adrenalinejunki 0 #1 April 20, 2006 I am planning to do my 1st smoke jump this weekend. I do not have a shoe bracket or anything but I am planning to use a 6 ft cord tied to the canister using a metal hose clamp and washer so it won't burn into. Tied to me using a slip knot so I can drop it just before landing so I know I will not get burned or burn my canopy when it hits the ground. Anyone got any USEFUL suggestions? __________________________________________________What's the worst that can happen? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhreeZone 20 #2 April 20, 2006 Watch it, the entine canister gets hot enough that if you are using rope it can burn it and then you have a freefalling still burning canister. Lots of those people that trail smoke under canopy have it on a steel wire since anything less would be melted.Yesterday is history And tomorrow is a mystery Parachutemanuals.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sdctlc 0 #3 April 20, 2006 You might be better off fashioning a bracket for a few $ from Home Dpot then the plan you noted. Those things get HOT.. I have only used a heel bracket when I jump smoke and it does well in protecting my foot/leg and giving a solid attachment point for the smoke can. Also easy reach to "pop" the smoke if your planning on using it under canopy Scott C."He who Hesitates Shall Inherit the Earth!" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
airtwardo 7 #4 April 20, 2006 Don't use 'Chord' to attach the smoke, go to Home Depot and get 10 feet of flexible cable, attach the smoke with two hose clamps and put a snap link on the other end...be careful where you 'drop it' prior to landing...can cause a fire or hurt someone on the ground. Also~ With a B license and you jump numbers....PLEASE get some training from someone with a PRO Rating! ~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
980 0 #5 April 20, 2006 PM voodew and ask him about the smoke brackets he had made. He sold every one he took to Z-Flock because they are such a good design. I did one jump with mine and admittedly I have only jumped one other type of smoke bracket, but I have seen many and this one rocks. It has one cutaway for the canister only in case it catches fire and another for the whole bracket in case you snag a line or something during deployment and want to get rid of it all. The ‘2 minute’ cold smoke he was selling was awesome too. Everyone on the ground could see our 2 minute flock, it lasted the whole canopy ride and about a minute on the ground too. Check the Z-Flock pics in my photo gallery on here to see the smoke after landing. Cya Sam Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Buried 0 #6 April 20, 2006 where are you planning on storing this in FF/deployment? and yes DONT use cord.. use a cable or something.. you can construct a more meaningful/useful setup for 10$ or 20$ for a nice one. Listen to airtwardo - he knows what he's doing and has helped me out in the past. Talk to other people at your dz who's done it and the dzo. I'd suggest jumping without lighting the smoke too once or twice.. just so you know how it will react and you dont have to worry about hot things hitting something by accident. Where is my fizzy-lifting drink? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
adrenalinejunki 0 #7 April 20, 2006 I was planning on keeping it inside my jumpsuit until after the canopy is open. __________________________________________________What's the worst that can happen? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JohnRich 4 #8 April 20, 2006 QuoteAttachments: AS268D.jpg (32.2 KB) Cool photo. How come you didn't use red, white and blue smoke? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ZigZagMarquis 9 #9 April 20, 2006 QuoteI am planning to do my 1st smoke jump this weekend....Anyone got any USEFUL suggestions? BEER!!! Anyway, are we talking a Cold Smoke or an M18 Smoke Grenade here? Personally, I'd not be enclined to jump smoke... a) unless I'm being paid for it; it has great potential to trash your gear... and... b) I'd use a good smoke brackett and not something cobbled together... and... c) I don't think I'd go keeping it inside my jumpsuit... I've seen M18s go off in the airplane, I've seen how hot they get, I've seen them spew an unusal amount of slag... I'd want to be able to get rid of it quickly if I had to. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ron 10 #10 April 20, 2006 My most useful piece of advice....Don't without training. I would not attempt to go on my own unless you are very skilled about pyro and skydiving. I don't know your pyro background, but with 175 jumps I bet you do not have the experience to make your own jumpable design that does not endanger you or anyone on the ground. QuoteI am planning to use a 6 ft cord tied to the canister using a metal hose clamp and washer so it won't burn into The canister will get hot enough to burn through most "cord". Metal cable is the MINUMUM. Holding the canister in your Jump suit is a *BAD* idea. If it fires it will burn you quite badly. I'll look to see if I can find some of my old Demo stuff and post some pics of the brackets.....Even then I would not try to build one on your own and jump it without supervision. PLEASE don't try this on your own."No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
airtwardo 7 #11 April 20, 2006 QuoteQuoteAttachments: AS268D.jpg (32.2 KB) Cool photo. How come you didn't use red, white and blue smoke? *** It really doesn't 'contrast' that well against each other... I have done it...and actually have that combo rigged up for an upcoming show... But a 'light' and a 'dark' seem to look better. ~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
