Audible altimeter freefall warning altitudes ...

[JohnnyBoulder 1]

I did a couple of searches and didn't see any obvious posts, but I would not be surprised if this topic has been covered already. So if you have a link, post away. Some might say this one belongs in the gear section, but my mind is on safety here.

How do you all set the freefall warning altitudes on your audible altimeters, especially you highly experienced jumpers? I currently have an L&B Optima II which allows for three freefall warnings (four sets thereof).

Initially I set my warnings for break off, deployment, and hard deck target altitudes. I spoke with a jumper at my DZ who said he sets his warning altitudes 500' above his target altitudes to get a warning those target altitudes are coming up. Then another jumper told me that he sets his warning altitudes below his target altitudes, don't remember by how much, but his concern was that he would learn to rely on his audible more, and visual less. There may be other schools of thought and hybrids of these approaches.

[chuckakers 426]

JohnnyBoulder

I did a couple of searches and didn't see any obvious posts, but I would not be surprised if this topic has been covered already. So if you have a link, post away. Some might say this one belongs in the gear section, but my mind is on safety here.

How do you all set the freefall warning altitudes on your audible altimeters, especially you highly experienced jumpers? I currently have an L&B Optima II which allows for three freefall warnings (four sets thereof).

Initially I set my warnings for break off, deployment, and hard deck target altitudes. I spoke with a jumper at my DZ who said he sets his warning altitudes 500' above his target altitudes to get a warning those target altitudes are coming up. Then another jumper told me that he sets his warning altitudes below his target altitudes, don't remember by how much, but his concern was that he would learn to rely on his audible more, and visual less. There may be other schools of thought and hybrids of these approaches.

I set mine for the break off altitude, and second and third at 1,000 foot increments from there.

Some people set a 3-alarm audible for break off and then the second and third at the same altitudes for all jumps - like 2,500 and 1,800 feet - as checkpoints for hard decks canopy-related issues.

Chuck Akers
D-10855
Houston, TX

[GLIDEANGLE 1]

I wear a visual altimeter which is my primary altitude reference.

From the bottom up:

-My third alarm is set at my canopy decision altitude. If I hear it and don't have a good canopy.... it is time to EXECUTE. This is the same altitude for all jumps.

-My second alarm is set at my "flare & wave" altitude... a bit above my desired pull altitude (~500 ft). This is usually the same altitude from jump to jump. The most common exception is on larger group RW jumps where I may be assigned a different pull altitude.

-My first alarm is set differently for various jumps:
.....-For fun jumps and coach jumps it is set for break-off.
.....-For AFF jumps it is set for the student's pull altitude.

Of course, the ultimate back-up is looking at the ground. My brain is pretty good at recognizing the ground image for my typical pull altitude

The choices we make have consequences, for us & for others!

[airtwardo 7]

Quote

Initially I set my warnings for break off, deployment, and hard deck target altitudes.

Mine's set for main opening altitude, hard deck and 'oh shit pull everything' ~ ~ 3000 - 2000 & 1000

(actually that last one @ a grand has more to do with choreography when doing demos, too lazy to change it)

However, I rely on my eyes and my wrist mount first.

I consider an audible as a 'back-up' only - my aim is to NOT hear it in freefall.

~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~

[cazzercam 0]

5.5k for any breakoff/stop dicking about
4k for pull time
3k for dumb fuck tracked too long

all these are 500feet off what is normal, as I use the audible as a warning, it means stop and take a look at your alti, those extra seconds come in handy sometimes

[xsniper 1]

If you only have one alarm, what is the suggestion??

[chuckakers 426]

xsniper

If you only have one alarm, what is the suggestion??

Break-off. If you screw that one up you've started the chain and that's what audibles are intended to avoid.

Chuck Akers
D-10855
Houston, TX

[Southern_Man 0]

xsniper

If you only have one alarm, what is the suggestion??

Get a better audible

"What if there were no hypothetical questions?"

[BigMikeH77 0]

I also have an Optima II and am getting to know it still (have only had it for over a week), but I like the features. I have "ride up" alerts set to 2k, 5k, and 10k and check those against the visual on my hand, although I still find myself peeking at others' hand-mounts just to compare.

For high speed alerts I have mine set at break-off, pull, and oh-shit/decision altitudes. From what I understand the L&B Quattro adds the option of a fourth alert, but I decided that could possibly confuse me and opted for the 3-alert Optima II.

