Trump

[jakee 1,648]

14 hours ago, dogyks said:

We are in the awkward position in which Germany found itself sometime back where, distasteful as the candidate might be, the alternative is distinctly worse.

You might consider what it says about you, that hearing you contend that Hitler was the best available candidate to lead Germany in the 1930s is not in the least bit surprising.

The fact that you think you can defend your choice to vote for Trump by comparing yourself to the Germans who voted for Hitler though… well you really should start to wonder if you’re as clever as you think you are.

[Phil1111 1,263]

7 hours ago, jakee said:

You might consider what it says about you, that hearing you contend that Hitler was the best available candidate to lead Germany in the 1930s is not in the least bit surprising.

The fact that you think you can defend your choice to vote for Trump by comparing yourself to the Germans who voted for Hitler though… well you really should start to wonder if you’re as clever as you think you are.

The highest support that the National Socialist party ever received was about 37%(1932). Similar to Trump's support today. Both Hitler and Trump realized that support in the cities would not materialize and moved to the rural areas to hold power. Both use violence and intimidation to hold power.

For both Hitler and Trump theatrics plays an important role. "Two years later, in the election year of 1932, by which time the National Socialists had grown to be a major, albeit minority, force in German national politics, the biggest event of the year in the East Prussia region around Thalburg was a speech by Hitler himself. The Nazi Party arranged for trains to bring people in from all over the region. It was going to be an open-air meeting with seating capacity for 100,000 people, scheduled to begin at 8 in the evening. The seats were all filled by early afternoon. When Hitler’s plane flew overhead just before 8, there was a roar of “Heil!” from the swastika flag– and handkerchief-waving crowd.

The impression was of a surging movement. But at the time, dues-paying National Socialists in Thalburg numbered only 40 souls."

Trump is following an old play book. From the book: Who Voted for Hitler? by Richard F. Hamilton, no pun intended.

[billvon 3,173]

14 hours ago, dogyks said:

An example is the Tuskegee Airmen.  Were they subjected to shameless racism?  Uh, yeah. 

And just like that - Winsor is woke.

Quote

My point is that our understanding of history should be enhanced, rather than focused on one perspective or another.

Unfortunately you cannot do that without being woke.  (Examples - being aware the Tuskegee Airmen, or the Japanese Americans in internment camps, or the Jews in Germany were subject to racism.)

[thelivo 22]

Couldnt have put it better myself

 

[dogyks 30]

All true, but still an improvement over Harris, Biden or Clinton.

I wish we deserved better than any of them.

[nigel99 689]

1 hour ago, dogyks said:

All true, but still an improvement over Harris, Biden or Clinton.

I wish we deserved better than any of them.

Pretty screwed up set of values to place a racist criminal over someone else because of her gender and colour. 

[jakee 1,648]

1 hour ago, dogyks said:

All true, but still an improvement over Harris, Biden or Clinton.

I wish we deserved better than any of them.

You say, as always, without providing a shred of reason why.

It always amazes me how people like you are happy to move through a world you have never made the slightest effort to understand.

[dogyks 30]

34 minutes ago, nigel99 said:

Pretty screwed up set of values to place a racist criminal over someone else because of her gender and colour. 

The fact that she's a purple hermaphrodite has nothing to do with it.  You're projecting.

[dogyks 30]

I should clarify the basis of my selection.

The national debt is over a third of a million dollars per taxpayer and rising.  This is unsustainable, and we are flat guaranted to default in the forseeable future.

Any politician that attempts to proceed with only minor tweaks to the status quo is thereby committed to the collapse of our economy.  The fact that some politicians are focused on Woke stupidity instead of the nuts and bolts of our economy suggests that they rely on distraction to avoid addressing the fundamentals.  It's like a physician that wants to treat an ingrown toenail instead of stage 4 cancer.

The only person who ran on the basis of disruption is Capatain Chaos himself.  The fact that Elon Musk had a say in the first 100 days was heartening.  Musk has his faults, to say the least, but he does have a knack for actually turning a profit where others fail.  Trump is a gonif, but at least his self-interest may coincide with that of the U.S. to some extent.

As far as illegal immigrants go, I can't imagine why we should welcome whoever sees fit to cross the border because their home country has been rendered unliveable.  The historical record shows a long list of peoples who destroyed one locale and then set forth to 'fix' somewhere new.  The Puritans come to mind.

Making DEI a factor in much of anything is absurd.  If considering race or sexuality or whatever is off the table, fine.  If someone wants to make a big deal of it, they can do so on their own time.

Do I like Trump?  Not even slightly.  His only saving grace is in keeping the likes of Harris and Walz out of office.  If DEI and illegal alieans can be removed from the equation, that's great.  If he can be kept from fucking things up in Ukraine and Israel, that's even better.

Hopefully we can get someone in that is posessed of equal parts of competence and integrity, but I'm not holding my breath.

