Question about logbooks and currency

[ikon 0]

First off; Yes I searched and read through tons of posts.

I'm currently doing my AFF at Perris and have some questions regarding logbooks and proving currency status. There's a lot of differing opinions here about logbooks but what I'm trying to figure out is, do I really need to keep a logbook? I bought a logbook and have logged my first 2 AFF jumps and had them signed by my AFFI but they also told me that they keep all my jumps logged in their computers with notes and whatnot from the instructors that I jumped with. So, that being said, do they only keep track of them until I get my A license? or just til I finish AFF?

I guess what I'm getting at is, let's say after I get my "A" license and I wanna go jump at Elsinore, or Vegas, or Hawaii (places I'll likely be jumping at within the next year) will I need a logbook of all my jumps with signatures to be allowed to jump there, or will I just need to show them my "A" card? And I was under the impression that I need to keep my own logbook to use for getting my "A", "B", "C" and so on.

I just want to make sure I do everything correctly so I don't get screwed if I try to jump somewhere else in the near future.

[ikon 0]

Oh, one other thing; I was planning on getting an Altitrack soon, what more does a logbook prove that an Altitrack doesn't? I mean besides having signatures that I could have just forged myself. An Altitrack will show the date and time of last jump right, and total jump numbers?

[NWFlyer 2]

Yes. You'll need a logbook for a bunch of things:

1) To prove currency if/when you travel to other DZs. Some will check it, some won't.

2) To keep track of your progress towards higher licenses (B, C, D) and instructional ratings. Those will require documentation of jump numbers as well as certain skills (accuracy, freefall skills, night jumps, freefall time, etc.).

Your own DZ (Perris) is one of the bigger sticklers about having an actual, physical logbook when you visit the DZ for the first time (or after a long absence). Even if they keep track of your info in a computer / instructor's log, they definitely aren't going to keep track after your A license (if they even keep track that far). Logging is your responsibility - get into a good habit now.

Edit to add: The argument about electronic vs. paper logging is an old one in skydiving, but the fact remains that as of right now, a signed logbook is the only acceptable documentation USPA will accept for licenses and ratings, and the only acceptable documentation that certain DZs will accept to prove currency.

"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

[ikon 0]

Ok, that's what I figured and it makes sense. I guess I was just a little confused because keeping a written logbook just seems a little archaic to me. I do enjoy keeping my own notes on the jump and reading what my AFFI's had to say also.

[skybytch 273]

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keeping a written logbook just seems a little archaic to me. I do enjoy keeping my own notes on the jump and reading what my AFFI's had to say also.

A written logbook is just that - a place for your own notes on the jump and for right now for whatever your instructors have to say. Computers are cool but archaic things like paper and pen still get the message across, and paper logbooks are much easier for an instructor to look at/add to during your ground preps and debriefs than a computer located in the office - or even your laptop on the benches outside the school - would be.

[ebusto 0]

Let me preface this with the following:

All of the cool kids log their jumps. It's the smart thing to do.

There are, however, some of us that don't log their jumps. I quickly got out of the habit of logging because I felt uncomfortable asking people for their signatures. I use a Neptune and ProTrack to keep track of my jump numbers, and check the two at the end of the jumping day.

Anyone have any experiences trying to jump at a new DZ without an up to date log book? Did the DZ call your home DZ, make you go up on a coach jump, tell you to go to hell, or none of the above?

I've jumped at a few different DZs besides my home DZ, and have been lucky enough to not have a problem. I know this won't always be the case, and am curious if any others have been down this road.

[NWFlyer 2]

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because I felt uncomfortable asking people for their signatures.

I log every jump but I admit that I'm very lazy about getting signatures. My boyfriend and I often find ourselves going to a boogie/DZ where logbooks get checked, frantically signing the last few jumps in each others' logbooks.

I've read stories on here about DZs that will accept nothing other than a signed logbook (Perris is the example that has been mentioned often) and about others that will contact your home DZ for validation if you don't have a logbook. And of the 25 or so DZs I've been to, I'd guess that well more than half didn't look at logbooks at all.

"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

[airtwardo 7]

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because I felt uncomfortable asking people for their signatures.

I log every jump but I admit that I'm very lazy about getting signatures. My boyfriend and I often find ourselves going to a boogie/DZ where logbooks get checked, frantically signing the last few jumps in each others' logbooks.

I've read stories on here about DZs that will accept nothing other than a signed logbook (Perris is the example that has been mentioned often) and about others that will contact your home DZ for validation if you don't have a logbook. And of the 25 or so DZs I've been to, I'd guess that well more than half didn't look at logbooks at all.

I never carry a logbook when I travel, fear of losing it I guess.

What I do always have with me is a valid PRO card, though I've run across a few n00bs working manifest that don't understand currency is a qualification to hold the card.

