skydiving and how this newbie sees it Yep, and I never said anything about it did I?"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skyyhi 0 #17 January 30, 2004 QuoteDo you see the difference? Absolutely. . .but that is not what I thought you were talking about. That makes perfect sense. . .and I agree completely. Except that now soloing is the LONGEST dive in history. I can't wait to be able to jump with others again. but in my original answer, I was thinking more about the perception of the skydive you get once you are safely on the ground. . .what it actually means to you. . .that perception changes as your experience grows also. . .________________________________________ Take risks not to escape life… but to prevent life from escaping. ~ A bumper sticker at the DZ FGF #6 Darcy Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skylord 1 #18 February 5, 2004 QuoteGood post...Quote Thanks, Ron. QuoteWhich do you think has a better picture of the EVENT that is a skydive? The guy that has been in it for years and has done it many times, or the guy that is in AFF? This is a great, great question. I had to think it over for a few days. Without a doubt, the vets win hands down. Much more realistic, without the visceral emotional reactions/defense mechanisms us newcomers attach to learning a sport against which the deepest part of your being rebels. QuoteAnd we don't have a skewed view....You didn't fail...you lived and thats the main thing. you just didn't meet the TLO's for those levels....Guess what? No one will care in 2 years and 300 more jumps that you didn't pass AFF in 7 levels. True point, and one my instructors reemphasize. Thanks for the reply, and I look forward to progressing through this journey! BobBob Marks "-when you leave the airplane its all wrong til it goes right, its a whole different mindset, this is why you have system redundancy." Mattaman Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Shark 0 #19 February 9, 2004 Bob, Remember this skydive? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites skylord 1 #20 February 10, 2004 QuoteBob, Remember this skydive? Oh, yeah! Thanks for the pics, Shark! As you can tell, my training wheels were stiff, so I was obviously reponsible for the stability of the entire formation on my own. I did just that with legs that to the untrained eye appear to be flailing, Actually, this is my AFF-1 dive with Shark and Tom. These pics don't worry me. I'm afraid of the Elsinore Instructor Burnout Boogie shots (oops, bad choice of words), uh photos....... Thanks again, man, for the pics, the support, and jumping with me!! BobBob Marks "-when you leave the airplane its all wrong til it goes right, its a whole different mindset, this is why you have system redundancy." Mattaman Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL. Insert image from URL × Desktop Tablet Phone Submit Reply 0 Go To Topic Listing
Shark 0 #19 February 9, 2004 Bob, Remember this skydive? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skylord 1 #20 February 10, 2004 QuoteBob, Remember this skydive? Oh, yeah! Thanks for the pics, Shark! As you can tell, my training wheels were stiff, so I was obviously reponsible for the stability of the entire formation on my own. I did just that with legs that to the untrained eye appear to be flailing, Actually, this is my AFF-1 dive with Shark and Tom. These pics don't worry me. I'm afraid of the Elsinore Instructor Burnout Boogie shots (oops, bad choice of words), uh photos....... Thanks again, man, for the pics, the support, and jumping with me!! BobBob Marks "-when you leave the airplane its all wrong til it goes right, its a whole different mindset, this is why you have system redundancy." Mattaman Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
