TomAiello 26 #76 March 9, 2004 I think that Chris' list: Quote- Anti-authority - Impulsiveness - Invulnerability - Macho - Deference Is a much better description of the people I've seen go in than Jan's: Quote- independence of thought - independence in action - proactive in the face of uncertainty - self-confidence - humility - course correction I've seen several people with all of Jan's attributes in spades, and still they've gone in. But those people also had several of Chris' attributes--and that's pretty much why they went in.-- Tom Aiello Tom@SnakeRiverBASE.com SnakeRiverBASE.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Pendragon 1 #77 March 9, 2004 I'm still a newbie to skydiving, but I've seen it doing other stuff... I think the most important bad attributes are in both lists: - Impulsiveness - Humility Ultimately, I think they both boil down to attitude. It's strange, but there are times - it happened to me recently ice climbing - that you sense it's not a good day. Whatever others might think, to me that's just being in the wrong state of mind. I've been quite surprised by just how much my mental state at the time has affected my performance in recent months. Maybe it's just because I've been thinking about it that I've suddenly noticed. Anyway, if I don't feel right, I might try warming up on something easy (equivalent to just turning up at the DZ to reassess) or just staying away. I've found that there are those people who can bow out gracefully, and those that are so carried away they cannot - too impulsive? Whilst we all make mistakes from time to time, surely those with a "good attitude" strive not to! Occasionally sports like this bite back - hard. Is this where humility comes in - taking time out to give a decision the respect it truly deserves? I've met a few people that I've felt might not make it to old age; they just appear reckless. I actually spent several months checking out my (now) home DZ before ever making a jump - taking a look around, seeing what was going on, who was there, what they were like etc. because I felt I was about to entrust someone with my life and I wanted to be sure about it. Maybe that's overkill/melodramatic, but I'd been burnt before in climbing whilst I still wasn't able to take care of myself. Now I don't take that chance. I would like to do some crazy stuff - but I'd also like to think I'll make old bones! Oh heaven, I've rambled again...-- BASE #1182 Muff #3573 PFI #52; UK WSI #13 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MarkM 0 #78 March 9, 2004 Quote Quote QuoteI don't see how the guy who died swooping the pond when high fits any of these categories, except maybe insufficient humility. Course correction? He made a bonehead decision to swoop the pond - prior to setting up for the swoop he could have changed his mind and landed elsewhere.Quote He had so many chemicals in his bloodstream the only thing "elsewhere" was his mind. I don't think course correction was an option. lovely assumption, but thats all it is is an assumption. fact is he died because he turned to low. that is failure to react, you can speculate it was because he was impaired, but again its only a speculation, for all you know he'd made his last 100 hook turns under the same conditions.... The jumper's name was Ron, he was one of my instructors. A year before he died I watched him almost go in due to a really bad decision he made. I don't doubt he died for making two more bad decisions: smoking a bunch of pot before his jump and attempting to swoop the pond in that condition. Maybe if he'd done a "course correction" a year back and attempted to play it safer in the future he wouldn't have gone in, but as you say that's only speculation. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Scrumpot 1 #79 July 13, 2004 Quotejust wanted to know how will I know when it is fixable or not? when is it worth trying to save -vs- cutting away on those "close calls, could go either way"?? I just found my way over to this thread from a clicky link going on over in the new Community: USPA BOD Elections forums. My eyes are now blurring over, but I don't think that I saw this question actually answered. So here goes, and if it is a "repeat" of something pages deeper into this, that I have not yet come to, then my apologies. If this as a result then also "bumps" this thread.... well, is that a bad thing? The short answer to your question here Chris is in 2 simple words: HARD DECK. If your main canopy is not open and flyable/landable by your hard deck, you chop it. Period. Determining or milking "fixability" beyond (ie: lower) than that (whatever YOUR hard deck is) is a mistake. Fuck with it all you want, RIGHT UP TO (or down to more appropriately) your hard deck. Whether it turns out it was "fixable" by that point or not all suddenly becomes purely acedemic at that point, because if it is NOT (fixed), it is GONE! ---Or it should be. Does this answer your question? So now, instead of "hijacked" rather now: "bumped"! Doube-dutied for this "old" (but good, IMHO) thread. Blue Skies, -Grant Edited for a spelling/grammar correction only. Man, I do so many of those!coitus non circum - Moab Stone Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites cocheese 0 #80 July 14, 2004 I just read this thread for the 1st time. ( not all the posts yet )Thanks for sharing your insight.Maybe it could be started again in the bonfire . I'm sure nobody would mind. Just think some of us have not read it due to not getting around and the title may have turned some away.A title of "please read all" might be better. Much respect and sorrow for the orginal poster. Because it seems like she has been through more than one could handle. Again , Thank you. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites peregrinerose 0 #81 July 14, 2004 Quotesimple really, if it's your time, you die, if it ain't your time, you live! who live and dies depends on who's time it is, or isn't. I must respectfully disagree. If that was true, AFF or any other form of training wouldn't be necessary, we'd just strap on a chute, hop out, and hope for the best, after all, it is just god, or fate, or horoscope, or whatever you blame 'your time' on to determine if you live or die. In skydiving, from day one it is beaten in to your head that only YOU are in control of your skydive, and how it goes is in YOUR hands, not someone else's, not fate. Jen Do or do not, there is no try -Yoda Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Ron 10 #82 September 9, 2004 Good info...so BUMP!!!!!"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 3 4 Next Page 4 of 4 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL. Insert image from URL × Desktop Tablet Phone Submit Reply 0
Scrumpot 1 #79 July 13, 2004 Quotejust wanted to know how will I know when it is fixable or not? when is it worth trying to save -vs- cutting away on those "close calls, could go either way"?? I just found my way over to this thread from a clicky link going on over in the new Community: USPA BOD Elections forums. My eyes are now blurring over, but I don't think that I saw this question actually answered. So here goes, and if it is a "repeat" of something pages deeper into this, that I have not yet come to, then my apologies. If this as a result then also "bumps" this thread.... well, is that a bad thing? The short answer to your question here Chris is in 2 simple words: HARD DECK. If your main canopy is not open and flyable/landable by your hard deck, you chop it. Period. Determining or milking "fixability" beyond (ie: lower) than that (whatever YOUR hard deck is) is a mistake. Fuck with it all you want, RIGHT UP TO (or down to more appropriately) your hard deck. Whether it turns out it was "fixable" by that point or not all suddenly becomes purely acedemic at that point, because if it is NOT (fixed), it is GONE! ---Or it should be. Does this answer your question? So now, instead of "hijacked" rather now: "bumped"! Doube-dutied for this "old" (but good, IMHO) thread. Blue Skies, -Grant Edited for a spelling/grammar correction only. Man, I do so many of those!coitus non circum - Moab Stone Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cocheese 0 #80 July 14, 2004 I just read this thread for the 1st time. ( not all the posts yet )Thanks for sharing your insight.Maybe it could be started again in the bonfire . I'm sure nobody would mind. Just think some of us have not read it due to not getting around and the title may have turned some away.A title of "please read all" might be better. Much respect and sorrow for the orginal poster. Because it seems like she has been through more than one could handle. Again , Thank you. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
peregrinerose 0 #81 July 14, 2004 Quotesimple really, if it's your time, you die, if it ain't your time, you live! who live and dies depends on who's time it is, or isn't. I must respectfully disagree. If that was true, AFF or any other form of training wouldn't be necessary, we'd just strap on a chute, hop out, and hope for the best, after all, it is just god, or fate, or horoscope, or whatever you blame 'your time' on to determine if you live or die. In skydiving, from day one it is beaten in to your head that only YOU are in control of your skydive, and how it goes is in YOUR hands, not someone else's, not fate. Jen Do or do not, there is no try -Yoda Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ron 10 #82 September 9, 2004 Good info...so BUMP!!!!!"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
