Questions About USPA Budget

[WatchYourStep 0]

I was wondering if anyone knows where I can find the following information:

-A budget for USPA. I mean we pay membership dues so I think it's reasonable to be able to show us where the money is going. You know how much money is spent on advertising, salaries, web development, education, etc.

-Is USPA a not for profit organization? If not why?

Thanks

"You start off your skydiving career with a bag full of luck and an empty bag of experience. The trick is to fill the bag of experience up before your bag of luck runs out."

[darkwing 5]

They publish budget stuff in Parachutist every year, but I don't recall the details of the budget, although some breakdown is given.

-- Jeff
My Skydiving History

[skydived19006 4]

I’d like to see the financials, but I’m personally more interested in accountability. What level of authority does the BOD have over staff? Dose the BOD only have control of the BSRs, and no real authority over staff? Does the BOD have hire/fire authority over the staff (that’s the real acid test!)? The only control the membership has over the direction of THEIR organization is through the BOD. If the BOD is simply a group of castrated figure heads, then in turn we have no control of our organization at all. In that case ultimately the only control the membership would really have is in membership renewal. If we can’t control this organization politically, we can simply choose to un-fund the damn thing! You don’t pay your federal and state taxes; eventually people with guns will come looking for you, that’s not the case with the USPA!

Experience is what you get when you thought you were going to get something else.

AC DZ

[WatchYourStep 0]

Well let's see what the BOD members say. (I posted a link to this thread in the BOD forum).

Unfunding the USPA Martin would have to start from the top (DZOs) and work down. If my current DZ didn't require USPA membership I would be less likely to get it, but it does, so I get it regardless of my feeling about the USPA.

Every dropzone in Kansas requires their jumpers to be USPA members, so us licensed jumpers have to join if we want to jump in Kansas anyways.

"You start off your skydiving career with a bag full of luck and an empty bag of experience. The trick is to fill the bag of experience up before your bag of luck runs out."

[jlmiracle 7]

Quote

I was wondering if anyone knows where I can find the following information:

-A budget for USPA. I mean we pay membership dues so I think it's reasonable to be able to show us where the money is going. You know how much money is spent on advertising, salaries, web development, education, etc.

-Is USPA a not for profit organization? If not why?

Thanks

ummmmmm Ask the USPA? I bet they have the answers to your questions.

j

Be kinder than necessary because everyone you meet is fighting some kind of battle.

[WatchYourStep 0]

I was just seeing if anyone knew here, but I did take your advice already and called.

They put me in touch with HR and I was able to leave a voicemail but was assured that I would get a return call after the lunch hour.

I'll let you know what I hear.

We as jumpers should be wondering where are money is going to. Is it being used in a way that benefits skydivers as a whole or is it going to places/things/people that don't benefit the group?

I know that sounds very conspiracy theory, but it's not meant to be. I just want to know where my membership dues are going, that's all.

"You start off your skydiving career with a bag full of luck and an empty bag of experience. The trick is to fill the bag of experience up before your bag of luck runs out."

[WatchYourStep 0]

For instance in 2005 USPA reported that their were 31,276 members. Now that means they belong to the USPA so they pay their yearly dues. I realize that some of these members are life long members so let's take it down to 30,000 members (assuming 1,276 are life long members which may be high.)

If these 30,000 pay their renewal fee of $49 (granted some will pay more for instructor renewals, first time members and people who are overseas, but let's keep it easy at $49)

30,000 members X $49 = $1,470,000 a year. That's a lot of change. We need to make sure it's all being accounted for. This doesn't even take into account the fees group members pay.

Edited to remove $ in front of 30,000 members and to add X instead of times.

"You start off your skydiving career with a bag full of luck and an empty bag of experience. The trick is to fill the bag of experience up before your bag of luck runs out."

[skydived19006 4]

$30,000 times $49 = $1,470,000 a year. That's a lot of change. We need to make sure it's all being accounted for. This doesn't even take into account the fees group members pay.

[NickDG 23]

When (the late) Jack Bergman was the treasurer ('70s and early '80s) USPA ran a yearly budget report that was very transparent and detailed. The ones they run now aren't so much, like this one below.

I'm no bookkeeper, but if "compensation" refers to salaries, it seems pretty high. . .

