lawrocket 3 #1 June 2, 2006 I think that over the past few years, I've come to realize that this sport is as much about risk management as it is about anything. Obviously, there are some risks that are just a given - people will die. I think back to the situation wherein my younger brother fractured his femur playing football. While being taken from the ambulance into the ER, he was dropped. Unacceptable? Well, you figure that a busy ER has 5,000-10,000 ambulances arriving per year. You'd figure that just with bad luck, there are gonna be a few that get dropped. One exceedingly busy center in LA figures that 20 per year is acceptable to them considering their volume. There was a random bizarre incident this weekend. A one in a million failure? It's probably acceptable. There's no use trying to prevent it. It's like preparing for "The Big One" in California - it's easier and better to make stuff that can stand up to a 7.1 than an 8.3 - eventually it just becomes prohibitive to even try. But, we do see some risks that many view as unacceptable. People try to talk the newbies out of getting rocket canopies. Some say, "It's their choice." Others opine, "Yes it is, but they have no idea the risks that they are taking. Let's at least educate them." Others believe in a wingloading BSR. But there also seem to be some things that are not acceptable. Low pulls are generally unacceptable, etc. Why are these risks unacceptable when other risks are acceptable? My wife is hotter than your wife. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bob.dino 1 #2 June 2, 2006 QuoteWhy are these risks unacceptable when other risks are acceptable? Because too many people die. edit: I really like the APF Safety Poster Safe Skydiving Is An Attitude. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mjosparky 4 #3 June 2, 2006 It is sort of like have surgery. When you have surgery it is minor surgery. When I have surgery it is major surgery. If you get killed jumping I might see that as acceptable. If I get killed jumping that is totally unacceptable. It comes down to you point of view.My idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
UntamedDOG 0 #4 June 2, 2006 QuotePeople try to talk the newbies out of getting rocket canopies. Some say, "It's their choice." It’s only their choice if they aren’t sharing the airspace with 14 other people. My biggest fear is getting taken out by a complete dipshit on final approach. UntamedDOG Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
obelixtim 150 #5 June 2, 2006 They are unacceptable when its me that has to pick up the pieces, and then explain what happened to the media..... It gets quite difficult trying to defend skydiving as a sport when some fool has cocked it up.....My computer beat me at chess, It was no match for me at kickboxing.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CanuckInUSA 0 #6 June 2, 2006 QuoteMy biggest fear is getting taken out by a complete dipshit My biggest fear is taking myself out since I should know better. Try not to worry about the things you have no control over Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
twibbles 0 #7 June 2, 2006 QuoteQuoteMy biggest fear is getting taken out by a complete dipshit My biggest fear is taking myself out since I should know better. My biggest fear is screwing up and taking someone else out. Eugene "In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jakee 1,564 #8 June 2, 2006 Hell yeah. I would hate for someone else to be the victim of my stupidity.Do you want to have an ideagasm? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
beowulf 1 #9 June 2, 2006 personal choice is what makes some risks more acceptable then others. I have jumped in winds up to 32 mph. Some days I will do that and other days I won't. Some days I want the added risk other days I don't. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skybytch 273 #10 June 2, 2006 Quoteedit: I really like the APF Safety Poster Safe Skydiving Is An Attitude. Nice. I wrote that. Now who do I contact to get credit for it? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Belgian_Skygirl 0 #11 June 2, 2006 The risk is acceptable as long as things go well, and they are not if they turn out bad. I think there is a difference ebtween an acceptable risk for society and an acceptable risk for an individual.------------------------------------------------- No dive, like skydive... wanna bet on it? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wmw999 2,545 #12 June 2, 2006 What makes a risk acceptable includes how much of the risk can be mitigated, how well it's understood, how much control people have over the risk system, the benefit (including enjoyment) that come from it, and the general degree to which the person or society is risk-averse. Right now the US as a whole is extremely risk-averse. The amount of post-event analysis, its easy communication, and its detailed nature (just look at the incidents forum) makes people think twice about doing things that were easier even 20 years ago. Overall systems are more complex, which makes risk management harder in some ways. We have systems to mitigate the risks, but those systems need a more complex analysis to manage smaller risks than the original system might have. So the real answer is "it depends." Wendy W.There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CanuckInUSA 0 #13 June 2, 2006 QuoteQuoteQuoteMy biggest fear is getting taken out by a complete dipshit My biggest fear is taking myself out since I should know better. My biggest fear is screwing up and taking someone else out. Eugene A couple of summers ago I almost did that to someone else on a head down freefly jump. At that time I told myself to slow down and concentrate on canopy control and the next thing you know I'm doing tons and tons of hop n' pops and I became a competitive swooper. So most of my jumps lately aren't done with very many others. But you're right I would like to ammend what I said last night. My biggest fear is taking myself and someone else out because I know better and it's almost happened in my past. It's a marathon not a sprint to become better in this sport. Try not to worry about the things you have no control over Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JohnMitchell 16 #14 June 2, 2006 Quote My biggest fear is getting taken out by a complete dipshit on final approach. UntamedDOG Holy Shit! I totally agree with UntamedDOG. How come you're making sense today? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AFFI 0 #15 June 2, 2006 QuoteQuoteQuoteMy biggest fear is getting taken out by a complete dipshit My biggest fear is taking myself out since I should know better. My biggest fear is screwing up and taking someone else out. My biggest fear is trying to figgure out how to pay for all this shit... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,107 #16 June 2, 2006 Simple, really: It's acceptable if I will take it, and unacceptable if I won't. Those who take risks I won't are raving lunatics. Those who won't take risks I will are wusses. Have a nice day.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ChangoLanzao 0 #17 June 2, 2006 It depends. Whether a given risk is "acceptable" vs "unacceptable" will depend on the degree to which the benefit outweighs the risk. It's not a simple matter of taking a ratio of two numbers though because neither can easily be quantified. Both depend on many parameters, so in order to reach a consensus on the answer to your question, it would be necessary to reach a consensus on those parameters. Problem is that the parameters change with time and context. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ChangoLanzao 0 #18 June 2, 2006 QuoteSimple, really: It's acceptable if I will take it, and unacceptable if I won't. Those who take risks I won't are raving lunatics. Those who won't take risks I will are wusses. Have a nice day. Bravo! This is the best answer. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
