I've completed Bill's "Downsize Checklist" now what?

[doug925 0]

Okay, I know these topics generally get bogged down with terms like "Madskilz" etc, but that is not where I am. Cause God knows, I don't have them.
I consider myself more on the cautious side, and I want to stay there.

[B]Yes [/B], I do plan on talking to some instructors that know before doing anything.
But I am not at the DZ this minute, and won't be for a week or two, and I am curious now.

Here is my progression.
jumped a Navigator 260 through AFF
Jumped a Raven 4 280 through 58
Bought a new to me rig with a Spectre 230
Then I lost 35 lbs to end at 195 + 23lbs gear.
Have jumped it since. Now I'm at jump 108 (.95/1)

I have done everything on Bill Novak's checklist. (and do them well enough, consistently)

So I am starting to think of going to a Spectre 210,or a Pilot 210, or a Saber 2 230 (1.03/1)
~maybe~ even a 190 (1.14/1)

My container is a Jav. J7,with a smart 225 reserve.
I am trying NOT to buy another container right now.

So, how big of a difference will a 210 be from a 190?
How much difference will a novice notice?
My plan is to rent both sizes and jump them, BUT will a 190 test jump be over my head right off the bat? <----

If I go to a 210 in a J&, what size of reserve will I have get to fill the empty space left from the 230?

Thanks,

Doug.

I have never developed indigestion from eating my words.
Winston Churchill

[skybytch 273]

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My plan is to rent both sizes and jump them, BUT will a 190 test jump be over my head right off the bat?

Jump a variety of 210's, preferably in a variety of conditions (no wind, light wind, etc). Then, if you feel like you want to go faster, jump a variety of 190's, again preferably in a variety of conditions. After doing so, you should have a good idea which size is right for you.

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If I go to a 210 in a J&, what size of reserve will I have get to fill the empty space left from the 230?

You shouldn't need to change your reserve at all.

[phoenixlpr 0]

Do you consider yourself a super cautious?

In other contries people fly a 170 with the same amount of jumps you have, anyway WL less than 1.3.

What are you waiting for? Its just your choice. Find something you like to fly and take time to learn how to fly that thing!

You can break you leg with a canopy WL<0.95123456780.... like I did. Or stop calculating wing load too often and move on.

[wolfriverjoe 1,523]

Cautious is GOOD!As was said, do test jumps with the 210, if they go good, then test jump the 190. The size difference isn't that much, but there is some. When I tried a smaller canopy for the first time, I picked a "good" day-low steady favorable (not causing burbles in the landing area) winds. Take it easy and be careful and you should be ok. I'm NOT an instructor, but it sounds like you are being smart about this and will listen to YOUR instructors.
Have fun!

"There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy

"~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo

[c10edges 0]

Doug long time no see.
All i can tell you is that i am flying a 188 Pilot at 1.12 and loving it. I find it much, much easier to land than the 210 saber 2 that spaceland had for us. plus it seems much more responsive with the turns and the flare is so powerful. I love my pilot and think its a very forgiving canopy. It might be what your looking for. I also cant talk more about how sweet it opens. Ill be back from school november 22. hopefully see you then

[billvon 3,087]

The J7 is designed for a Raven 253; it should be OK with a Smart 225 reserve (although it will be a bit on the loose/flat side.) You don't need to change the reserve to go to a smaller main. HOWEVER, the smaller main may not provide enough tension to retain the pin in the loop on the main container. (The J7 is designed to take a 260-280 sq ft main.) If it's a problem, a rigger can put a foam pad in the container to take up the extra space.

>My plan is to rent both sizes and jump them

That is a very good plan. Try out the 210, put a few jumps on it, try the same stuff you were trying with the 230. You will likely have no problem. After that experience you'll be in a good position to try the 190.

[skittles_of_SDC 0]

I don't have many more jumps than you and probably am not qualified to give advice so take this with a grain of salt. IMO, to me on final there doesn't feel like too much of a difference between a 210 and a 190 (i have been jumping safire2 209 and 189 demo rigs). However in the air when you are doing red zone turns and using front risers it does feel quite a bit faster.

I weight about the same as you.

Adding: when I say doesn't feel like too much of a difference on final, you do still feel a difference just not that much of one in my opinion.

[BUBLHED 0]

I went from large canopies to a wingloading of 1.15 at 50 jumps. My landings were better. Faster approach speed (but not crazy) and a more powerful flare. You should be fine on a 190 but I agree put a few jumps on the 210 first. You may love the 210 and want to stay there. It's about what your comfortable with not what everyone else is doing that counts!!!!Goodluck

Blue Skies

ATTACK LIFE ! IT'S GOING TO KILL YOU ANYWAY!!!!

[doug925 0]

Thanks all!
I appreciate everyone taking their time to answer.
That was was I was hoping to hear, without all the flame normally associated with these type of posts.

Cool. The general consensus seems to be that I am not taking too big of a leap to possibly end up with a 21, or 190.

Thanks all.

Cody,
See you in early December. I probably won't get to jump much through November.
I've taken some coach jumps with Trent, but still I'm not the free flier that you are.

Doug.

I have never developed indigestion from eating my words.
Winston Churchill

[CSpenceFLY 1]

The 21 might be a bit small.

[doug925 0]

Naaah! I got MADSKILZ!

I have never developed indigestion from eating my words.
Winston Churchill

[AggieDave 6]

Demo, demo, demo...not the jumper, the programs.

You know I'm a huge PD fan, but go ahead and demo other canopies as well. Try out all the popular intermediate canopies in the 210 size. The Sabre2, Pilot, Safire2, but don't forget about the new Storm. I like to describe it as a 7-cell Sabre2. You might like it.

--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."

[kcollier 0]

jumping a slightly smaller canopy with greater forward speed may allow you to feel more comfortable in stronger winds. Personally, I'd be more comfortable dealing with a factor like speed, which is directly controllable, as opposed to winds, over which we have no power...

[Blink 1]

How about not jumping in winds that are out of your skill/equipment level?

Sounds much better then downsizing so you can jump in high winds.

[doug925 0]

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Demo, demo, demo...not the jumper, the programs.

Haha, all I could think of was jumping that bald SOB!



I was kinda thinking the Storm, as you talked it up during the module 1.

Is it not just a new Spectre?

But I do plan on demoing all four major canopies that I am considering.
Sabre2, Spectre, Storm, and Pilot.
it will be time consuming as I want to try both 210, and 190's

I have never developed indigestion from eating my words.
Winston Churchill

[AggieDave 6]

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Is it not just a new Spectre?

Nope. The differences have been discussed in a couple of different threads, but the short version is its a neat canopy. Shoot me a PM if you'd like.

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But I do plan on demoing all four major canopies that I am considering.
Sabre2, Spectre, Storm, and Pilot.
it will be time consuming as I want to try both 210, and 190's

Those will definitely get you started. Then again, if you don't like a canopy, you may not like the smaller version, so that could save you some time. Call up Kim (at PD) and tell her what you're wanting to do. Maybe she can set you up to get canopies a little quicker.

--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."

[Blink 1]

Don't forget:
Safire 2 - Icarus Canopies
Fusion - Precision Aerodynamics

Both canopies are along the lines of what you're looking at.