NickD BASE 194

1997 Budget

Revenue Collected
Dues $ 1,664,000
Fees $ 295,800
Sales of Services $ 624,200
Sales of Products $ 239,400
Commissions $ 196,500
Royalties $ 20,000
Contributions $ 16,000
Investment Income $ 37,000
Other Income $ 1,600
Discounts and Rebates $ 3,000
------------
$ 3,097,500

Expenses Paid
---> Compensation $ 1,049,100 <---
Office and Administra $ 153,600
Mailing and Shipping $ 270,800
Occupancy $ 73,000
Taxes - Nonpayroll $ 21,400
Outside Services $ 239,000
Communications $ 28,500
Travel and Related $ 76,000
Advertising and Promo $ 15,900
Inventory Expense $ 96,300
Production $ 65,000
Printing $ 441,400
Events and Meetings $ 27,100
Premiums $ 301,000
Rebates $ 15,500
Miscellaneous $ 9,400
------------
$ 2,883,000

[labrys 0]

Quote

I'm no bookkeeper, but if "compensation" refers to salaries, it seems pretty high. . .

How many employees does USPA have?

Owned by Remi #?

[michalm21 2]

The file won't attach because its 1.6mb I will see if i can post screenshots of relevant info.

this is from a site called guidestar.org they provide information re non profits

the latest form 990 submitted was for 2004.
Briefly:

Revenue: $2,623,784 (includes Membership fees of 1.588M)
Expenses: $2,616,297 (salaries: 798K saleries & wages)

Chirtopher Needles, Executive Director, made $102,055 (Statement 18)

edit: it's guidestar.ORG

[skydived19006 4]

Can you provide a link to the guidestar.com page, or is membership/fee required?

Martin

Experience is what you get when you thought you were going to get something else.

AC DZ

[michalm21 2]

I divided the original file

Guidestar is free to view this info (but need to sign up for an account)
www.guidestar.org

Cheers
MM

edit: made it clicky

[WatchYourStep 0]

Thanks for the responses thus far.

Mr. Needles actually returned my phone message from earlier, which is cool because I actually left on Ms. George's machine.

I'm bummed that I wasn't able to take the call.

In short:

The end of the year figures are public and the end of the year figures should be available at the end of Jan. because an audit is coming up. He'll also be putting his usual annual report in Parachutist.

He also stated that the upcoming years budget will be voted on soon, but the detailed budget itself is an internal working document for management use only.

So I guess I can get a financial statement but not a budget, that's interesting.

"You start off your skydiving career with a bag full of luck and an empty bag of experience. The trick is to fill the bag of experience up before your bag of luck runs out."

[NickDG 23]

Goodness . . .

>>Chirtopher Needles, Executive Director, made $102,055 <<

Hey, all you struggling, taco bell eating, Instructors who own 15 year old cars please take note . . .

NickD BASE 194

[WatchYourStep 0]

Quote

When (the late) Jack Bergman was the treasurer ('70s and early '80s) USPA ran a yearly budget report that was very transparent and detailed. The ones they run now aren't so much, like this one below.

I'm no bookkeeper, but if "compensation" refers to salaries, it seems pretty high. . .

NickD BASE 194

1997 Budget

Revenue Collected
Dues $ 1,664,000
Fees $ 295,800
Sales of Services $ 624,200
Sales of Products $ 239,400
Commissions $ 196,500
Royalties $ 20,000
Contributions $ 16,000
Investment Income $ 37,000
Other Income $ 1,600
Discounts and Rebates $ 3,000
------------
$ 3,097,500

Expenses Paid
---> Compensation $ 1,049,100 <---
Office and Administra $ 153,600
Mailing and Shipping $ 270,800
Occupancy $ 73,000
Taxes - Nonpayroll $ 21,400
Outside Services $ 239,000
Communications $ 28,500
Travel and Related $ 76,000
Advertising and Promo $ 15,900
Inventory Expense $ 96,300
Production $ 65,000
Printing $ 441,400
Events and Meetings $ 27,100
Premiums $ 301,000
Rebates $ 15,500
Miscellaneous $ 9,400
------------
$ 2,883,000

Thanks Nick for that but do you know the answer to this?

If revenue was roughly 3.1 million and expenses were roughly 2.9 million. Where is the other $200,000? I realize that an organization is going to have remaining funds available at year end, but where does that money go?

Just curious. Figure the return rate on $200,000 over 9 years at the average rate of return between (8-10%) and you'll have a decent size amount.

Like I said just curious.

"You start off your skydiving career with a bag full of luck and an empty bag of experience. The trick is to fill the bag of experience up before your bag of luck runs out."

