wmw999 2,583 #101 July 9 16 hours ago, JoeWeber said: Why? The manufacturers will just absorb the cost, that's what I heard. Well, we moved a ton of manufacturing to Mexico. They’ll pick that up, too Wendy P. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JoeWeber 2,932 #102 July 10 7 hours ago, wmw999 said: Well, we moved a ton of manufacturing to Mexico. They’ll pick that up, too Wendy P. You’re smart. Could you please explain to me, using simple words and sentences, how we benefit from tariffing copper 50% when we don’t produce nearly enough, it’s critical to the economy and our defense industry, and even if we had giant mounds of ore waiting to be processed we have zero unused refinery or smelter capacity both of which would take multiple years to build new. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wmw999 2,583 #103 July 10 Huh? Of course I can’t. It’s ridiculous. Wendy P. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dogyks 13 #104 July 10 9 hours ago, JoeWeber said: You’re smart. Could you please explain to me, using simple words and sentences, how we benefit from tariffing copper 50% when we don’t produce nearly enough, it’s critical to the economy and our defense industry, and even if we had giant mounds of ore waiting to be processed we have zero unused refinery or smelter capacity both of which would take multiple years to build new. Pretty simple. We're $36 some odd billion in the hole, so we have to find some kind of revenue stream to fill in the gap. Since we have to get the copper, the tariff could be applied to the deficit. Of course, that isn't the way things actually work inside the beltway, so there will likely be a push to find things on which to spend the "extra money" coming in, but the initial sentiment involves balancing the budget. Once you come to terms with the fact that we're in worse shape than a gambler with endless markers, the crappy details are less of a concern. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Phil1111 1,168 #105 July 10 13 minutes ago, dogyks said: Pretty simple. We're $36 some odd billion in the hole, so we have to find some kind of revenue stream to fill in the gap. Since we have to get the copper, the tariff could be applied to the deficit. Of course, that isn't the way things actually work inside the beltway, so there will likely be a push to find things on which to spend the "extra money" coming in, but the initial sentiment involves balancing the budget. Once you come to terms with the fact that we're in worse shape than a gambler with endless markers, the crappy details are less of a concern. Copper is necessary for the development of AI data centres and Elon is building a couple. Trump is just trying to stick it to an old friend. Its what he does. A neat side effect is that domestic copper producers can increase prices at the same time.Because domestic industrial users have to buy it. Everybody wins. Right? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gowlerk 2,272 #106 July 10 1 hour ago, dogyks said: Pretty simple. We're $36 some odd billion in the hole, so we have to find some kind of revenue stream to fill in the gap. Since we have to get the copper, the tariff could be applied to the deficit. Of course, that isn't the way things actually work inside the beltway, so there will likely be a push to find things on which to spend the "extra money" coming in, but the initial sentiment involves balancing the budget. Once you come to terms with the fact that we're in worse shape than a gambler with endless markers, the crappy details are less of a concern. Exactly. Because then you can claim that the hidden tax is not a tax. And also claim to have reduced taxes. “Watch me pull a rabbit out of this hat”. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JoeWeber 2,932 #107 July 10 2 hours ago, dogyks said: Pretty simple. We're $36 some odd billion in the hole, so we have to find some kind of revenue stream to fill in the gap. Since we have to get the copper, the tariff could be applied to the deficit. Of course, that isn't the way things actually work inside the beltway, so there will likely be a push to find things on which to spend the "extra money" coming in, but the initial sentiment involves balancing the budget. Once you come to terms with the fact that we're in worse shape than a gambler with endless markers, the crappy details are less of a concern. I see. Wouldn't it be simpler to ask all domestic copper consumers to just donate money to cure the deficit out of the goodness in their hearts? Not everyone will, sure, but the rest can be made up by no longer making not really copper pennies I'll bet. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JerryBaumchen 1,461 #108 July 10 2 hours ago, JoeWeber said: I see. Wouldn't it be simpler to ask all domestic copper consumers to just donate money to cure the deficit out of the goodness in their hearts? Not everyone will, sure, but the rest can be made up by no longer making not really copper pennies I'll bet. Hi Joe, I saw a penny laying street yesterday. Normally, I would leave it there. But, then I thought; hey, this might be a valuable keepsake some day. People pay good money for things like that; ever watch Antiques Roadshow? Something about fools & their money. Jerry Baumchen Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JoeWeber 2,932 #109 July 10 12 minutes ago, JerryBaumchen said: Hi Joe, I saw a penny laying street yesterday. Normally, I would leave it there. But, then I thought; hey, this might be a valuable keepsake some day. People pay good money for things like that; ever watch Antiques Roadshow? Something about fools & their money. Jerry Baumchen I never walk past money on the ground. Picking it up reminds me of when it made a difference. 