meteor 0
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billvon 3,089
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>So the bike thing doesn't make sense to me
If you walk into a place asking for opinions on things, people will tend to give you their opinions. The General Skydiving and Safety and Training forums are forums where (generally) safe skydiving is discussed. We try to enforce this by editing and/or deleting any outright dangerous or deadly advice.
Thus someone walking in saying "hey, I'm going to heavily load a canopy at a fairly low experience, everyone!" is going to get some heat, especially if it's presented in a somewhat arrogant manner. They might hear that it's a stupid decision, and that they might die. That's not because people are mean - it's because jumpers HAVE died when they made such decisions.
People have varying levels of tact. Some say it with a lot of tact, some people are pretty crude about it. Doesn't lessen the message, it just makes it harder to hear.
So back to the biker bar. If you want to ride a Kawasaki, fine. If you want to hear only good stuff about it, talk to your friends who ride Kawasakis. If you want to hear opinions by Harley riders, go to a Harley bar and ask them about Kawasakis. You may hear that they're terrible bikes, and that no self-respecting motorcycle rider would own one. If such things will hurt your feelings, then don't go into a Harley bar and ask about your bike.
If you want advice about canopy control, you are free to ask it here. Marko here asked about it and got some good advice; I think overall he learned something, even though some people presented their advice rudely.
However, there are other people who don't want advice, they just want to talk about their cool canopy and get some support. This is the wrong place to do that. If they want to hear only good stuff about their decisions, they should find some friends who jump small canopies at low experience levels and hang out with them. If they ask here, they are going to get told they are making a mistake, and that it's a bad decision. If such things will hurt their feelings, then they shouldn't come here and post about their bad decisions.
If you walk into a place asking for opinions on things, people will tend to give you their opinions. The General Skydiving and Safety and Training forums are forums where (generally) safe skydiving is discussed. We try to enforce this by editing and/or deleting any outright dangerous or deadly advice.
Thus someone walking in saying "hey, I'm going to heavily load a canopy at a fairly low experience, everyone!" is going to get some heat, especially if it's presented in a somewhat arrogant manner. They might hear that it's a stupid decision, and that they might die. That's not because people are mean - it's because jumpers HAVE died when they made such decisions.
People have varying levels of tact. Some say it with a lot of tact, some people are pretty crude about it. Doesn't lessen the message, it just makes it harder to hear.
So back to the biker bar. If you want to ride a Kawasaki, fine. If you want to hear only good stuff about it, talk to your friends who ride Kawasakis. If you want to hear opinions by Harley riders, go to a Harley bar and ask them about Kawasakis. You may hear that they're terrible bikes, and that no self-respecting motorcycle rider would own one. If such things will hurt your feelings, then don't go into a Harley bar and ask about your bike.
If you want advice about canopy control, you are free to ask it here. Marko here asked about it and got some good advice; I think overall he learned something, even though some people presented their advice rudely.
However, there are other people who don't want advice, they just want to talk about their cool canopy and get some support. This is the wrong place to do that. If they want to hear only good stuff about their decisions, they should find some friends who jump small canopies at low experience levels and hang out with them. If they ask here, they are going to get told they are making a mistake, and that it's a bad decision. If such things will hurt their feelings, then they shouldn't come here and post about their bad decisions.
I had no clue i was that low when i chopped,
I'm not trying to dump on you after all the rest of this thread, but I just wanted to point out that that is one helluva scary statement.
It also got me thinking a bit - we are (or should be) very aware of hard decks etc but that is certainly a lot easier to be aware of when you open with a malfunction, than if you induce one later on.
i kind of wrote that the wrong way...I KNEW I WAS LOW...i knew i was under 1550...thats the last number i saw on my alti when it spun up on me. I just didnt know i was at im guessing 600-800 when i chopped...i didnt know if i got that handle out 2.5-3 seconds later i woulda been dead..ya know?
so i knew i was very low but it processed right when the reserve opened that if i got that handle out 2 seconds later id be seriously injured or dead
It was my very first spinner and chop...if that happens to me ever again and i was low my hands would go right for the handles and i would rip those things out...opened up my eyes alot to cutaway procedures and how little time i have!
beowulf 1
Under a smaller canopy you would have had even less time to deal with it. Things happen faster under heavily loaded canopys.
