Unconditional Surrender demand

[BIGUN 1,470]

I'm also asking why it's not ok to hate blacks, hispanics, Muslims, etc, but for the left Christianity is fair game.    

[gowlerk 2,267]

1 hour ago, BIGUN said:

I'm also asking why it's not ok to hate blacks, hispanics, Muslims, etc, but for the left Christianity is fair game.    

That is not a fair question. It doesn’t make sense and is a false premise.

[nigel99 607]

2 hours ago, BIGUN said:

I'm also asking why it's not ok to hate blacks, hispanics, Muslims, etc, but for the left Christianity is fair game.    

 

It’s a fair question. You don’t choose to be black, but you can choose not to be an arsehole. 

I’ve had a terrible experience with evangelical Christian’s. My mother has disowned me because I asked her to stop telling me “Jesus loves you”,

I’ve met some really nice people who are more traditional Christian’s. Sincere and well meaning. 

I do think there’s a bit of a persecution complex from the Christian community. Most people don’t really care, provided we aren’t expected to follow someone else’s beliefs.

[BIGUN 1,470]

7 minutes ago, gowlerk said:

is a false premise.

Quite opposite actually. 

If it's not ok to hate based on color or creed; then why is it ok to hate on religion? 

Discrimination against Race, Color, Religion, National Origin and age is codified in our laws. 

[BIGUN 1,470]

1 minute ago, nigel99 said:

provided we aren’t expected to follow someone else’s beliefs.

That is the core. Just leave folks alone. If they want to believe - they will approach you. 

[JoeWeber 2,912]

24 minutes ago, BIGUN said:

Quite opposite actually. 

If it's not ok to hate based on color or creed; then why is it ok to hate on religion? 

Discrimination against Race, Color, Religion, National Origin and age is codified in our laws. 

3 out of 4 ain’t bad. Also no one yet has attempted to convince me to be Haitian, black, or Hispanic. Of course the Christian mandate is to convert us all , or worse. That and they are intent on subverting any government that gets in the way. There’s a damn good reason there is a Military Freedom from Religion foundation and not for even one of the other examples.

Edited Thursday at 11:33 AM by JoeWeber

[BIGUN 1,470]

24 minutes ago, JoeWeber said:

There’s a damn good reason there is a Military Freedom from Religion foundation

I'm not aware of a Military Freedom FROM Religious - You mean the Military Religious Freedom Foundation? That's an extreme right wing platform. 

 

26 minutes ago, JoeWeber said:

3 out of 4 ain’t bad. Also no one yet has attempted to convince me to be Haitian, black, or Hispanic.

Let me be more blunt. Hate is hate, no matter how you dress it up. 

[normiss 886]

1 hour ago, BIGUN said:

Quite opposite actually. 

If it's not ok to hate based on color or creed; then why is it ok to hate on religion? 

Discrimination against Race, Color, Religion, National Origin and age is codified in our laws. 

I've never had a person of color in my face screaming that I will be eternally tortured unless I also turn to their color.

"Christians" on the other hand....I don't need nor want their insanity in my life. 

I don't knock on their doors or disturb their shopping to tell them their invisible friend isn't real.

We can prove race. Zero proof of any religion being real, truthful, with zero historic or scientific evidence.

Edited Thursday at 12:56 PM by normiss

[kallend 2,142]

56 minutes ago, BIGUN said:

I'm not aware of a Military Freedom FROM Religious - You mean the Military Religious Freedom Foundation? That's an extreme right wing platform. 

 

Let me be more blunt. Hate is hate, no matter how you dress it up. 

I hate Nazis and fascists, rapists, murderers and child molesters, OK?  All of those are choices people make.

[normiss 886]

2 minutes ago, kallend said:

I hate Nazis and fascists, rapists, murderers and child molesters, OK?  All of those are choices people make.

Throw in a few felony convictions, sexual assault, raping underage girls, cheat, fraud, and a half dozen bankruptcies and you have a shining, strong, respected President.  (ok ok, he's not strong and has almost zero respect)

What the fuck have we become?

[kallend 2,142]

16 minutes ago, normiss said:

Throw in a few felony convictions, sexual assault, raping underage girls, cheat, fraud, and a half dozen bankruptcies and you have a shining, strong, respected President.  (ok ok, he's not strong and has almost zero respect)

What the fuck have we become?

[Phil1111 1,159]

5 hours ago, BIGUN said:

I'm also asking why it's not ok to hate blacks, hispanics, Muslims, etc, but for the left Christianity is fair game.    

For myself the hypocrisy  of US evangelical christians combined with Trump and their support of trump has festered this criticism. I recognize that one bad apple has spoiled the bunch. But the corruption of trump, his antithesis of everything christian paints everything.

Most Christians are not evangelicals, most don't support trump or his policies. 

[kallend 2,142]

18 minutes ago, Phil1111 said:

For myself the hypocrisy  of US evangelical christians combined with Trump and their support of trump has festered this criticism. I recognize that one bad apple has spoiled the bunch. But the corruption of trump, his antithesis of everything christian paints everything.

Most Christians are not evangelicals, most don't support trump or his policies. 

Funny how so many self-styled "Christians" ignore verses like:

"When a foreigner resides among you in your land, do not mistreat them. The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God."; Lev. 19:33.

"And you are to love those who are foreigners, for you yourselves were foreigners in Egypt."; Deut 10:19

 "Do not forget to show hospitality to strangers, for by so doing some people have shown hospitality to angels without knowing it."; Heb 13:2

"For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in,"; Matthew 25:35

[jakee 1,586]

8 hours ago, BIGUN said:

I'm also asking why it's not ok to hate blacks, hispanics, Muslims, etc, but for the left Christianity is fair game.    