[Buried 0]

Quote

So I guess I can get a financial statement but not a budget, that's interesting.

No, not really. In some cases a budget is meaningless, unless you are specifically looking for how much they can afford to spend above and beyond 'normal' day to day activites. .
Private non-profits do not have to disclose that information unless they want to.. and if they do, it's usually informal. That includes it's members.

Where is my fizzy-lifting drink?

[NickDG 23]

>>If revenue was roughly 3.1 million and expenses were roughly 2.9 million. Where is the other $200,000?

I used to think it went into an interest bearing account, but now I think it just goes into the beer kitty . . .

NickD BASE 194

[skydived19006 4]

The "extra money" gets carried over. That's where the money for the new museum, and offices came from "saving up".

Experience is what you get when you thought you were going to get something else.

AC DZ

[WatchYourStep 0]

Quote

>>If revenue was roughly 3.1 million and expenses were roughly 2.9 million. Where is the other $200,000?

I used to think it went into an interest bearing account, but now I think it just goes into the beer kitty . . .

NickD BASE 194

Heck that would be one big kitty, for that amount we should step it up to Vodka or Gin instead of just beer

"You start off your skydiving career with a bag full of luck and an empty bag of experience. The trick is to fill the bag of experience up before your bag of luck runs out."

[skybytch 273]

Quote

That's where the money for the new museum, and offices came from "saving up".

That and the revenue gained from the old, fully paid off headquarters.

[NickDG 23]

The real hero, and the fellow who saved USPA, was Bill Ottley. When I first joined USPA in 1975 they didn't have two bucks to rub together. And they were always worrying about getting the money just to pay for the next general membership meeting.

Ottley, with his Harvard MBA, turned all that around and I recall how amazed we were when USPA first became worth over a million dollars.

The real threat to skydiving, bar none, are access issues. And USPA should be throwing our money at that more than anything else. Fancy new buildings in the middle of nowhere (which will never appreciate like the HQ in Alexandria did) are a waste. USPA HQ was in an old run down San Francisco Cannery Row brothel when Norm Heaton ran things and they should do something like that again. "Being close to the seat of power" as they like to say means nothing these days.

Besides, (global warming notwithstanding) USPA HQ should be in a sun belt state. They would get more people banging on their door with imput when those people are actually jumping year round. But maybe hiding in the woods is their real play . . .

NickD BASE 194

[JohnRich 4]

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So I guess I can get a financial statement but not a budget, that's interesting.

It's my understanding that the board members, which we elect, get copies of all this financial info. So ask your regional director for a copy. That's who your representative is, and through whom you should make your requests. That's what they are there for.

I am proud to say that I had something to do with getting the ball rolling a few years ago on publishing the annual financial statement in "Parachutist" magazine. Prior to that, the general members never even got that high level data.

[jlmiracle 7]

Quote

Goodness . . .

>>Chirtopher Needles, Executive Director, made $102,055 <<

Hey, all you struggling, taco bell eating, Instructors who own 15 year old cars please take note . . .

NickD BASE 194

Do you have ANY idea the hours he puts in or EVERYTHING he does.

How many instructors out there pay all their taxes? No one is making them be instructors and its no secret and never has been that if you CHOOSE to make your living skydiving you will live below the poverty line.

You think you can do it better and cheaper, then I suggest you send a resume.

J

Be kinder than necessary because everyone you meet is fighting some kind of battle.

[WatchYourStep 0]

Quote

Quote

Goodness . . .

>>Chirtopher Needles, Executive Director, made $102,055 <<

Hey, all you struggling, taco bell eating, Instructors who own 15 year old cars please take note . . .

NickD BASE 194

Do you have ANY idea the hours he puts in or EVERYTHING he does.

How many instructors out there pay taxes - all of them?

You think you can do it better and cheaper, then I suggest you send a resume.

J

No I don't know the hours he put in or what he does, please enlighten me (I'm being serious.)

Instructors paying taxes has nothing to do with this discussion so please spin that in another thread.

PS: If somebody is making $100K a year you're getting no sympathy from me, regardless of your job. Even if you are working 80 hour weeks that still is about $24 an hour. Not bad.

PPS: How is that salary amount decided? Does the BOD decide it? Also does he having any incentives in his plan? You know if membership reaches X you get a bonus, etc.

"You start off your skydiving career with a bag full of luck and an empty bag of experience. The trick is to fill the bag of experience up before your bag of luck runs out."