If you have nothing constructive, or funny to say maybe keep it to yourselves
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Just thought it needed to be said agian.
Sorry im a New Yorker I had to do it lol
Para5-0 0
That will not happen again because you will initiate deployment higher, you will fly solid patterns starting at 1000', and you will know the limits of what is over your head.
Further, you will practice up high and educate yourself with as much as you can.
The point is not to be ready for the next time it happens, the point is not to let it happen. Education and prevention.
An example: If you play on a busy highway and get struck by a vehicle because you cant get out of the way fast enough.
We try not to say, I will just be faster next time and the vehicle will miss me.
We try to say, I will not play on a busy highway.
Sorry rich! While i was writing that i was trying to write
(even though i wont do turns/low turns like that ever again...and it wont happen ever again) in parenthesis but it didnt fit right in the sentence...so i took it out!
But if that does happen up high..(i will start to deploy at 4500 from now on) and i have to chop anything my cutaway procedures will kick in right away and ill get that canopy off my rig much faster then i did in this cutaway!
(even though i wont do turns/low turns like that ever again...and it wont happen ever again) in parenthesis but it didnt fit right in the sentence...so i took it out!
But if that does happen up high..(i will start to deploy at 4500 from now on) and i have to chop anything my cutaway procedures will kick in right away and ill get that canopy off my rig much faster then i did in this cutaway!
JohanW 0
But it would have been less likely, because bigger chutes have longer lines. WL 1.3 on a 210 is very much not the same as WL 1.3 on a 120. Also, air molecules do not get smaller when you downsize... I mean if he was on a 170 he still coulda spun the canopy up ..
OTOH, a person half my weight has spun up a Silhouette 170 (at a safe altitude), which I have never managed to do (on that, or any, canopy). Maybe line tension comes into play as well, or she just has bigger balls than I do. Dares to pull strings harder ..
Johan.
I am. I think.
I am. I think.
When I was a brand new jumper I spun up a 190 and I'm 155 out the door. I was low too, and just to make it more interesting my hand got twisted into the lines as well. Thank god for a big canopy with long lines....looked up, still square and flying straight, no reason to chop (not that I even could have with one hand in the lines and so low).
lesson learned that day and I was glad I wasnt on anything tiny of my jumping days would have most def. been over.
Billy
lesson learned that day and I was glad I wasnt on anything tiny of my jumping days would have most def. been over.
Billy
SONIC WOODY #146
There is a fine line between cockiness and confidence -- which side of the line are you on?
There is a fine line between cockiness and confidence -- which side of the line are you on?
jakee 1,571
But it would have been less likely, because bigger chutes have longer lines. WL 1.3 on a 210 is very much not the same as WL 1.3 on a 120. Also, air molecules do not get smaller when you downsize.
I wonder how much that influences the likelyhood of spinning up? A few years ago I put a couple of twists into a sabre 190 by accident, but I've never felt anywhere close to doing that on smaller canopies.
Maybe I just learnt my lesson and don't whack down the toggles so hard anymore
Do you want to have an ideagasm?
marks 0
your starting to learn what you don't know. without getting killed or hurt. that is a good thing, you cannot put a price on wisdom.
the only other advice I can give you is, follow the signs next time... the warning signs for the path you were on were all in place, yet you ignored them. it almost killed you. but it didn't, now your stronger. follow the signs.
I have been there and done that and watched this thread quietly to see the outcome...
your lucky, some others have not been.
I was lucky too.
johan420 0
320 replies and more than 15000 view`s on a thread for a guy jumping one piece of 0-P square canopy over he`s head........is it any wonder there are war in this world
rwieder 0
Under a smaller canopy you would have had even less time to deal with it. Things happen faster under heavily loaded canopys
I'm safe, but "Bring It"
"Every Man Has GOT To Know His Limitations."
But then again, i had the benifit of really good instructors at SDSL. Not a scratch, so far. The worst that's happenned to me so far is a sprained left ankle from a "Slammer Opening" on deployment while flying a 210^2 7 cell Triathlon canopy. (Thanks Brain) It hurt so bad, had to leave early that day due to the event.