2 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JerryBaumchen 1,461 #110 July 10 (edited) 59 minutes ago, JoeWeber said: I never walk past money on the ground. Picking it up reminds me of when it made a difference. Hi Joe, Once, while walking along the concourse at PDX international, I saw a $20 bill laying on the walkway. The guy about 2 steps ahead of me picked it up. C'est la vie. Then, about 40 yrs ago, while driving north on US 97 in central Oregon with the entire family in the VW camper bus, I noticed something come out of the window of a car going south, coming towards us. As we passed the spot., where something came out of the other car, I saw a lot of US greenbacks laying along the side of the road. A quick stop, back up, pickup all we could [ about $300 ] & we had a great meal that nite. Jerry Baumchen Edited July 10 by JerryBaumchen Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nigel99 612 #111 July 10 9 hours ago, gowlerk said: Exactly. Because then you can claim that the hidden tax is not a tax. And also claim to have reduced taxes. “Watch me pull a rabbit out of this hat”. I hate it when Trump gets his way. But unfortunately at least on luxury items he’s actually been successful in “the original country pays the bill”. There’s been a fair amount of grumbling as some brands have raised global prices so that they can absorb the tariffs and not pass on the increase to US consumers. Birkenstock (think that’s the spelling was the one that got lots of headlines). Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jakee 1,593 #112 July 11 18 hours ago, dogyks said: Pretty simple. We're $36 some odd billion in the hole, so we have to find some kind of revenue stream to fill in the gap. Since we have to get the copper, the tariff could be applied to the deficit. Congratulations - you've just annihilated the reasoning behind the entire Republican 'low tax good' economic platform that you voted for. If it's so simple, how come you've never realised it until right now? And wouldn't you be the first to call 'Marxism!' if a democrat said the same thing? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jakee 1,593 #113 July 11 17 hours ago, Phil1111 said: Copper is necessary for the development of AI data centres and Elon is building a couple. Trump is just trying to stick it to an old friend. Its what he does. A neat side effect is that domestic copper producers can increase prices at the same time.Because domestic industrial users have to buy it. Everybody wins. Right? I could actually get behind that. AI data centres are the fucking first horseman of the apocalypse as far as I'm concerned. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Phil1111 1,168 #114 July 11 6 hours ago, jakee said: I could actually get behind that. AI data centres are the fucking first horseman of the apocalypse as far as I'm concerned. Big time. "The State Department cable obtained by The Washington Post paints a chilling picture of the attack's execution. The perpetrators created a Signal account impersonating Rubio's official email address and left AI-generated voicemails that perfectly mimicked the Secretary's voice and communication patterns. Recipients had every reason to believe these messages originated from America's top diplomat, potentially exposing classified information and compromising delicate diplomatic negotiations. This was not an isolated incident. The FBI warned in May that these campaigns specifically aim to elicit information or funds from senior government leaders, with malicious actors systematically targeting officials across federal, state, and international jurisdictions. The message is clear: America's enemies have weaponized AI against our leadership, and traditional security measures are failing to keep pace." Once NK, China, Russia and Iran get onboard with this new form of warfare nothing will be safe. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
normiss 891 #115 July 11 I'm a Florida Man. I'm mad as hell and I don't wanna take it anymore!!! Jimmy Buffet Fruitcakes You know I was talking to my friend Desdemona the other day She runs this space station and bake shop down near Boomtown She told me that human beings are flawed individuals The cosmic bakers took us out of the oven a little too early And that's the reason we're as crazy as we are and I believe it Take, for example, when you go to the movies these days, you know They try to sell you this jumbo drink Eight extra ounces of watered-down cherry coke for an extra 25 cents I don't want it I don't want that much organization in my life I don't want other people thinking for me I want my Junior Mints, where did the Junior Mints go in the movies I don't want a 12 pound Nestle's crunch for 25 dollars I want Junior Mints We need more fruitcakes in this world and less bakers We need people that care I'm mad as hell and I don't want to take it anymore Fruitcakes in the kitchen (fruitcakes in the kitchen) Fruitcakes on the street (fruitcakes on the street) Struttin' naked through the crosswalk In the middle of the week Half-baked cookies in the oven (cookies in the oven) Half-baked people