Front risers - how much do they need to move?

[ChrisD 0]

At this point I would spend more time discussing and being concerned with why you were backing up the whole skydive.

C


My concern for you is that,...Yes learning how to use your fronts is an admeriable question, personally I would rather see you gain more experience so that you don't jump in those kinds of conditions again....The "backing" up thing and basically in the same sentence: "front risers" dosnt sit well with me....

But what do I know, "I only have one tandem jump."

[PixieUK 0]

ChrisD

At this point I would spend more time discussing and being concerned with why you were backing up the whole skydive.

C


My concern for you is that,...Yes learning how to use your fronts is an admeriable question, personally I would rather see you gain more experience so that you don't jump in those kinds of conditions again....The "backing" up thing and basically in the same sentence: "front risers" dosnt sit well with me....

Not sure I understand you. I was in student winds (our dz is very strict at putting students on weather hold if the winds get up) and when I got to my holding area at 4000', the only direction I could fly was with the wind. Facing into the wind, I was going backwards, I had my hands fully up so no braking effect from the control toggles. The only thing I could do was crab sideways to land in the general area of the landing zone (it's surrounded by fields on 3 sides), and keep checking over my shoulder to make sure I was crabbing enough to avoid any obstacles behind me (the one instance where "if you can't see it, you won't hit it" doesn't hold true! )

My backwards speed lessened once I got down to about 30-40 feet but I was still going backwards when I landed and wasn't about to attempt to run backwards, so I still flared as normal and then rolled as soon as my feet touched down.

A mind once stretched by a new idea never regains its original dimensions - Oliver Wendell Holmes Jr

[yoink 321]

The point he's delicately trying to make is that it's YOUR decision when to get into and out of the plane.

If jumping for students is allowed in winds up to 14mph, but you know you start backing up at 10mph and that's not something you want to deal with, well, stay on the ground...

Don't feel that you have to jump just because you can.

Personal responsibility is a massive deal in this sport. If you choose to jump in conditions which back you up, don't expect too much sympathy. You'll get a lot more respect from the instructors if you stand yourself down and explain why - you might even get some more help.


I used to jump at a big dz in California and every afternoon in summer big dust devils would start up. These can be extremely violent and damn near impossible to see.
Jumping didn't stop, and lots of people kept going but I simply didn't manifest for loads when the weather was like that. I could have, but the risk was too great for me.


At your wingloading and state of progression, wind limits are just something you have to deal with - there isn't going to be a lot of in-flight stuff that'll help too much.
Accept the fact that you'll be sat down a little more than some other students and take the time to learn other stuff - JM1, Packing etc.

You are far, far better off just doing what your CCI says you need to do rather than putting energy into something which, in my opinon, won't get you the results you're looking for.

[PixieUK 0]

yoink

The point he's delicately trying to make is that it's YOUR decision when to get into and out of the plane.

If jumping for students is allowed in winds up to 14mph, but you know you start backing up at 10mph and that's not something you want to deal with, well, stay on the ground...

Point taken but that was actually on one of my AFF jumps with an instructor, not on a consol. So I had done a grand total of 6 jumps and landings before that.

A mind once stretched by a new idea never regains its original dimensions - Oliver Wendell Holmes Jr

[grue 1]

If it even has dive loops. A lot of student and rental rigs don't.

cavete terrae.

[yoink 321]

PixieUK

***The point he's delicately trying to make is that it's YOUR decision when to get into and out of the plane.

If jumping for students is allowed in winds up to 14mph, but you know you start backing up at 10mph and that's not something you want to deal with, well, stay on the ground...

Point taken but that was actually on one of my AFF jumps with an instructor, not on a consol. So I had done a grand total of 6 jumps and landings before that.

Firstly, you're still asking about improving your penetration into wind so the advice is the same - don't jump when you know you'll be going backwards if it's not your thing. Student or D license - that advice still stands.

Secondly, you HAVE to be able to feel comfortable saying 'no - I'm not happy with the winds. I'm going to back up in them. Can we go later?' at any point in your skydiving career. You might say it when learning some FS stuff ("Quick! We can make this load!") or later down the road when you're learning to wingsuit, maybe.

Never, never get pressured into a jump. - this is a particular problem for girls at the DZ who often get invited onto jumps they may not be ready for by more experienced jumpers. Ask in the womens forum if you don't believe me!


If I were you, in your situation I'd put a personal limit on the winds in which I was comfortable to jump and every time the winds were under those limits I'd be working with the CCI to do whatever I needed to to please him.
"Hey - I'm getting on the next load. You said you wanted to see my crosswind landings? Can you come and watch and give me feedback?" or "Hey, I'd like to make this a predeclared landing - can someone vouch for me?"

I guarantee it won't be long doing that until he's comfortable enough to let you jump something smaller. Work with him until then and stay within your own personal limits - don't try and push them by applying techniques (like the front risers) that aren't really applicable for your situation.

[nigel99 608]

As someone who has spent alot of time under rounds, I am going to side with your CI.

Landing in the correct place, requires spotting, watching the weather and canopy piloting skill. It does NOT require a smaller parachute. For most of what is required you have instructors to assist you.

Quote

My backwards speed lessened once I got down to about 30-40 feet but I was still going backwards when I landed and wasn't about to attempt to run backwards, so I still flared as normal and then rolled as soon as my feet touched down.

You did well, by the sound of it.

With very low wing loading, it may pay you to be slightly more conservative than the limits allow. Another thing to pay attention to, find out the winds aloft especially from 1000 to 5000 foot. You may decide that while the ground wind speeds are ok, the winds between deployment and landing are simply to high to be comfortable.

Experienced jumper - someone who has made mistakes more often than I have and lived.

[PixieUK 0]

Funny, I'd forgotten I wrote this post until I came on here looking for another thread. My first jump since passing my A licence was 2 days ago and I've done a fair amount of reading about canopy handling in between times, as well as talking to some coaches.

Had my first coached session for CH2 on Sunday and the instructor actually physically walked me through a mini-version of the landing pattern and suddenly all those squiggly little diagrams made a whole lot more sense, especially when combined with flat turns rather than trim turns. I didn't quite get my declared landing (landed a bit past the spot) but had a whole load of learning experiences (haven't seen the video clips yet).

I also did all my exercises for my front and rear risers (slowing the canopy before doing the front riser stuff gives me about 3 seconds of actually being able to pull on the fronts, lol) and did some flat turns lower than I would normally. On a monster 280 sq ft canopy, it was all very gentle and controlled - plan is now to do a series of hop and pops to focus on CH stuff.

A mind once stretched by a new idea never regains its original dimensions - Oliver Wendell Holmes Jr