I use the canopy alert tones only as reference and don't base any maneuvers solely on them. I believe they are intended more for high performance stuff than for standard "straight in" patterns, but nonetheless it's nice to have the extra reference.

Some sort of logging capability would have been nice, but that was an extra $100 I just didn't want to spend.

[jumpsalot-2 3]

6, 3, 2....... 6 is a heads-up for freeflying or tandem videos.

Life is short ... jump often.

[Pobrause 6]

4500 for Breakoff, except of bigger formations
3000 pull reminder
1500 knock knock, still there?! -.-'

-------------------------------------------------------

To absent friends

[skydiverek 63]

BigMikeH77

From what I understand the L&B Quattro adds the option of a fourth alert, but I decided that could possibly confuse me and opted for the 3-alert Optima II.

I believe Quattro can be set for 1 or 2 or 3 or 4 alarms. Just like Optima can be set for 1 or 2 or 3 alarms. Just set the SAME altitudes for the alarms.

[jhh166 0]

Southern_Man

***If you only have one alarm, what is the suggestion??

Get a better audible

I set all three alarms for 5000'. I use it as a reminder that I now have a different set of priorities. I don't switch the settings at all because I am not much smarter than Pavlov's dog, I guess the dog was smart but you get the idea.
I have a visual on my wrist and eyes that are starting to become reliable as I jump more. I dont feel the need for more additional alarms in my ear while in freefall or under canopy. Just my preference and YMMV

[shropshire 0]

Really doesn't matter what 'we' do ..... do one thing and be consistent and stick with it, would be my advice.

(.)Y(.)
Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome

[fasted3 0]

shropshire

Really doesn't matter what 'we' do ..... do one thing and be consistent and stick with it, would be my advice.

Mine too. I know some like to change theirs depending on the type of jump, but I never change mine. I don't look for it to tell me to do anything either, it simply tells me when I reach certain altitudes. It has trained my eyes quite well, and if I don't hear the first one at 5500' I'm looking at my altimeter to see why.

But what do I know?

[tbrown 26]

My "default" settings for most skydives are at 4500/3000/2000 ft. for breakoff, pull, and hard deck. For things like larger formations I'll reset to assigned breakoff (like 5500). I leave the hard deck at 2000.
If I'm still humming thru 2 grand I want to know in every possible way.

Usually I'll get clear and toss before the pull alarm goes off, which it usually does while I'm at line stretch. If I'm on a bigway and been told to pull lower, I'll track through the pull alarm and will still be sitting in without the hard deck going off. If the hard deck goes off at line stretch, I'm not going to try to fix anything like line twists, it's all good or it's gone.

Your humble servant.....Professor Gravity !

[JackC1 0]

5k, 4k, 2k. I set them like that when I bought them (I have two audibles), I've never changed them, I'm used to that and I don't want to confuse myself by changing them now.

[Remster 30]

Find a system that works for you and stick with it.

Mine is breakoff, 3k (opening), 1.5k

Remster

[rohicks 2]

JohnnyBoulder

I did a couple of searches and didn't see any obvious posts, but I would not be surprised if this topic has been covered already. So if you have a link, post away. Some might say this one belongs in the gear section, but my mind is on safety here.

How do you all set the freefall warning altitudes on your audible altimeters, especially you highly experienced jumpers? I currently have an L&B Optima II which allows for three freefall warnings (four sets thereof).

Initially I set my warnings for break off, deployment, and hard deck target altitudes. I spoke with a jumper at my DZ who said he sets his warning altitudes 500' above his target altitudes to get a warning those target altitudes are coming up. Then another jumper told me that he sets his warning altitudes below his target altitudes, don't remember by how much, but his concern was that he would learn to rely on his audible more, and visual less. There may be other schools of thought and hybrids of these approaches.

Must not of searched very hard. Here are a couple good threads discussing it.
http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=4533011
http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=2078118

I just got my quattro for xmas so I don't have a lot of experience with it. For what it's worth my settings are below, and may not be the best however I'm still experimenting. I set the first two alarms above my required take action altitudes. Figure it's easy for me to blow through a couple hundred feet by the time I react so I want the warning ahead of time to stop whatever I'm doing and react. Although I'm always pretty good at keeping altitude aware.

5,500 w/track guide on - turn to break off which I should be by 5,000
3,800 - stop tracking wave off and pitch by 3,500
2,300 - EPs at this warning
1,200 - last ditch effort to get fabric out

Canopy alarms at:
900
600
300

[CornishChris 5]

shropshire

Really doesn't matter what 'we' do ..... do one thing and be consistent and stick with it, would be my advice.