-Richard-
"You're Holding The Rope And I'm Taking The Fall"
"You're Holding The Rope And I'm Taking The Fall"
Hey mate
I dont know If you will find this useful since you said you had got yourself on a canopy control course since your chop, but I found listening to the skydive radio recording found on Brian germains website http://www.bigairsportz.com/article.php, Show #14 “General Canopy Flight Dynamics” to be hugely helpful. I think It is one of the finest bits of advice you can get for free, and I have listened to it several times to absorb the lessons within.
I don't post here very often since im really only a beginner myself, but I really think this post will be beneficial to somebody.
Jimmy
I dont know If you will find this useful since you said you had got yourself on a canopy control course since your chop, but I found listening to the skydive radio recording found on Brian germains website http://www.bigairsportz.com/article.php, Show #14 “General Canopy Flight Dynamics” to be hugely helpful. I think It is one of the finest bits of advice you can get for free, and I have listened to it several times to absorb the lessons within.
I don't post here very often since im really only a beginner myself, but I really think this post will be beneficial to somebody.
Jimmy
baseknut
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: 1 years
Feb 19, 2008, 7:03 AM
Post #1 of 7 (729 views)
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Posts: 171
BASE FJC Quote | Reply
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Hey if anyone is interested in taking their BASE course this summer. Let me know. I have scheduled my First Jump Course for October 10,11,12,13. If someone else does this course, then we can possibly split hotel rates/food, etc...
PM or reply.
-Jake
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Step into my (sub)terminal Playground
markovwgti
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: 1 years
Feb 19, 2008, 2:19 PM
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Re: [baseknut] BASE FJC [In reply to] Quote | Reply
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where are you taking it...post all info...thanks?
7 way freeflying
camera jumping
high WL
now BASE??
This guy just gets more and more fun to watch.
Edited to add: Jeb Corliss better hurry up and land that wingsuit before this guy steals his thunder.
--------------------------------------------------
In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock. ~ Thomas Jefferson
Jumps
License
In sport
: 353
: C
: 1 years
Feb 19, 2008, 7:03 AM
Post #1 of 7 (729 views)
Copy Shortcut
Registered: Feb 7, 2006
Posts: 171
BASE FJC Quote | Reply
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hey if anyone is interested in taking their BASE course this summer. Let me know. I have scheduled my First Jump Course for October 10,11,12,13. If someone else does this course, then we can possibly split hotel rates/food, etc...
PM or reply.
-Jake
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Step into my (sub)terminal Playground
markovwgti
Jumps
License
In sport
: 201
: C
: 1 years
Feb 19, 2008, 2:19 PM
Post #2 of 7 (539 views)
Copy Shortcut
Registered: Sep 1, 2006
Posts: 230
Re: [baseknut] BASE FJC [In reply to] Quote | Reply
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
where are you taking it...post all info...thanks?
7 way freeflying
camera jumping
high WL
now BASE??
This guy just gets more and more fun to watch.
Edited to add: Jeb Corliss better hurry up and land that wingsuit before this guy steals his thunder.
--------------------------------------------------
In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock. ~ Thomas Jefferson
Edited to add: Jeb Corliss better hurry up and land that wingsuit before this guy steals his thunder.
///////////////////////////////////////////////////////
That is funny
Nothing opens like a Deere!
You ignorant fool! Checks are for workers!
You ignorant fool! Checks are for workers!
Para5-0 0
I will send a check to whoever can kill this thread.
I have to say that it takes alot of guts to post a mistake for all the world to see!!! Congratulations on making the right decision in time AND deciding to follow up on appropriate training!!! As was previously posted, I don't know you but I would like to shake your hand someday!! Most of the 20 year olds I know wouldn't have the shutzpuh to be as up front and honest about this series of events as you have.
From my personal malfunction experience (two of them, both my fault) and my personal landing injury experience (also my fault), skydivers don't ruin underwear by shatting themselves, they ruin it when their A--Hole slams shut and it tears a big hole in it!! The suction effect also only allows a whispered "Jesus" or other deity's name to escape past our lips!!
Enjoy the beer and GET BACK IN THE AIR!!!
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