adrenalinejunki 0 #12 April 20, 2006 How about cable and a fanny pack with a quick release and just tie the cable to the fanny pack so it will be easy to shuck it if needed? __________________________________________________What's the worst that can happen? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
adrenalinejunki 0 #13 April 20, 2006 I am accually planning to jump it into my own wedding ceremony Saturday in front of a news crew. My DZO and several others with PRO ratings will be with me and helping me make it as safe as possible. __________________________________________________What's the worst that can happen? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ron 10 #14 April 20, 2006 QuoteHow about cable and a fanny pack with a quick release and just tie the cable to the fanny pack so it will be easy to shuck it if needed? Better. QuoteI am accually planning to jump it into my own wedding ceremony Saturday in front of a news crew. My DZO and several others with PRO ratings will be with me and helping me make it as safe as possible. I would not do it. It is a REALLY bad idea to jump something you have never jumped before into a DEMO. The desire to perform is great, and often over rides common sense. Its great you have people watching your back, but I have seen people be afraid to CXL a DEMO...And since this is SUCH an important event, most will not step up. I'll do it. DON'T JUMP THE SMOKE. If you had a chance to rig something and put some test jumps on it. One with just the rig, one firing it, and maybe another full dress practice...I would be standing behind you. But as it stands right now it is a BAD idea. Hell, if you had given me some time I would have loaned you my bracket. Look, its your wedding. It is a big day in your life...A jump into it is MORE than enough extra stuff. Please don't jump the smoke. It is just going to add tons more potential problems and its not going to bring much more "Bling"....Hell you are skydiving into your wedding. A thin line of smoke is not going to make much difference. On low profile demos I had a steamer bag. It was a velcro bag that had red/white/blue streamers in it about 15-20 feet long. It was more than enough extra bling without the risk of burning anyone and and the risk of dropping a burning canister, or slagging the crowd. Really, you don't have enough time to set this up correctly and exicute it with enough margin of error to be safe. Please forget about the smoke."No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
adrenalinejunki 0 #15 April 20, 2006 I accually have a half case of the smoke grenades. I will be jumping all day before the wedding which isn't planned until sunset. Do you think I could practice enough to be able to get it right by then? I don't want to be unsafe OR put anyone in danger. By the way I will not be flying over the crowd at all. The wedding will be at the end of an old runway that is not in use anymore. The plan is to fly down the runway landing within 100ft of everyone. Providing the winds which usually are in favor of this. I just want it to be safe and special.__________________________________________________What's the worst that can happen? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
airtwardo 7 #16 April 20, 2006 Quote...you don't have enough time to set this up correctly and execute it with enough margin of error to be safe. Please forget about the smoke. *** Now you have TWO very experienced jumpers telling this is a REALLY BAD idea! Don't do this! And if your DZO and several PRO Rated jumpers are backing you up... The potential for major problems is everywhere with this. You should never do a demo that you haven't PRACTICED from beginning to end at LEAST 1/2 dozen times. You are doing something you've never done, with rigging you haven't tested, into an area you haven't landed in...with less than a D license...under the guidance of people with what I would call from your depiction anyway, as having less than good judgement. ALL on one of the MOST important days of your life...with all the additional stress that goes along with that. The links in the chain of disaster are to numerous to count. Without diligent training and practice you are not qualified... I can think of 7 things that can go wrong prior to even getting the smoke lit. You don't even have a 'properly' engineered system...if your smoke prematurely released....or you are off in any way....it possibly will injure a spectator on the ground. I can think of another 10 ways, you yourself could be injured or worse... NOT the day ya wanna trade a limo for a meat wagon! You do understand...this is classified as a DEMONSTRATION jump, and you are not qualified (on paper at least) to perform it. There will not be any insurance available to cover an incident, and you as well as everyone involved can be held liable. And in front of a 'News Crew' no less.... Doing this is Dumb...if you do it anyway and all comes off well...DUMB LUCK! You have been warned of the danger here in 'Black & White' PLEASE RECONSIDER! Textbook description of gross negligence, your ASO and CF should be made aware of your intentions. ~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ZigZagMarquis 9 #17 April 20, 2006 Adj, First and formost, congrats on getting married and all... ummm... is this your first wedding and first demo too??? You know that that means... ... but in all seriousness. I don't want to take the wind out of your sails, but someone up-post said that doing something for the first time on a demo may not be the best thing to do. Even with all the support your getting. Also, what is the nature of the landing area you're jumping into? I realize your profile may not yet be up to date, but with only 175 jumps, a demo may not be the best thing for you either. Not to scare you by going all "black death-y" or anything... but I've known two folks that busted themselves up badly on demos. One was a guy (Wade) jumping into his own wedding reception... he hooked it in and broke his back on landing... long term he was okay, can still walk and all, but it wasn't the best start to a Honey Moon ever... (granted those of you out there who know Wade know that his canopy piloting and wing-loading choices weren't always beyond question, but still). The other was a low time jumper on a demo, made a mistake and wound up busting up both his legs so badly he almost bleed to death and almost had one or both amputated... last I saw him, he wasn't walking, but reportedly he is now... he had to give up skydiving and could no longer work as a fireman. Anyway, best of wishes to you and your soon to be bride and be safe. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites adrenalinejunki 0 #18 April 20, 2006 OK maybe the streamers would be a better idea? __________________________________________________What's the worst that can happen? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites adrenalinejunki 0 #19 April 20, 2006 Accually I have made 13 jumps into there over the past few years. All beer owed will be paid right after the wedding. We are having a huge keg, tons of bottled beer, some kind of fruit punch (everclear spiked), and good ole Kentucky moonshine, and a huge bonfire. Everyone is welcome! __________________________________________________ __________________________________________________What's the worst that can happen? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites airtwardo 7 #20 April 20, 2006 QuoteOK maybe the streamers would be a better idea? __________________________________________________ *** PLEASE! I mean Hell...I have a set around here somewhere you can use! MAKE THIS as easy and low stress as you can! Like Ron said...you will WOW 'em enough just landing standing up were you're supposed to! On this one especially....you really have to expose your self to as little complications as possible. ~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites ZigZagMarquis 9 #21 April 20, 2006 QuoteAccually I have made 13 jumps into there over the past few years. __________________________________________________ Fair enough. How about you just jump in? Understand the desire to "show off", but ask yourself, why? Ultimately, the decission is yours. I hope nothing bad happens and please please keep telling yourself to be conservative under canopy. Not only for your own benifit, but your brides, your friends and family, and the sport of skydiving... you did say you were going to be doing this in front of the press, yes?? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites adrenalinejunki 0 #22 April 20, 2006 I would still like for someone to jump the smoke. In freefall if possible but I know what that will do to your gear on opening. __________________________________________________What's the worst that can happen? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites billvon 3,118 #23 April 20, 2006 >I am accually planning to jump it into my own wedding ceremony Saturday in front of a news crew. Yikes! Don't do it! Trying smoke is one thing. Doing a demo that you MUST do is a very very very bad idea at your level! Demo fever is a serious problem, and often affects people at your level. It's a state of mind that you get into that overrides common sense, because you HAVE to do this demo. (It's your wedding, after all! They're waiting for you! Your family will see you! The news crews will see you! And the wind doesn't look that bad from up here.) I've seen people who were otherwise competent skydivers almost kill themselves on demos because of this: 1. They can't back out if they want to. There's too much pressure to be able to say no. 2. They won't take outs if they need them. There's too many people watching to land somewhere else. 3. They'll try the craziest stuff to get on-target. There's too many cameras to miss. 4. They will never PLF. Too many people watching to fall down. 5. They will never say no to smoke, or streamers, or a camera helmet, even if they've never jumped them before. After all, they put too much effort into this to have it be half-assed. The best way to start in demos is to watch a few, then get some instruction, then do a low pressure demo where you don't have to jump. A demo into a field near the DZ is perfect. If you don't jump, you just go back to the airport and jump there. After a few of those, you can work up to wide open off-DZ demos. Add smoke the second time you jump in somewhere. Part of this is that the skills required go up gradually, but an even bigger part is that by starting gradually there's no burning need to make this one demo jump work. It's easy to fall into the trap of doing it all the first time, and then not being able to say no when it comes time to get in the door. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites adrenalinejunki 0 #24 April 20, 2006 Yes in front of the press. I am very conservative under canopy at all times. Even up high most of the time. I just like to hang out and enjoy the show. I always open higher then everyone else also. I don't want to cheat myself out of the canopy ride. I know my wing loading is kind of high for my jump numbers and that is another reason why I am so conservative. Canopy size hasn't changed for me since I was a student, I have just gotten fat.... __________________________________________________What's the worst that can happen? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites mjosparky 4 #25 April 20, 2006 QuoteOne was a guy (Wade) jumping into his own wedding reception... he hooked it in and broke his back on landing... QuoteThe other was a low time jumper on a demo, made a mistake and wound up busting up both his legs so badly he almost bleed to death and almost had one or both amputated... Tim, I talked to both of these guys before they did they "demo" and advised them that it was probably not the smartest thing to do. As BillV said, "demo fever" can get you hurt or killed.My idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 3 Next Page 1 of 3 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. 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adrenalinejunki 0 #18 April 20, 2006 OK maybe the streamers would be a better idea? __________________________________________________What's the worst that can happen? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