Agreed. A friend of mine and I were chatting one day about this. He set his to 8k (half way through (no idea why)), 4.5k (breakoff), and 3k (pull). We discussed that this might be a bit silly as one of the benefits was the hard deck warning. He proceeded to change it to 4.5k, 3k, 1.5k.

A few weeks later when he went jumping he forgot that he had changed it (I think you can see where this is going...), was at a new DZ where they happened to exit a bit lower on that jump (10k not 14k). He did a solo head down jump, tracked onto his back at the second warning and flipped onto his belly at the third and deployed. He was directly above the DZ at c. 1400 feet. He was grounded for some time and told to think about what he had done. He never did it again.

CJP

Gods don't kill people. People with Gods kill people

[Deimian 43]

CornishChris

***Really doesn't matter what 'we' do ..... do one thing and be consistent and stick with it, would be my advice.

Agreed. A friend of mine and I were chatting one day about this. He set his to 8k (half way through (no idea why)), 4.5k (breakoff), and 3k (pull). We discussed that this might be a bit silly as one of the benefits was the hard deck warning. He proceeded to change it to 4.5k, 3k, 1.5k.


That is similar to what I do (6000, 4000 and 3300). I first one is a wake up call ("hey, break off is coming, you should already know that, but just in case I'm telling you"). Then break off and "stop tracking, box position and pull". Realizing this I bought another audible for "pull now asshole", "get rid of that malfunctioning canopy right now" and "get out as much nylon as possible". Also for a peace of mind in case of the "main" audible does not work for whatever reason. Besides that (and I think this is very important), I am planning on training more my eyes for the upcoming season, I am getting more afraid of not knowing which alarm I am hearing.

[councilman24 37]

I've always thought the last alarm should "pull before you break me!!!"

As you can see thoughts vary. Do you want it to warn you that an action altitude is coming up or remind you that you forgot to do something. My first is a hey its time to think about stopping having fun, second hey you should have pulled by now, and the don't break me alarm - time to pull in order to beat the AAD.

I'm old for my age.
Terry Urban
D-8631
FAA DPRE

[JohnnyBoulder 1]

Thanks for replying everyone. Fascinating - I was expecting to see more of a consensus in how these things are used.

FWIW, and I may change my approach, here is how I ended up setting up mine. My 1st alarm is 500' before desired break-off altitude. I went with the pre-warning concept as then I know I have about three seconds until I should be tracking off (belly flying). 2nd alarm set to 500' above pull altitude for coming out of a track and slowing down, etc. Then my 3rd alarm is set for the hard deck, which for me is 2500'.

I have two banks configured, but still conflicted about what do there. On almost all of my jumps I have been able to get folks to break off at 5500', pull at 4000'. I do have a bank configured for 5000'/3500', but haven't used it yet. So I am not sure if I will use the one-bank concept or have two that I switch depending on break off and pull altitude.

On a couple of jumps people wanted to break at 6,000', so I just left things as-is - just knew the beeps meant you are there vs. the bit of warning.

Am I crazy for the following? When I make solo jumps I still track off at 5,500 as though I was in a group. This question really isn't an audible question, maybe I should post separately. To me this approach seemed like a better safety drill and improving tracking is always good, but I do eat up some freefall time I could use for whatever I'm doing solo.

[Deimian 43]

JohnnyBoulder

Am I crazy for the following? When I make solo jumps I still track off at 5,500 as though I was in a group. This question really isn't an audible question, maybe I should post separately. To me this approach seemed like a better safety drill and improving tracking is always good, but I do eat up some freefall time I could use for whatever I'm doing solo.

As long as you are 110% sure that you are not tracking into anybody else... tracking off at 5500 gives you a lot of time to crash into somebody if you go up or down in the jump run.

[dthames 0]

BigMikeH77

I use the canopy alert tones only as reference and don't base any maneuvers solely on them. I believe they are intended more for high performance stuff than for standard "straight in" patterns, but nonetheless it's nice to have the extra reference.
.

Yes, nice to have that reverence without looking at my altimeter, as I normally have my eyes glued on the ground and other canopies.

http://www.dropzone.com/safety/Canopy_Control/Saved_By_The_Beep_754.html

Instructor quote, “What's weird is that you're older than my dad!”