Using a DZs fatality to hurt their business

[omnus 0]

Here’s the situation between two DZ’s…. One is a DZ who has had some pretty bad luck and has had a couple of experienced jumper fatalities. Neither of the fatalities where a result of rule or safety violations and both were extremely experienced jumpers. The other DZ is located in the same area. They do very little business, and I imaging that when they see the other DZ doing quite a bit of business that they feel a little hurt or jealous. Anyhow, DZ # 2 routinely tells the other business’s customers (when they call to compare or accidentally go to the wrong DZ) that DZ # 1 is unsafe. They use the two fatalities to back up their assertions.

My question is this: Does anyone have an idea of what can be done to stop this? DZ # 1 has already tried talking with DZ # 2 and even though the effected customers have written statements, DZ # 2 denies that they are doing it.

[Scoop 0]

If we knew what country or state/area you were talking about you might get better advice

[CSpenceFLY 1]

I would start by posting who we are talking about here.Oh course this being your first post and no profile info I don't think it would be taken seriously.You obviously have a problem standing behind what you have to say.That having been said I would never support a DZO that would do such a thing.To this DZO I would say,"you never know when to tables will turn".Karmas a bitch with a big stick.

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[chrismgtis 0]

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My question is this: Does anyone have an idea of what can be done to stop this?

That seems like something you might want to ask the USPA or a lawyer possibly. They may know more about the legalities of that type of thing.

If the DZ is infact doing that, that's not cool. Accidents happen. If it wasn't that DZ's fault then they shouldn't be punished for it.

Rodriguez Brother #1614, Muff Brother #4033
Jumped: Twin Otter, Cessna 182, CASA, Helicopter, Caravan

[omnus 0]

The country is the USA. I don't think that the State makes any difference (unless there is a law in some of the states that outlaws despicable marketing techniques).

[georgerussia 0]

IMHO it should be obvious that DZ with a lot of business will generally have more accidents happen than DZ with little or no business.

* Don't pray for me if you wanna help - just send me a check. *

[chrismgtis 0]

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IMHO it should be obvious that DZ with a lot of business will generally have more accidents happen than DZ with little or no business.

That's exactly what I was thinking too.

Rodriguez Brother #1614, Muff Brother #4033
Jumped: Twin Otter, Cessna 182, CASA, Helicopter, Caravan

[lisamariewillbe 1]

Did Ben or Cary set you up? Funny how their hinchmen hide behind new user names

Sudsy Fist: i don't think i'd ever say this
Sudsy Fist: but you're looking damn sudsydoable in this

[bbarnhouse 0]

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IMHO it should be obvious that DZ with a lot of business will generally have more accidents happen than DZ with little or no business

That is not necessarily an accurate statement.
For instance, one can have a dz that generated 100,000+ skydives a year and goes a few years without a fatality, then has 2 in a short period of time. While a DZ that puts out less than half those numbers has twice as many in 1 year.

[Scoop 0]

Ahh ok, well sorry, I can't help with yank law

[omnus 0]

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IMHO it should be obvious that DZ with a lot of business will generally have more accidents happen than DZ with little or no business.

Unfortunately, non-jumpers who are coming out for their first jump normally don't realize that.

Thinking about it, the customers are the ones who suffer the most. This unethical DZ is turning their first skydiving experience into a nightmare by scaring them (unreasonably). I have had several of the customers who were exposed to this treatment write statements explaining what happened to them. Not sure if they can be used in any way but I thought that it would be prudent to at least document it. It's amazing how most of them are willing to do that.

[lisamariewillbe 1]

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the customers are the ones who suffer the most

Yes it is the customers who are hurt the most..... but hey you dont need to tell what DZ you represent.... your 20 mins from everywhere

Sudsy Fist: i don't think i'd ever say this
Sudsy Fist: but you're looking damn sudsydoable in this

[pilatus_p 0]

Perhaps we should be looking at the bigger picture here - the popularity of the sport of skydiving as a whole.

It seems that DZ's are fighting over a dwindling pool of customers and its leading to these (seemingly self defeating) in-battles.

It seems, if I mention my AFF, people either say 'oh Ive done that' thinking I mean a tandem, or they think i mean static line. When I tell them what AFF is, they look at me like I just regurgitated a melon. There is very little awareness of sport skydiving outside these two things, which tend to be one-off / charity oriented. That is possibly why there are many so called tandem mills out there.

I don't know what its like in the states, but I'm from the UK and live in Scotland, Aberdeen. I must admit I never see ANYTHING to do with skydiving up here, despite there being three (correct me if im wrong) dropzones up here. In Aberdeen there are a few scuba shops and I know loads of people that are into diving. That is probably because we have the sea nearby - but I often find that people who scuba are often people who would skydive, being the adventurous types. This is one place that DZ's might target new skydivers, and I'm sure there are others such as Kayaking, freeclimbing etc.

There needs to be more POSITIVE coverage of the accessible level of skydiving. I never hear about the amazing achievements of formation skydivers despite some of the incredible things they do; and how about the unbelievable sensations experienced by a wingsuit flyer or head-downer? But most importantly I never hear how ITS POSSIBLE FOR THE NORMAL, AVERAGE JOE to get involved in the sport.

The coverage we do get is, on the one hand, things like Blue Peter (google it!) presenters doing an AFF level 1 or reality shows using it as a 'punishment'; And on the other, stunning images of Skygods blazing smoke across the sky, or Troy Hartman doing EEXXXTRREEEEME things with motorbikes and parachutes, with that woman yapping away in the background (dont get me wrong, the stunts are cool and she's cute )

All in all, our sport is not portrayed as something that is accessible or desirable to the normal person. You and I know we can just go to a DZ and start a training programme, but most people don't work like that - they need to see others doing it and see it as a good / cool / fun idea (thats why TV and billboard advertising always has attractive people 'enjoying' whatever product they are pushing! Natch - social proof)

On the other hand, I quite like that it IS exclusive, but if there are not enough people in the sport to sustain it then it will dwindle, and none of us want to see that happen.

Instead of squabbling between DZ's and trying to take lumps out of one another, why don't we try to use the collective experience and intelligence we have on these boards to come up with ways of increasing the numbers of skydivers in the sport? Then DZ's won't need to fight - there will be more newbies to go round!

Here's my opening suggestions:

1) Linking up with suppliers to other extreme sports to try to attract like minded people.

2) How about a skydiving reality show? In the UK we had 'Bad Lads Army' where we put some young, slightly directionless guys through a 50's style army bootcamp. How about putting 10 guys (with a fear of heights????) through AFF and FS1, and getting them to do a 10-way?

3) Finding our best 'faces' within the sport to promote it as a friendly accessible sport that normal people take up as a hobby - as opposed to the common view that we're all freako adrenaline junkies (just one of the comments i've heard .... )

Theres another thread along the same lines elsewhere on the board - I will post over there too
http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?do=post_view_flat;post=2333693;page=1;sb=post_latest_reply;so=ASC;mh=25;

Ross

http://www.teamtechnology.co.uk/troll.htm