Floats18 0 #1 March 26, 2004 Stupid newbie question, What's a horseshoe mal? Any pictures?--- and give them wings so they may fly free forever DiverDriver in Training Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pilotdave 0 #2 March 26, 2004 I can't see it right now (codec issue) but http://www.skydivingmovies.com/ver2/pafiledb.php?action=file&id=1201 might show it pretty well. It's basically when your pilot chute gets caught on your body (for example your bridle wrapping around your foot). Dave Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kris 0 #3 March 26, 2004 It's when the PC (or canopy lines) gets caught on the jumper or when the PC is still in the pouch but the pin has been pulled and the bag is extracted. The latter is the most common scenario. It's called a horseshoe because you now have the bag & lines trailing while they are connected to the risers and to the PC pouch (or your body). This is also known as the only malfunction that gives me cold sweatsm but it is a malfunction that can be 99.999% fully avoided with proper gear maintenance. Personally, if I have a horseshoe I will try twice to clear the PC or caught lines. Once the PC is cleared, you may have a baglock or unrecoverable line-twists. If I can't clear the PC (or lines) I will cutaway then go for my reserve and hope it clears the mess.Sky, Muff Bro, Rodriguez Bro, and Bastion of Purity and Innocence!™ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Floats18 0 #4 March 26, 2004 Thanks for the response, I thought that I might have missed out on learning that mal but you helped me find out that I didn't learn the horseshoe because I was training static line, and we static fliers lack the required equipment. I'll keep that one in mind for my further adventures.--- and give them wings so they may fly free forever DiverDriver in Training Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,120 #5 March 26, 2004 >when the PC is still in the pouch but the pin has been pulled and the >bag is extracted. The latter is the most common scenario. You may also hear this referred to as an "out of sequence deployment." Once the bag comes out, it essentially becomes a horseshoe. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cruzit 0 #6 March 26, 2004 I actually experienced a horseshoe mal on my 82nd jump. Floating an otter, I experienced a premature deployment. As our 4 way exited, the jumper inside the door, funneled into the lines of my deploying main. This resulted in my leg mounted throwout being pulled around and in-between my legs, a classic horseshoe malfunction. I attempted to locate my pilot chute twice, as I had been taught with no luck. At that point, I cutaway and pulled my reserve. The reserve pilot chute became entangled in my main. Fortunately, the reserve pilot chute bridle was able to finish the deployment. When my reserve opened, I had to reach up and pull the reserve freebag and pilot chute down from where it was wrapped around the reserve's risers so I could steer. I landed with my main tucked between my legs and my free bag and pilot chute. The only thing I lost was my cutaway and reserve handles (I got the reserve handle back eventually). Fortunately, my inattention to exit preparation (my pin had obviously become dislodged prior to exit and I didn't bother to get a pin check) did not result in my death...only some burned lines on my main and a very healthy respect for what could have been. The only thing that I might have done differently now is I would probably have continued to look for my main's pilot chute a bit longer (I exited at 14,000'). Very, very scary. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DanG 1 #7 March 26, 2004 You should have been taught about a horseshoe. Static liners can still get a horseshoe by tumbling through their lines on opening or rotating on exit causing the pilot chute (if one is used, some DZ's use them, some don't) to wrap around their body. When you start your hop n' pops you absolutely need to be training on this malfunction. Talk to your instructor, horseshoes are no joke. - Dan G Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
christelsabine 1 #8 March 26, 2004 such malfunctions are only shown on pics. this is my experience. no further explanation on that, how to prevent or something like this. no, not true: how to prevent has been teached in few words: keep good arch! during my 8th consolidation jump after aff, the bridle of PC was "hanging" around my right lower leg. i noticed, as nothing happend after pulling, saw it ! BIG BIG shock at that moment! i turned on my back, surely not by willing, but this was best in that moment. i catched the bridle with the PC, kept it in my hand, arched and pulled hard immediately again after coming back into belly position. this too, was not really planned, it was simply coming within a second. main canopy opened a little over cypres fire altitude. later at the dz, friends told me that people already turned their faces away.... i only remember few thoughts: dont' let the PC bridle stretch, don't let the main come out while you'r fallin on back side, hold on. it worked. still today, i am unable to really explain in more details what happend. never before and never after i had such a long freefall time dudeist skydiver # 3105 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
thelem 0 #9 March 26, 2004 I trained static line in Britain, and I wasn't taught about a horseshoe malfunction until my first ripcord jump. We used the ones without a pilot chute, so the bag stays attached to plane (a bit like a reserve). The only way I can see a horseshow happening is therefore if you get the static line wrapped around your arm (or whatever), which would turn it into a static line hangup Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JohnMitchell 16 #10 March 26, 2004 QuoteI actually experienced a horseshoe mal on my 82nd jump. Quote Man, that is scary. So glad you are still here. Those horseshoes are the stuff of nightmares, aren't they? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites seal_S49 0 #11 March 27, 2004 Quote i only remember few thoughts: dont' let the PC bridle stretch, don't let the main come out while you'r fallin on back side, hold on. it worked. You're a true survivor & that's a great story! Thanks for posting it. edited to add: I hope that most of us would agree that at some point, it's better to have the main come out while you're on your back than not at all. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites christelsabine 1 #12 March 28, 2004 QuoteI hope that most of us would agree that at some point, it's better to have the main come out while you're on your back than not at all right, but don't forget the experience level i've been at that time. dudeist skydiver # 3105 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites seal_S49 0 #13 March 28, 2004 Quoteright, but don't forget the experience level i've been at that time. IMO you're a winner!Regards, S49 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites christelsabine 1 #14 March 29, 2004 really, do not know why you consider me as a "winner". but, like to hear this, gives me a good share of self-confidence. i just made something to be the lucky one. never ever after this event thought about it. tried to pm you this, but it's impossible to reach you. anyhow, will keep my ears and eyes wide open to listen and look at all what's happening at this site. PS. your sig line is not bad. exactly what i use to say, a little modified: i know nothing. but men saying this? weird. rgds dudeist skydiver # 3105 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites seal_S49 0 #15 March 30, 2004 Quote do not know why you consider me as a "winner". Because: 1) You didn't give up. 2) You saved your own life. 3) You're still skydiving. Having said that, I can't resist the opportunity to emphisize to those with less experience that an unstable deployment is better than no deployment at all. I've seen a number of unstable deployments that ended with an open canopy and safe landing. If there's anything worth saying here it's, "Don't spend the rest of your life trying to get stable." Not directed towards you personally, but for any newbies that need to be reminded. Safe skies! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Ron 10 #16 March 30, 2004 QuoteStupid newbie question, Not a stupid question. QuoteWhat's a horseshoe mal? If your instructors have not taught you this...find new instructors....And I'm not kidding. Static line or not you should know ALL the Malfunctions before you jump. I'm really not kidding, find new instructors."No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites PhillyKev 0 #17 March 30, 2004 QuoteIf your instructors have not taught you this...find new instructors....And I'm not kidding. Static line or not you should know ALL the Malfunctions before you jump. I'm really not kidding, find new instructors. Not necessarily his instructors. There's a lot of info during the FJC, I'm sure a lot of people don't remember everything they were taught. That's why there aren't any stupid questions. And in answer to your question, my definitioin of a horsewhoe mal is = My biggest fear. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Ron 10 #18 March 31, 2004 QuoteNot necessarily his instructors. That why I had this part of my post: QuoteIf your instructors have not taught you this...find new instructors....And I'm not kidding. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL. Insert image from URL × Desktop Tablet Phone Submit Reply 0 Go To Topic Listing
seal_S49 0 #11 March 27, 2004 Quote i only remember few thoughts: dont' let the PC bridle stretch, don't let the main come out while you'r fallin on back side, hold on. it worked. You're a true survivor & that's a great story! Thanks for posting it. edited to add: I hope that most of us would agree that at some point, it's better to have the main come out while you're on your back than not at all. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
christelsabine 1 #12 March 28, 2004 QuoteI hope that most of us would agree that at some point, it's better to have the main come out while you're on your back than not at all right, but don't forget the experience level i've been at that time. dudeist skydiver # 3105 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
seal_S49 0 #13 March 28, 2004 Quoteright, but don't forget the experience level i've been at that time. IMO you're a winner!Regards, S49 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
christelsabine 1 #14 March 29, 2004 really, do not know why you consider me as a "winner". but, like to hear this, gives me a good share of self-confidence. i just made something to be the lucky one. never ever after this event thought about it. tried to pm you this, but it's impossible to reach you. anyhow, will keep my ears and eyes wide open to listen and look at all what's happening at this site. PS. your sig line is not bad. exactly what i use to say, a little modified: i know nothing. but men saying this? weird. rgds dudeist skydiver # 3105 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
seal_S49 0 #15 March 30, 2004 Quote do not know why you consider me as a "winner". Because: 1) You didn't give up. 2) You saved your own life. 3) You're still skydiving. Having said that, I can't resist the opportunity to emphisize to those with less experience that an unstable deployment is better than no deployment at all. I've seen a number of unstable deployments that ended with an open canopy and safe landing. If there's anything worth saying here it's, "Don't spend the rest of your life trying to get stable." Not directed towards you personally, but for any newbies that need to be reminded. Safe skies! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ron 10 #16 March 30, 2004 QuoteStupid newbie question, Not a stupid question. QuoteWhat's a horseshoe mal? If your instructors have not taught you this...find new instructors....And I'm not kidding. Static line or not you should know ALL the Malfunctions before you jump. I'm really not kidding, find new instructors."No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhillyKev 0 #17 March 30, 2004 QuoteIf your instructors have not taught you this...find new instructors....And I'm not kidding. Static line or not you should know ALL the Malfunctions before you jump. I'm really not kidding, find new instructors. Not necessarily his instructors. There's a lot of info during the FJC, I'm sure a lot of people don't remember everything they were taught. That's why there aren't any stupid questions. And in answer to your question, my definitioin of a horsewhoe mal is = My biggest fear. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ron 10 #18 March 31, 2004 QuoteNot necessarily his instructors. That why I had this part of my post: QuoteIf your instructors have not taught you this...find new instructors....And I'm not kidding. "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