I do have my home DZ on speed dial, I have handed the phone to an occasional DZO now & then.

~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~

[eightate8at8 0]

Do you guys think that a DZ will be more uncertain and want to see a logbook of a younger jumper? Kind of like getting carded buying alcohol.. But, in the aspect that since say an 18 or 19 year old stepped into manifest to jump, they suspect he probably only has like 30 jumps?

[airtwardo 7]

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Do you guys think that a DZ will be more uncertain and want to see a logbook of a younger jumper? Kind of like getting carded buying alcohol.. But, in the aspect that since say an 18 or 19 year old stepped into manifest to jump, they suspect he probably only has like 30 jumps?

Yup.

~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~

[jimmytavino 16]

keep one...

some day you'll be glad you did.

as for alti track or pro track.....

what's to say ??? you didn't simply grab a buddys' and USE that.... as evidence of jumps completed???

not saying you would... but technically i suppose, you could...

it takes a little bit of effort and discipline to stay on top of written log books. and both effort AND discipline are GOOD traits to have, and to further develop,, if you wanna stay in this sport for very long.
A valid logbook, regardless of how long in the past the jumps were made , will simplify your return to the skies.


imho

jmy

[Chubba 0]

Don't be afraid to ask for signitures, especially from visiting jumpers.

The best pearls of wisdom always seem to come across when signing logbooks.

I really wish more experienced jumpers got their logbooks out at the end of the day. We had a group of visiting experienced jumpers come out for the day recently... at the end they started handing around their logbooks to be signed by multiple A/B licensed jumpers they took for rel dives... suddenly every single person at the DZ pulled out their logbooks and it was a logging frenzy.

Sometimes it seems like a chore and the nerdy thing to do for newer jumpers.

[MikeJD 0]

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because I felt uncomfortable asking people for their signatures.

I log every jump but I admit that I'm very lazy about getting signatures. My boyfriend and I often find ourselves going to a boogie/DZ where logbooks get checked, frantically signing the last few jumps in each others' logbooks.

Don't know whether things are different in the US, but someone told me a long time ago that once off student status you could sign your own log book. I've never actually bothered to find out whether that's true, but I do sign 99% of my own jumps! In my view it's equally valid since, as you say, very often people just end up catching up with signatures when they have to - at which point whoever is doing the signing may only have your word for it that you did those jumps.

[JoeQ.Public 0]

Best thing you can do is become either famous or infamous so people will know you everywhere you go.

Very soon, an honest person will not be able to sing the last 2 lines of our National Anthem:::Practice safe dining....use condiments

[beowulf 1]

Infamous is a lot easier to attain the famous!

[airtwardo 7]

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Infamous is a lot easier to attain the famous!

Hold out for notorious...it's even better!




I was in Alaska years ago and stopped by the DZ just to check it out, didn't have a logbook or for that matter a USPA card.

Manifest and I were doing the 'who do you know that we know' dance...D1 walks in after a load and says-
"Hey Twardo, you up for a 4way?"

Bill Jones the DZO said-
"If Lew knows him, give him whatever he wants!"
I ended up doing Tandems all afternoon to help catch them up!


I've also jumped several places in Europe by simply saying "Watch me pack a rig" as proof I'd BTDT.

~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~

[pirana 0]

Sounds like a title/nickname in the making, . . .

Airtwardo The Notorious.

" . . . the lust for power can be just as completely satisfied by suggesting people into loving their servitude as by flogging them and kicking them into obedience." -- Aldous Huxley

[JohnMitchell 16]

[replyI never carry a logbook when I travel, fear of losing it I guess.


I do have my home DZ on speed dial, I have handed the phone to an occasional DZO now & then.

I used to not take my log book either. At Perris, I thought a 4 digit D # would get me on the plane. Wrong. I had to have them call my home DZ.

[tetra316 0]

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[replyI never carry a logbook when I travel, fear of losing it I guess.


I do have my home DZ on speed dial, I have handed the phone to an occasional DZO now & then.

I used to not take my log book either. At Perris, I thought a 4 digit D # would get me on the plane. Wrong. I had to have them call my home DZ.

Glad I wasn't the only one. I had just gotten my tandem instructor rating and they still made me show my signed log book. Had to go away and sign a few and then come back and start over

[JohnMitchell 16]

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Had to go away and sign a few and then come back and start over

The ironic thing for me is that logbooks are so easily faked. I knew a kid years ago that had 50+ fake jumps in a logbook. He almost bounced doing 4 way rw on his first jump. I'd much rather just see a license and some picture ID.

[JerryBaumchen 1,444]

Hi John,

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I knew a kid years ago that had 50+ fake jumps in a logbook.

Back in the 60's we called those P-51 jumps. Not for the airplane but for a Parker 51 ball-point pen.

JerryBaumchen