adrenalinejunki 0 #19 April 20, 2006 Accually I have made 13 jumps into there over the past few years. All beer owed will be paid right after the wedding. We are having a huge keg, tons of bottled beer, some kind of fruit punch (everclear spiked), and good ole Kentucky moonshine, and a huge bonfire. Everyone is welcome! __________________________________________________ __________________________________________________What's the worst that can happen? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
airtwardo 7 #20 April 20, 2006 QuoteOK maybe the streamers would be a better idea? __________________________________________________ *** PLEASE! I mean Hell...I have a set around here somewhere you can use! MAKE THIS as easy and low stress as you can! Like Ron said...you will WOW 'em enough just landing standing up were you're supposed to! On this one especially....you really have to expose your self to as little complications as possible. ~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ZigZagMarquis 9 #21 April 20, 2006 QuoteAccually I have made 13 jumps into there over the past few years. __________________________________________________ Fair enough. How about you just jump in? Understand the desire to "show off", but ask yourself, why? Ultimately, the decission is yours. I hope nothing bad happens and please please keep telling yourself to be conservative under canopy. Not only for your own benifit, but your brides, your friends and family, and the sport of skydiving... you did say you were going to be doing this in front of the press, yes?? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
adrenalinejunki 0 #22 April 20, 2006 I would still like for someone to jump the smoke. In freefall if possible but I know what that will do to your gear on opening. __________________________________________________What's the worst that can happen? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,118 #23 April 20, 2006 >I am accually planning to jump it into my own wedding ceremony Saturday in front of a news crew. Yikes! Don't do it! Trying smoke is one thing. Doing a demo that you MUST do is a very very very bad idea at your level! Demo fever is a serious problem, and often affects people at your level. It's a state of mind that you get into that overrides common sense, because you HAVE to do this demo. (It's your wedding, after all! They're waiting for you! Your family will see you! The news crews will see you! And the wind doesn't look that bad from up here.) I've seen people who were otherwise competent skydivers almost kill themselves on demos because of this: 1. They can't back out if they want to. There's too much pressure to be able to say no. 2. They won't take outs if they need them. There's too many people watching to land somewhere else. 3. They'll try the craziest stuff to get on-target. There's too many cameras to miss. 4. They will never PLF. Too many people watching to fall down. 5. They will never say no to smoke, or streamers, or a camera helmet, even if they've never jumped them before. After all, they put too much effort into this to have it be half-assed. The best way to start in demos is to watch a few, then get some instruction, then do a low pressure demo where you don't have to jump. A demo into a field near the DZ is perfect. If you don't jump, you just go back to the airport and jump there. After a few of those, you can work up to wide open off-DZ demos. Add smoke the second time you jump in somewhere. Part of this is that the skills required go up gradually, but an even bigger part is that by starting gradually there's no burning need to make this one demo jump work. It's easy to fall into the trap of doing it all the first time, and then not being able to say no when it comes time to get in the door. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
adrenalinejunki 0 #24 April 20, 2006 Yes in front of the press. I am very conservative under canopy at all times. Even up high most of the time. I just like to hang out and enjoy the show. I always open higher then everyone else also. I don't want to cheat myself out of the canopy ride. I know my wing loading is kind of high for my jump numbers and that is another reason why I am so conservative. Canopy size hasn't changed for me since I was a student, I have just gotten fat.... __________________________________________________What's the worst that can happen? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mjosparky 4 #25 April 20, 2006 QuoteOne was a guy (Wade) jumping into his own wedding reception... he hooked it in and broke his back on landing... QuoteThe other was a low time jumper on a demo, made a mistake and wound up busting up both his legs so badly he almost bleed to death and almost had one or both amputated... Tim, I talked to both of these guys before they did they "demo" and advised them that it was probably not the smartest thing to do. As BillV said, "demo fever" can get you hurt or killed.My idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
