landing out + wind direction..how to tell?

[agent_lead 0]

i was wondering if you more experianced jumpers have any tips or tricks on how to tell the direction the wind is blowing on a out landing where there are no wind socks or flags or anything of that nature

i remember landing out and just not knowing which way to land...ended up landin downwind and busting my ass all over the parking lot

are there certain things you guys look for to tell which way its blowing?

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[dragon2 2]

Smoke, trees, grass, and/or a wind check up high. Also if you remember the position of the sun or major landmarks in relation to the windline before you take off, you'll know which way to face.

ciel bleu,
Saskia

[Merkur 1]

As an out landing normally shouldn't be to far from the dropzone, you can assume that you have the same wind direction as in your normal landing area.

So try to remember things like:
landing with the sun/the huge landmark (choose whatever you find at your DZ) on my left/right side.

If there is a lake in viewing distance, you sometimes can tell from the surface.

M.

vSCR No.94
Don't dream your life - live your dream!

[Peej 0]

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or a wind check up high

I'm assuming you mean turning your canopy in one direction and taking note of speed and then turning it around and taking note of speed going the other way? Faster one is downwind.

Is that right?

I was taught this technique on a canopy control course and it's the one i use most frequently if i have to land out.

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[ZigZagMarquis 9]

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or a wind check up high

I'm assuming you mean turning your canopy in one direction and taking note of speed and then turning it around and taking note of speed going the other way? Faster one is downwind.

Is that right?

I was taught this technique on a canopy control course and it's the one i use most frequently if i have to land out.

Correct.


Also, hopefully you're not "so far out" that you cannot see a windsock or flag or the direction folks who made it back to the DZ are landing in.

Also, also, if you're "out" and there are other folks out there with you landing before you, watch which direction they land in... if they're down-wind, they'll kick up a lot of dirt and dust which will give you an indication of the wind direction... just be careful not to do a low turn trying to get get on the wind-line or what you think the wind-line is.

[FrEaK_aCcIdEnT 0]

I have experienced that this isnt always doable. I know my jump numbers doesnt warrant much advice, but i can give a good example. My 1st jump last weekend had winds blowing to the west at well above 25mph down to about 1000'. But at ground level they were blowing towards the south at around 5-10mph. So an upper wind assesment would have given a wrong direction and made the final leg a cross wind landing. Given it was only 5-10 mph. It could have easily been 15+. Always something to consider.

I was taught half brakes and watch the ground track to check the winds. Why wouldnt you be able to do this while at 800' to give you time to adjust the landing pattern for a good final. (avoid sharp turns below 300')

I realize my very low experience may not be seeing the whole scheme of things so if im wrong let me know.

Edit: added "(avoid sharp turns below 300')" dont want anyone thinking im one of those that see low turns as ok. Maybe i should add Flat turns practice is good and practicing half brake landings with a good PLF are also beneficial???

ExPeCt ThE uNeXpEcTeD!
DoNt MiNd ThE tYpOs, Im LaZy On CoRrEcTiOnS!

[AggieDave 6]

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trees, grass

Never a fan of teaching to use these objects. They blow with the wind then come back, it can be very hard to accurately tell which way the wind is going using those objects.

If the wind is high enough you can tell by looking at ponds/water in the area which way the wind is blowing. You'll have ripples and no ripples on either side, the wind is going from the no ripples to the ripples.

--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."

[dunesurfer 0]

If I can't use any of the other described methods, I will flat turn my approach(when altitude allows) and both feel and listen for wind direction. Other than that, be prepared to land downwind,crosswind etc. I believe everyone will land out at sometime in their jumping career so it is best to prepare for this. You prepare yourself for dealing with malfunctions,so be proactive about landing out also. I have made 5 out landings to date,4 were to help retrieve others cut away gear :)

[Hooknswoop 19]

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If I can't use any of the other described methods, I will flat turn my approach(when altitude allows) and both feel and listen for wind direction.

That method will not work, since it will feel and sound exactly the same regardless if you are going into or with the wind.

Derek

[pilotdave 0]

Yeah when learning to fly I was taught that the wind is coming from the lighter side of the trees, since the bottom of leaves is usually lighter than the top and the wind blows them over on the upwind side. Never been able to actually tell the difference that way though.

Dave

[dunesurfer 0]

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If I can't use any of the other described methods, I will flat turn my approach(when altitude allows) and both feel and listen for wind direction.

That method will not work, since it will feel and sound exactly the same regardless if you are going into or with the wind.

Derek

It has worked for me. I don't believe I imagined it. I also spent many years of my life sailing, and I can "find" the wind without looking at tell-tales.

[davelepka 4]

Write yourself a flight plan before you jump. Include the wind speed, and direction, the exit and opengin points, and your intended landing point and the pattern you will use to get there.

If you find yourself landing off, it's not hard to simply translpant the landng pattern to your new landing point.

Be preparred and educate yourself about your enviornment before you jump so you don't have to do it during your jump.

[davelepka 4]

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I also spent many years of my life sailing, and I can "find" the wind without looking at tell-tales.

Nice try, but your sail boat is attached to the water, and moving through the air mass.

Your canopy is not attached to anything, and is moving with the air mass.

[justinb138 0]

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I don't believe I imagined it. I also spent many years of my life sailing, and I can "find" the wind without looking at tell-tales.

Next time, try it with your eyes closed.

[Hooknswoop 19]

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It has worked for me. I don't believe I imagined it.

During a flat turn, your canopy will have the exact same airspeed regardless if it is going into, cross, or with the wind. It will feel and sound exactly the same regardless of the wind. The only difference will be your ground speed/ground track.

