gharendza 0 #1 March 30, 2006 Hi, Would anyone know of any "Non Waiver" Dropzones other than The So Cool, "Parachute Center", Owned and Operated by Bill and Cathy Dause located in Acampo, California, USA, Where I First started to Skydive in 1981 ? Just Wondering ? Thank You, Gerald Harendza BASE # 75 New York Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
headoverheels 333 #2 March 30, 2006 At Lodi, your waiver is on your ticket, just like when you buy a lift ticket at a ski area. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #3 March 30, 2006 how many words fit on it? ski tags are much larger. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NWFlyer 2 #4 March 30, 2006 Bill said to me point blank "We don't do waivers." I never saw a ticket (I handed over cash and got on the plane). I don't know of any other DZs."There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diverdad 0 #5 March 30, 2006 Yep, same thing I had a week ago."We don't do waivers, we skydive here. Now do you want to be on the next load or not?" And I had only been there 5 minutes. Nice. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bodypilot1 0 #6 March 30, 2006 Quote Yep, same thing I had a week ago."We don't do waivers, we skydive here. Now do you want to be on the next load or not?" And I had only been there 5 minutes. Nice. That's right! I think somebody owns BEER for his first turbine jump? And how about posting a picture of Stacy's tandem? Be safe Edwww.WestCoastWingsuits.com www.PrecisionSkydiving.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Reginald 0 #7 March 30, 2006 Hmm, why would a DZ NOT have a waiver?"We've been looking for the enemy for some time now. We've finally found him. We're surrounded. That simplifies things." CP Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
piisfish 140 #8 March 30, 2006 Quote Hmm, why would a DZ NOT have a waiver?because SKYDIVERS don't sue scissors beat paper, paper beat rock, rock beat wingsuit - KarlM Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NWFlyer 2 #9 March 30, 2006 Quote Quote Hmm, why would a DZ NOT have a waiver?because SKYDIVERS don't sue Which brings up a question ... do tandems (and other students, for that matter) sign waivers at Lodi? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mr2mk1g 10 #10 March 30, 2006 Kolomna, Russia - you can choose to pay extra and not sign the waiver... otherwise you can just pay their usual nominal membership fee and sign the waiver. ... I suspect this has something to do with a provision of the Russian legal system however rather than their disbelief in waivers. ... or just a way they thought they could make more money. Oh yeah - and all UK DZ's – waivers don't work here. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mr2mk1g 10 #12 March 30, 2006 how so what? That waivers don't work here? Google UCTA1977 s2. Basically there's a law which says businesses cannot use any contract or notice to exclude liability for death or personal injury resulting from their negligence. There are often other ways round the issue of course but the situation in the UK is far from being analogous to that which exists in many US States. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Reginald 0 #13 March 30, 2006 Quote Quote Hmm, why would a DZ NOT have a waiver?because SKYDIVERS don't sue Haa, haa... Oh, my sides are hurting... good one!"We've been looking for the enemy for some time now. We've finally found him. We're surrounded. That simplifies things." CP Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
StearmanR985 0 #14 March 30, 2006 Quote Which brings up a question ... do tandems (and other students, for that matter) sign waivers at Lodi? They watch an ancient video with Bill Booth and sign a piece of paper. I think it may be a waiver, I never read it though. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bch7773 0 #15 March 30, 2006 I beleive you also had the choice to pay $500, IIRC, or sign the waiver at CSS in North Carolina. MB 3528, RB 1182 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #16 March 30, 2006 Quote Kolomna, Russia - you can choose to pay extra and not sign the waiver... otherwise you can just pay their usual nominal membership fee and sign the waiver. ... I suspect this has something to do with a provision of the Russian legal system however rather than their disbelief in waivers. I've seen this in a few DZs, including Las Vegas, and I believe Hollister. Driven by the knowledge that a waiver really isn't necessary. Skydiving is the classic case for assumption of risk. and few juries are going to be sympathetic to someone's claims that they didn't know jumping out of a plane might be dangerous. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