on the bus (people on the bus) There's a little bit of fruitcake left in everyone of us Paradise, lost and found Paradise, take a look around I was out in California where I hear they have it all They got riots, fires, mud slides They've got sushi in the mall Water bars, brontasaurs, chinese modern lust Shake and bake life with the quake The secret's in the crust Fruitcakes in the kitchen (fruitcakes in the kitchen) Fruitcakes on the street (fruitcakes on the street) Struttin' naked through the crosswalk In the middle of the week Half-baked cookies in the oven (cookies in the oven) Half-baked people on the bus (people on the bus) There's a little bit of fruitcake left in everyone of us Speakin' of fruitcakes, how 'bout the government? Your tax dollars at work We lost our Martian rocket ship The high paid spokesman said Looks like that silly rocket ship Has lost its cone-shaped head We spent 90 jillion dollars trying to get a look at Mars I hear universal laughter ringing out among the stars Fruitcakes in the galaxy (fruitcakes in the galaxy) Fruitcakes on the earth (fruitcakes on the earth) Struttin' naked towards eternity We've been that way since birth Half-baked cookies in the oven (cookies in the oven) Half-baked people on the bus (people on the bus) There's a little bit of fruitcake left in everyone of us Religion, religion Oh, there's a thin line between Saturday night and Sunday morning Here we go now Alright, alter boys Mea culpa, mea culpa, mea maxima culpa Mea culpa, mea culpa, mea maxima culpa Where's the church, who took the steeple Religion is in the hands of some crazy-ass people Television preachers with bad hair and dimples The god's honest truth is it's not that simple It's the Buddhist in you, it's the Pagan in me It's the Muslim in him, she's Catholic ain't she? It's the born again look its the WASP and the Jew Tell me what's goin' on, I ain't got a clue Now here comes the big ones, relationships, we all got 'em We all want 'em, what do we do with 'em? Here we go, I'll tell ya She said you gotta do your fair share Now cough up half the rent I treat my body like a temple You treat yours like a tent But the right word at the right time May get me a little hug That's the difference between lightning And a harmless lightnin' bug Fruitcakes in the kitchen (fruitcakes in the kitchen) Fruitcakes on the street (fruitcakes on the street) Struttin' naked through the crosswalk In the middle of the week Half-baked cookies in the oven (cookies in the oven) Half-baked people on the bus (people on the bus) There's a little bit of fruitcake left in everyone of us The future, captain's log, stardate two thousand and something We're seven years from the millenium That's a science fiction fact Stanley Kubrick and his buddy Hal Now don't look that abstract So I'll put on my Bob Marley tape And practice what I preach Get Jah lost in the reggae mon As I walk along the beach Stay in touch with my insanity really is the only way It's a jungle out there kiddies Have a very fruitful day Hey Fruitcakes in the kitchen (fruitcakes in the kitchen) Fruitcakes on the street (fruitcakes on the street) Struttin' naked through the crosswalk In the middle of the week Half-baked cookies in the oven (cookies in the oven) Half-baked people on the bus (people on the bus) There's a little bit of fruitcake left in everyone of us That's right, you too, yeah, those crumbs are spread all around this universe I've seen fruitcakes I saw this guy in Santa Monica rollerskate naked through the crosswalk Down in New Orleans in the French market there are fruitcakes like you cannot believe New York, forget it, fruitcake city, Down island, we've got fruitcakes Spread them crumbs around that's right We want 'em around Keep bakin' baby, keep bakin' 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nigel99 612 #116 July 12 On 7/11/2025 at 9:20 PM, Phil1111 said: Big time. "The State Department cable obtained by The Washington Post paints a chilling picture of the attack's execution. The perpetrators created a Signal account impersonating Rubio's official email address and left AI-generated voicemails that perfectly mimicked the Secretary's voice and communication patterns. Recipients had every reason to believe these messages originated from America's top diplomat, potentially exposing classified information and compromising delicate diplomatic negotiations. This was not an isolated incident. The FBI warned in May that these campaigns specifically aim to elicit information or funds from senior government leaders, with malicious actors systematically targeting officials across federal, state, and international jurisdictions. The message is clear: America's enemies have weaponized AI against our leadership, and traditional security measures are failing to keep pace." Once NK, China, Russia and Iran get onboard with this new form of warfare nothing will be safe. https://youtu.be/b-D2I5tE898?si=jc4cLDysPhVqJcR3 That’s scary and fascinating. Not sure if you can watch this BBC series online, but it’s a really good storyline on deepfakes and AI.. 1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
normiss 891 #117 Monday at 02:01 PM On 7/12/2025 at 10:42 AM, nigel99 said: https://youtu.be/b-D2I5tE898?si=jc4cLDysPhVqJcR3 That’s scary and fascinating. Not sure if you can watch this BBC series online, but it’s a really good storyline on deepfakes and AI.. Thanks for that! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
