Reserve 1st?

[packerboy 3]

I don't do it on every load, but on the ones that everyone is being quiet and in their own thoughts upon takeoff and climb, I like to look out the door or window at the ground and try to visualize, reserve, reserve, reserve, reserve, main. And then when I decide simply by looking at the ground what I think I would be comfortable with going to main, I take a look at my altimeter. Usually around 12-1500ft when I visually decide I would go to main instead.

That being said, I've been in the plane at times and have noticed either A: I forgot my altimeter, or B: Someone pretty junior or a TI has forgotten theirs and I lend them mine.

Now.. you are in an emergency situation and in the ensuing clusterphuk you make the motion out the door and realize you don't really have any friggen clue how high you are, you take a quick look at the ground and you are set. I have to say honestly that I would have to force my left hand to do it, for some reason I think I would naturally want my right hand to go back just based on the muscle memory of never having used my left hand on exit. Come to think of it, I kind of want to go do a jump right now and bring my left hand to my chest just to see how awkward it would feel.

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In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock. ~ Thomas Jefferson

[relyon 0]

Interesting topic and responses. I'll let a couple of shots from the 2004 Nationals CF 8-way speed event (courtesy Pat Lindner) speak for me. The first shows me moments after exit and the next a few moments later. My right hand was on the inside bar at the time of exit and it was poised for all practical purposes; the main had a tail pocket and the deployment setup was a pull-out.

For those who don't know, time in CF 8-way speed is calculated from the time the first person exits until the last person docks and legal grips presented. Exit times are typically under ten seconds for all eight competitors and one video. I question if an emergency bailout could occur faster for the same number of people. In no way am I suggesting the average jumper could or should attempt such a thing under duress, only that for some such an exit is quite common and altitude losses are very often less than 100 feet.

Bob

PS - While I didn't intend it, I do remember that particular 160-ish deployment and used it to my advantage.

[chuckakers 426]

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If for example you were at only 1000ft and the plane was in trouble. And you had to get out. Would you and could you go straight for your reserve?

Surely it would open quicker and more reliably that your main. Is there a problem with doing this whilst your main is still tucked away?

Strange. Pretty sure that was covered in my FJC. But that was a long time ago. Maybe something changed while I was busy staying alive.

By the way, who let you make 25 jumps without knowing whether your reserve will work "whilst the main is still tucked away"?

I swear, this sport is getting scary.

[NWFlyer 2]

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Strange. Pretty sure that was covered in my FJC. But that was a long time ago. Maybe something changed while I was busy staying alive.

Well, if your profile is accurate, yours was around 23 years ago. My FJC was just over 3 years ago, and "try twice pull silver" was the instruction for a hard pull just that recently, so it was pretty crystal clear to me, even that recently, that there was no problem using my reserve even while my main stayed "tucked away." So not all of us are getting scary instruction.

(And, in fact, I did indeed get to confirm that the reserve works just fine without the main being out at all while I was still on student progression but that's a story for another day).

"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

[chuckakers 426]

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Strange. Pretty sure that was covered in my FJC. But that was a long time ago. Maybe something changed while I was busy staying alive.

Well, if your profile is accurate, yours was around 23 years ago. My FJC was just over 3 years ago, and "try twice pull silver" was the instruction for a hard pull just that recently, so it was pretty crystal clear to me, even that recently, that there was no problem using my reserve even while my main stayed "tucked away." So not all of us are getting scary instruction.

(And, in fact, I did indeed get to confirm that the reserve works just fine without the main being out at all while I was still on student progression but that's a story for another day).

You might want to re-read the original post. The issue up for discussion has nothing to do with hard pulls. I'm glad your instruction was accurate, but his was obviously a bit incomplete.

And ya know, 23 years ago I don't remember anyone getting past student status without knowing how their parachute worked in great detail. I hear crap like this post all the time these days - and that's scary.

Aside from the first few student jumps (when knowing too much can just create overload), I find it hard to believe that anyone would jump out of a plane without a complete understanding of their life saving devise. Oh wait, we have AADs now so everything's ok.

Chuck

[NWFlyer 2]

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You might want to re-read the original post. The issue up for discussion has nothing to do with hard pulls. I'm glad your instruction was accurate, but his was obviously a bit incomplete.

I mentioned the hard pull instruction to indicate that it was made quite clear to me that I could use my reserve without any problems with my main still "tucked away." The reason for going to the reserve first (hard pull, low altitude exit, whatever), wasn't the point, although now that we're on that topic, that was also very clearly covered in my FJC in the aircraft emergencies section; altitudes at which you stay with the plane, altitudes at which you would go straight to the reserve, and altitudes at which you would exit and deploy your main normally. Again, in all that instruction, it was also made clear that deploying the reserve without first deploying the main was something that one could do.

"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

[chuckakers 426]

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*** Again, in all that instruction, it was also made clear that deploying the reserve without first deploying the main was something that one could do.

And again, it obviously WASN'T made clear to him. And that's scary.

[NWFlyer 2]

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*** Again, in all that instruction, it was also made clear that deploying the reserve without first deploying the main was something that one could do.

And again, it obviously WASN'T made clear to him. And that's scary.

Yup. But not all of us "new kids" are getting scary instruction. Just some of 'em.

"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

[Sletzer 3]

Here's an interesting question: If you're in a King Air with a jump door that slides up, when the shit hits the fan do you pull the door up, or try to kick the shit out of it where the label says "in case of emergency kick here."

I could imagine arguments either way. It can be hard to pull open the door very quickly- I've seen some people have to tug twice to get it up. But it also might take several kicks to clear the plastic door from the sliders, and it could cause a hang up problem for people trying to exit.

I'm not sure how I'd react, but if the plane was going out of control I can't see sliding the door up very do-able. I'd probably kick it HARD, then force my way out. Hmmmm, dunno.

Anyone got any input?

(I'm gonna have to ask this one at safety day)

I will be kissing hands and shaking babies all afternoon. Thanks for all your support! *bows*

SCS #8251

[peggs82 0]

Kick the door out?? Seriously?? Wow, never seen a sign like that...(not doubting you...just...wow)

I'd imagine I would take the extra 2 seconds to raise the door...I'd hate to die a fire-y death just because I jammed the door shut by kicking it...better get it right the first time if thats what your going to do...

Remain calm, open the door, get out. Panic at the door would probably doom you all

[Sletzer 3]

The door (see through slide up jump door on a King Air) really does say that on a sticker on the metal of one f the door window pane holders about 2 feet from bottom of the door. It's the kind that slides up a track across the roof toward the other side of the cabin.

Still, I have seen some jumpers have to give the door a few tugs after not realizing you've got to pull pretty good to get it moving. (Not difficult to do by any means, some people are just hesitant) Once you get it up a few inches it slides up just fine.

Anyway, I could see your point being valid. No sense in screaming/crying/pissing yourself. Just open the door and get out That's why I was wondering about that sitcker.... you might have to kick it just right to get the door clear of the aircraft, and after a few kicks it might have taken less time to pull it up and open.

I guess you only kick the door off if .......

Damn those stickers!

I will be kissing hands and shaking babies all afternoon. Thanks for all your support! *bows*

SCS #8251