Safety day seminar

[billvon 3,123]

I gave a seminar at Perris for safety day on exit safety. It actually drew the most people for seminars that day (10) and I think the people involved got a lot out of it. I covered three basic things:

-Checking the spot. Not actually spotting, as Perris is 100% GPS, but enough to verify you'll probably make it back.

-Checking for traffic and weather, and who is responsible for traffic avoidance.

-Leaving enough exit separation between groups. I covered primarily the Skratch method and the time-estimate method, along with a few problems with the 45 degree method.

[Designer 0]

Good 1!

[Scrumpot 1]

So how then did you find yourself handling the very clear & very DIRECT CONTRADICTION to Perris' Safety-Day printed/published official safety guidelines that actually MANDATES the 45' rule be used??

Just wondering.

BTW too, on Sunday ...out of 3 "hop-n-pop's" I witnessed personally out of Perris aircraft ...total # of jumpers who even bothered to even GLANCE out the door (let alone even look, rather than fixating on red-light, then green... GO!) before exiting?? Answer: NONE!

GPS is great, but it certainly can't tell you if for instance maybe one of them ultra-lights that routinely fly out of the south side of that facility might not have just strayed blindly underneath your GPS "spotted" Otter.

Food for thought?

coitus non circum - Moab Stone

[billvon 3,123]

>So how then did you find yourself handling the very clear & very
> DIRECT CONTRADICTION to Perris' Safety-Day printed/published
> official safety guidelines that actually MANDATES the 45' rule be
> used??

I told them to check the board by manifest which has another official rule (10 seconds) and went over some problems you can experience if you try to use the 45 degree rule. Basically the same info seen on this board; the videos of the jumps and the annotated pictures.

My job at safety day is not to tell anyone what they must or must not do. I'm not an S+TA at Perris. My only objective was to educate people on safety issues in terms of spotting, traffic clearance and safe separation. And if they want to use the 45 degree method, well - they know the risks of that method, and the risks and advantages of other separation methods.

[Scrumpot 1]

Quote

I told them to check the board by manifest which has another official rule (10 seconds) and went over some problems you can experience if you try to use the 45 degree rule.

Maybe the Perris DZ Management themselves should compare the 2 up alongside of each other and come up with some sort of clearly NON-DISPARATE printed/published "policies"? Bottom line is, one is clearly in contradiction to the other, and this just does not make any sense! I know I am probably beating a dead horse here, and I hope that I will still be welcome at Perris during my next So. Cal. excursion ..but what is it that one is supposed to do, or assume if one "picks up" (or is nearly forcibly given ...as was the case on Sunday) one of the "policies", or one of the OTHER ...or heck, even both?? Someone IMHO needs to reconcile these 2 together. Mixed messages serve no-one's either best interests or needs at all in this regard.

Again, hope I will still be welcome at Perris during my next west coast "guest/celebrity" tour!

Blue Skies,
-Grant

coitus non circum - Moab Stone

[billvon 3,123]

>Maybe the Perris DZ Management themselves should compare the 2
> up alongside of each other and come up with some sort of clearly
> NON-DISPARATE printed/published "policies"?

I think this is an issue at a great many DZ's, not just Perris. Should people lean/move as far forward as possible on takeoff? Is it OK to open the door during taxi, or at 1000 feet, or before the red light comes on? Is it OK to make corrections on jump run? Should everyone crowd into the front of the Otter if the first group is a 12-way? What if your group will be clear of the cloud but the next group won't; should you still go? What if there's a plane in the pattern headed your way but you know he's going to turn?

There are a lot of details in skydiving that I think are impossible to define clearly for every circumstance. I think the safest way to approach such issues is to educate yourself and do whatever works for you. In almost all cases, if you do something that ends up being the safe thing to do even if it's not on the list of rules, your decision will not be questioned.

>but what is it that one is supposed to do . . .

Use one's experiences, education and judgement to make the best possible decision. If there is still a question on what to do, ask an instructor, an S+TA or the manager - but don't be suprised if you get more than one answer. If you do want to use the 45 degree rule, and back it up with the simple time method (i.e. divide the uppers by 2 and count that number of seconds) then you have the best of both worlds. You both look outside the airplane and get enough separation.