Edited August 21 by dogyks

[BIGUN 1,521]

2 hours ago, dogyks said:

As far as illegal immigrants go, I can't imagine why we should welcome whoever sees fit to cross the border because their home country has been rendered unliveable.

Then why not fund USAID to extend assistance to countries recovering from disaster, attempting to escape poverty, and engaging in democratic reforms, rather than adding 350 Billion to the defense budget. Granted there were some stupid expenditures, but a refocus on the mission-specific expenditures. 

In virtually every country. there's a US Embassy. In those embassies, there's an attache'. That attache' is supposed to monitor the political/environmental/economic situation. They have two recommendations, 1) can we change the landscape with financial assistance or, 2) will it require military intervention. 

So, we appear to have given up helping financially and are preparing more for the military intervention. What.could.go.wrong.

Edited August 21 by BIGUN
Bad spelling day

[normiss 917]

2 hours ago, dogyks said:

The fact that she's a purple hermaphrodite has nothing to do with it.  You're projecting.

You're a disgusting liar refusing factual evidence.

[wmw999 2,644]

1 hour ago, dogyks said:

Hopefully we can get someone in that is posessed of equal parts of competence and integrity, but I'm not holding my breaty.

Well, the guy who has neither, but is guaranteed to disrupt the status quo, doesn't appear to be an improvement over the ones who, while growing it, didn't grow it as much, and, in fact, were reducing the rate by which it grew. That's some insightful analysis, there. Clinton had the lowest growth rate in generations, but I'm sure he had absolutely nothing to do with it.

Wendy P.

[kallend 2,229]

2 hours ago, dogyks said:

I should clarify the basis of my selection.

The national debt is over a third of a million dollars per taxpayer and rising.  This is unsustainable, and we are flat guaranted to default in the forseeable future.

 

The only person who ran on the basis of disruption is Capatain Chaos himself.  The fact that Elon Musk had a say in the first 100 days was heartening.  Musk has his faults, to say the least, but he does have a knack for actually turning a profit where others fail.  Trump is a gonif, but at least his self-interest may coincide with that of the U.S. to some extent.

 

The juxtaposition of your concern over the debt and your support of Trump is so absurd that it is clear your real agenda are elsewhere.

During his first term  Trump added nearly $8 trillion to the national debt. That was more than 43 presidents had combined to accumulate during the first 216 years of the Republic. Obama added less than that over his TWO terms.

His BBB, despite his claims, will simply continue the enormous deficits he created during his first term.  Do you really think the leopard changed his spots despite all the evidence to the contary - that's very naive.

In my lifetime the debt has increased more under GOP administrations than under Dems.

Edited August 21 by kallend

[gowlerk 2,309]

19 minutes ago, kallend said:

In my lifetime the debt has increased more under GOP administrations than under Dems.

USA voters want low taxes more than they want to pay down the debt. But they also don't want services reduced and especially they don't want to cut back on the Almighty God Sanctioned Military. Trump is nothing new in this regard.

[JerryBaumchen 1,493]

10 minutes ago, gowlerk said:

USA voters want low taxes more than they want to pay down the debt. But they also don't want services reduced and especially they don't want to cut back on the Almighty God Sanctioned Military. Trump is nothing new in this regard.

Hi Ken,

IMO it is not that Trump is new; it is that he is extreme.

He says one thing & does the other; like a true con man.

Jerry Baumchen

[JoeWeber 3,025]

8 minutes ago, dogyks said:

I should clarify the basis of my selection.

The national debt is over a third of a million dollars per taxpayer and rising.  This is unsustainable, and we are flat guaranted to default in the forseeable future.

Any politician that attempts to proceed with only minor tweaks to the status quo is thereby committed to the collapse of our economy.  The fact that some politicians are focused on Woke stupidity instead of the nuts and bolts of our economy suggests that they rely on distraction to avoid addressing the fundamentals.  It's like a physician that wants to treat an ingrown toenail instead of stage 4 cancer.

The only person who ran on the basis of disruption is Capatain Chaos himself.  The fact that Elon Musk had a say in the first 100 days was heartening.  Musk has his faults, to say the least, but he does have a knack for actually turning a profit where others fail.  Trump is a gonif, but at least his self-interest may coincide with that of the U.S. to some extent.

As far as illegal immigrants go, I can't imagine why we should welcome whoever sees fit to cross the border because their home country has been rendered unliveable.  The historical record shows a long list of peoples who destroyed one locale and then set forth to 'fix' somewhere new.  The Puritans come to mind.

Making DEI a factor in much of anything is absurd.  If considering race or sexuality or whatever is off the table, fine.  If someone wants to make a big deal of it, they can do so on their own time.

Do I like Trump?  Not even slightly.  His only saving grace is in keeping the likes of Harris and Walz out of office.  If DEI and illegal alieans can be removed from the equation, that's great.  If he can be kept from fucking things up in Ukraine and Israel, that's even better.

Hopefully we can get someone in that is posessed of equal parts of competence and integrity, but I'm not holding my breaty.