It is impossible to determine wind direction under canopy without a ground reference using only feel and sound.

Let's say you are under canopy over a perfectly smooth cloud layer. Let's also say your canopy has a foward speed of 25 mph. Going into the wind, your airspeed wil be 25 mph and you will feel and hear the 25 mph airspeed. Then you turn down wind. Your canopy will still have a 25-mph airspeed and you will feel the exact same air moving past you and it will sound exactly the same. During this time, your ground speed could have gone from 0 to 50 mph or not changed at all without you feeling or hearing a difference between those groundspeeds.

A goldfish swimming at 1 mph will not feel a difference if it's fish bowl is stationary or moving smoothly at 10 mph.

Sailing is much different, as has been pointed out.

For landing out, I always knew the wind direction on the ground at take-off, knew where I was in relation to the DZ, and therefore knew which way the wind was blowing. I have also used the pond/rippel method and differences in ground speeds facing different directions to determine wind direction.

Derek

[MrBrant 0]

Bah, screw all this! I just pick a direction and land that way. I call it the "downwind lottery".




In all seriousness, I use most of the methods used above:
- determining wind direction before takeoff
- watching windsock in the distance
- watching ground speed.

The more tools you have in your belt, the better off you are

[kelpdiver 2]

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I don't believe I imagined it. I also spent many years of my life sailing, and I can "find" the wind without looking at tell-tales.

Next time, try it with your eyes closed.

It's really not that difficult. Provided you had the space to do it safely, you could quickly find the irons (upwind), because just 20-30 degrees on each side you get the strongest sensation of wind. In contrast to canopy flight, when you're on a dead run (downwind) you feel the least amount of wind.

On canopy, it does seem that the wind has some effect on turns, but I haven't figured out what that may be.

[justinb138 0]

I was referring to being under canopy.

[bmcd308 0]

>> Bah, screw all this! I just pick a direction and land that way. I call it the "downwind lottery". <<

If the alternative is to make four turns under 300 feet to determine wind direction and then face it, your alternative is very attractive.

EDIT to ADD: If you are not flying directly upwind or directly downwind, you can probably look down between your feet to determine your ground track. The difference between your heading and the groundtrack will give you an idea which way the wind is moving across the ground.

As was pointed out earlier, the wind on the ground might not be the same as the wind at 2 or 3 grand, but it is as good a guess as any.

It is far better to get lined up on a good, straight, safe runway off the dz regardless of the wind than to choose a tight, obstacle-filled landing area because you can land into the wind there.

Brent

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www.jumpelvis.com

[SkymonkeyONE 4]

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Smoke, trees, grass, and/or a wind check up high. Also if you remember the position of the sun or major landmarks in relation to the windline before you take off, you'll know which way to face.

I always look for smoke out of smokestacks, forrest fires, etc. My first choice, though, is to look over at the dropzone (even though I know I am not going to make it), compare my intended landing direction there to the terrain below me, then set up for a landing in that direction. I hope that makes sense.

Chuck

[Broke 0]

Pick a heading. take note of how you are flying. If you need no corrections then you are either going into the wind or going with the wind turn 90 degrees pick a heading and note which way you need to correct. For instance if you are being pushed to the left then you know you have to turn right to get into the windline.

Divot your source for all things Hillbilly.
Anvil Brother 84
SCR 14192

[kimemerson 7]

Lot of good advice here. I didn't read them all so forgive me if this is a repeat. One thing that will help is losing the fear of downwind or crosswind landings, or insisting on upwind landings. This depends on conditions and location, of course. But it helps to not buy into the teaching that we "should only" land into the wind. T'aint true. So, depending on skill, experience and talent (and balls, I suppose), wind direction is lower on the list of concerns with landing out.

[popsjumper 2]

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...From Hookandswoop:
For landing out, I always knew the wind direction on the ground at take-off, knew where I was in relation to the DZ, and therefore knew which way the wind was blowing. I have also used the pond/rippel method and differences in ground speeds facing different directions to determine wind direction.

All of this with emphasis on knowing your wind speeds and directions before you get on the plane and relating them to the direction of the sun, when usable, or the runway.

But realize that speed and direction could change after takeoff so the other methods are good to know also.
1. Ripples
2. Smoke
3. Other canopy landings
4. Ground speed
5. Flags flying nearby
6. and when all else fails...learn to land what you got.

Crosswind and downwind landing skills will come in handy on those off-landing days when you don't have a choice.

My reality and yours are quite different.
I think we're all Bozos on this bus.
Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239

[EDYDO 0]

I certainly agree with most of the methods given so far to determine wind direction.

I have seen several people bruised up pretty bad because of the following scenario when landing off. Quite often you are off because your exit was downwind of the DZ. So, one faces into the wind to get back and can't make it. It is a force of habit for most of us to turn 180 ( or two 90 degree) and face the wind on normal landings. What I have seen happen too many times is that this habit pattern takes over and they do a 180 just prior to landing and now they are going downwind !!!

It is even worse when it turns out to be an active cow pasture. Ask Air Trash.

Ed

[popsjumper 2]

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I certainly agree with most of the methods given so far to determine wind direction.

I have seen several people bruised up pretty bad because of the following scenario when landing off. Quite often you are off because your exit was upwind downwind of the DZ. So, one faces into the wind to get back and can't make it. It is a force of habit for most of us to turn 180 ( or two 90 degree) and face the wind on normal landings. What I have seen happen too many times is that this habit pattern takes over and they do a 180 just prior to landing and now they are going downwind !!!

It is even worse when it turns out to be an active cow pasture. Ask Air Trash.

Ed

Unless I'm crazy this morning.

My reality and yours are quite different.
I think we're all Bozos on this bus.
Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239