grue 1 #17 March 30, 2006 Quote I've seen this in a few DZs, including Las Vegas, and I believe Hollister. Driven by the knowledge that a waiver really isn't necessary. Skydiving is the classic case for assumption of risk. and few juries are going to be sympathetic to someone's claims that they didn't know jumping out of a plane might be dangerous. In a country where some genetic throwback hurts himself breaking into a home and successfully sues the homeowner, I wouldn't be putting my business at risk based on assuming a jury isn't going to be composed of fools.cavete terrae. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andy9o8 2 #18 March 30, 2006 Quote In a country where some genetic throwback hurts himself breaking into a home and successfully sues the homeowner I could ask you to cite a case, but maybe you'll actually find 1 or 2. But let's just say that such verdicts (if a case even makes it to trial w/o being dismissed beforehand) are so extremely rare - yes, even in the "sue-happy USA" - that this is really little more than urban legend. Anyhow, I don't want to get off on a tangent/hijack. Quote I wouldn't be putting my business at risk based on assuming a jury isn't going to be composed of fools. Now that I agree with. Juries understand that skydiving is dangerous and assumption of the risk. But they can also be swayed by "the DZ assured me I'd only risk X, but instead those little sneaks did Y, and that's why I'm hurt/dead/whatever." DZ waivers aren't bulletproof, but they do afford the DZ a certain layer of genuine protection they might not have without one. Personally, I think any DZO's that don't get their jumpers to sign waivers are foolishly playing with fire. I've represented people & companies in the skydiving industry. If a DZ was my client, I would scream at them to not engage in operations without signed, well-drafted waivers. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jsaxton 0 #19 March 31, 2006 Hollister currently requires waivers Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
airtwardo 7 #20 March 31, 2006 Quote because SKYDIVERS don't sue *** You beat me to it! ~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelpdiver 2 #21 March 31, 2006 Quote Hollister currently requires waivers that's not the question at hand. Does Hollister still allow someone to skip over part or all of the waiver for an extra $500? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bodypilot1 0 #22 March 31, 2006 Quote Which brings up a question ... do tandems sign waivers at Lodi? Yes Be safe Edwww.WestCoastWingsuits.com www.PrecisionSkydiving.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tbrown 26 #23 March 31, 2006 Quote Quote Hmm, why would a DZ NOT have a waiver?because SKYDIVERS don't sue Well, that plus in the People's Soviet of Kalifornia there are "public interest" laws that say "the people" cannot be coerced into signing away their legal rights. And of course in Kalifornia you simply must have a right to sue your dropzone anyway, because if you don't they'll legislate one for you. I don't know what current case law is in Kali, whether anyone has tried to sue a DZ lately or not. And case law is what makes or breaks it, since actual cases interpret the statutes, our system doesn't carve statutes in stone. There will always be some shitbag lawyer willing to give it a shot, so I have only the highest respect for the "fuck you" attitude behind not having a waiver at all, especially since they're literally next to Hwy 99. I'll have to get up there and make a few dives sometime. Your humble servant.....Professor Gravity ! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Eule 0 #24 March 31, 2006 Quote I beleive you also had the choice to pay $500, IIRC, or sign the waiver at CSS in North Carolina. The waiver I signed here in Oklahoma had something like this on it. As far as I can tell, you still had to fill out the waiver (i.e., put your name on it and initial that you had read each paragraph). At the bottom, in so many words, it says "if you don't want to release anyone from liability, you can pay $500 per jump and keep your right to sue." Even if you picked this, you still had to sign to indicate that it was your choice. I don't think this was on the one I signed in Texas, but I don't recall for sure. EulePLF does not stand for Please Land on Face. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nicknitro71 0 #25 March 31, 2006 Quote because SKYDIVERS don't sue But their families will.Memento Audere Semper 903 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