No need to clarify your position. The big kids took your candy and it somehow brightens your day to see it happening to other kids.

[dogyks 30]

2 hours ago, normiss said:

You're a disgusting liar refusing factual evidence.

Thank goodness that's not a personal attack.

BTW, to what 'factual evidence' do you refer?

[jakee 1,648]

3 hours ago, dogyks said:

I should clarify the basis of my selection.

The national debt is over a third of a million dollars per taxpayer and rising.  This is unsustainable, and we are flat guaranted to default in the forseeable future.

So obviously, you decided to vote for the guy who made it much, much worse last time he was in office. 
 

Again it’s remarkable how easy it is for people to manipulate you with an oversimplified sound bite or two. Like a sugar rush for the brain. I don’t know why you choose to outsource your critical thinking to the partisan outlets that feed you your talking points but it’s pretty weird. Seems like you would have the ability to learn things about how history, society and politics really work if you could only be bothered to look.

[JoeWeber 3,025]

Just now, dogyks said:

Thank goodness that's not a personal attack.

BTW, to what 'factual evidence' do you refer?

If I may, $37 Trillion in debt (8/2025) divided by 266 million taxpayers equals $140,000 per 2024 taxpayer. Obscene but not a third of a million per.  

[dogyks 30]

1 hour ago, kallend said:

The juxtaposition of your concern over the debt and your support of Trump is so absurd that it is clear your real agenda are elsewhere.

During his first term  Trump added nearly $8 trillion to the national debt. That was more than 43 presidents had combined to accumulate during the first 216 years of the Republic. Obama added less than that over his TWO terms.

His BBB, despite his claims, will simply continue the enormous deficits he created during his first term.  Do you really think the leopard changed his spots despite all the evidence to the contary - that's very naive.

In my lifetime the debt has increased more under GOP administrations than under Dems.

I think my reference to debt is that, any way you cut it, we're fucked.

I agree that Trump's track recod on the subject is abysmal, and thought that, perhaps, having someone aboard that had some concept of arithmetic (Musk) gava a glimmer of hope.

The good news is that we are not looking at a miraculous turn around in the economy to justify such excesses such we saw in Germany in the '30s.  Also, this idiot is old enough that he will hopefully drop off the scope in short order.

About the only bright side is anything that puts the nail in the coffin of Woke stupidity.  The border wall is idiotic, but border security has merit.

[dogyks 30]

5 minutes ago, JoeWeber said:

If I may, $37 Trillion in debt (8/2025) divided by 266 million taxpayers equals $140,000 per 2024 taxpayer. Obscene but not a third of a million per.  

As far as people who actualy pay taxes, that's more like 100 million.  This works out to some $370k per.

Edited August 21 by dogyks

[jakee 1,648]

23 minutes ago, dogyks said:

The good news is that we are not looking at a miraculous turn around in the economy to justify such excesses such we saw in Germany in the '30s. 

Again, with the benefit of hindsight, having seen what happened, you still believe there is a level of economic distress that would justify electing Hitler in response. And you think this is a fine argument to make in public and does a good job explaining your thought process. It's genuinely fascinating.

26 minutes ago, dogyks said:

About the only bright side is anything that puts the nail in the coffin of Woke stupidity.

To be fair old Adolf was a dab hand at that too, so it scans.

[billvon 3,173]

4 hours ago, dogyks said:

The national debt is over a third of a million dollars per taxpayer and rising.  This is unsustainable, and we are flat guaranted to default in the forseeable future.

Yep.  And Trump will increase that faster than any president in history.  It's a historical fact that republican administrations increase deficits faster than democrats on average - so if you want to reduce the national debt (or at least slow its rise) democrats are your best bet.

 

Quote

As far as illegal immigrants go, I can't imagine why we should welcome whoever sees fit to cross the border because their home country has been rendered unliveable. 

That's why my grandparents came here.  For decades that is what America was built on - the backs of people strong enough to leave their homes and make a better life here.  Now we have  system that denies entry to everyone, worker and student alike, unless they are rich and far right. That will rapidly lead to the US becoming an inbred nationalistic haven for the lazy, who want their due because they are "natives."

Quote

Making DEI a factor in much of anything is absurd. 

DEI ended slavery, got us the Tuskeegee airmen, got women the vote and allowed them to own property.  DEI allowed gay people to legally exist in the US and get married.  DEI put in handicapped ramps and handicapped parking spaces.  All good things in my book.  Many people oppose such things, of course.  Glad I am not one of them.

[JoeWeber 3,025]

Just now, dogyks said:

As far as people who actualy pay taxes, that's more like 100 million.  This works out to some $370k per.

Are you OK with $370K per household? 

[dogyks 30]

11 minutes ago, JoeWeber said:

Are you OK with $370K per household? 

I dunno, it seems a tad steep.  The vigorish alone on that kind of overspending is more than we have shown the ability to cover.

But hey, maybe This Time It's Different ©!