Hate? Really? As someone you probably know recently said, if you look at the world through a lens...

But hey, maybe you're right. Maybe all the anti-black racism is just imaginary but the vicious bigotry against the poor oppressed christian majority is real.

Y'know, maybe.

Edited Thursday at 05:22 PM by jakee

[JerryBaumchen 1,456]

7 hours ago, BIGUN said:

That is the core. Just leave folks alone. If they want to believe - they will approach you. 

Hi Keith,

Re:  Just leave folks alone.

If only:  Jehovah's Witnesses - Wikipedia

Jerry Baumchen

[JerryBaumchen 1,456]

5 hours ago, kallend said:

I hate Nazis and fascists, rapists, murderers and child molesters, OK?  All of those are choices people make.

Hi Keith,

As is a belief in some fairy tale about a 'God' up in the sky.

Jerry Baumchen

PS)  When it comes to 'hate,' I do not hate anyone.  I just really dislike the choices some people make.

 

 

[JoeWeber 2,912]

4 hours ago, BIGUN said:

I'm not aware of a Military Freedom FROM Religious - You mean the Military Religious Freedom Foundation? That's an extreme right wing platform. 

 

Let me be more blunt. Hate is hate, no matter how you dress it up. 

Yes, those folks: https://www.militaryreligiousfreedom.org/

So for you that's right wing? It's the Christians who are right wing in my view. This is a very silly argument in my opinion. Take a look at our new SecDef's Christian tattoos. Dues Vult, the Christian Inshallah as you know, the Chi-Ro (revelations), the Christian Crusader Cross writ large, and so on. Keith, you spent 20 years in our increasingly Christian Military, are you going to tell us if SecDef, or anyones superior officer, suggests a prayer meeting come Saturday the invitee's will consider it optional? Religious influence across our society be it political, military, social, what ever, is not just unfair owing to power imbalances but it is wrong. In this neck of the world woods it's Christianity doing the harm; in Iran it's the Mullahs--same same.

[gowlerk 2,267]

10 hours ago, BIGUN said:

but for the left Christianity is fair game.  

Are you aware that a significant number of Christians are left of what passes for the centre in the USA? Some Democrats even go to church on Sunday. You feelings of being picked on are, in a word, ridiculous.

[wmw999 2,577]

Jeez Louise! Christians (even evangelical ones) are no more monolithic than liberals, conservatives, Muslims or veterans. Maybe even MAGA (though that one’s a stretch I think)

Wendy P.

 

[JerryBaumchen 1,456]

1 hour ago, JoeWeber said:

Yes, those folks: https://www.militaryreligiousfreedom.org/

So for you that's right wing? It's the Christians who are right wing in my view. This is a very silly argument in my opinion. Take a look at our new SecDef's Christian tattoos. Dues Vult, the Christian Inshallah as you know, the Chi-Ro (revelations), the Christian Crusader Cross writ large, and so on. Keith, you spent 20 years in our increasingly Christian Military, are you going to tell us if SecDef, or anyones superior officer, suggests a prayer meeting come Saturday the invitee's will consider it optional? Religious influence across our society be it political, military, social, what ever, is not just unfair owing to power imbalances but it is wrong. In this neck of the world woods it's Christianity doing the harm; in Iran it's the Mullahs--same same.

Hi Joe,

Some things you never forget:  are you going to tell us if SecDef, or anyones superior officer, suggests a prayer meeting come Saturday the invitee's will consider it optional?

A number of lifetimes ago, when I was in Basic Training, we had a choice; go to church or police the grounds for butts, etc.

A simple decision.

It didn't work.

Jerry Baumchen

 

[JoeWeber 2,912]

7 minutes ago, wmw999 said:

Jeez Louise! Christians (even evangelical ones) are no more monolithic than liberals, conservatives, Muslims or veterans. Maybe even MAGA (though that one’s a stretch I think)

Wendy P.

 

As I touched on in #49. Nonetheless, even if you are as ignorant about Christianity as the majority of Christians you are still part of the monolith and by recent results reliable in the voting booth. Conflating race and religion as is being done here is a false equivalence and should need no explanation. 

[kallend 2,142]

17 minutes ago, JoeWeber said:

As I touched on in #49. Nonetheless, even if you are as ignorant about Christianity as the majority of Christians you are still part of the monolith and by recent results reliable in the voting booth. Conflating race and religion as is being done here is a false equivalence and should need no explanation. 

Exactly.  Being an arsehole is a choice.  Being black is not.

[BIGUN 1,470]

8 hours ago, kallend said:

For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in,"; Matthew 25:35

This may cause some cognitive dissonance. There's good and bad in every group. 

Why-Catholic-Charities-welcomes-the-stranger.pdf

[BIGUN 1,470]

4 hours ago, JoeWeber said:

you spent 20 years in our increasingly Christian Military, are you going to tell us if SecDef, or anyones superior officer, suggests a prayer meeting come Saturday the invitee's will consider it optional? Religious influence across our society be it political, military, social, what ever, is not just unfair owing to power imbalances but it is wrong. In this neck of the world woods it's Christianity doing the harm; in Iran it's the Mullahs--same same.

 I will tell you, the same "group" trying to kill you will also have those trying to save your butt. Would you have me hate them all? 

[JoeWeber 2,912]

Just now, BIGUN said:

 I will tell you, the same "group" trying to kill you will also have those trying to save your butt. Would you have me hate them all? 

Not hate. That is your canard. I hate the influence of Christianity on our society including our military, not the adherents to the faith. 

What you do not want to see is how what you believe is being forced down the throats of your fellow citizens. You know, like teaching it in public schools underneath a plaque of the 10 Commandments.

I get it that it is real to you but for others it is without any rational basis, is completely unprovable, and should have no role in our social and political processes.