S&TA requirements

[leapdog 0]

I did a search on this site for info. I also went to USPA to find info on this. I will email someone at USPA as well. I thought I would give this a try.

Can anyone give solid info on what is needed to become an S&TA?

I already found that S&TAs get appointed and what the role is. looking for requirements if there is any.

Gunnery Sergeant of Marines
"I would like it if I were challenged mentally at my job and not feel like I'm mentally challenged." - Co-worker

[Miami 0]

There are no requirements, regional directors make judgment calls as to who they feel is appropriate for the job and appoint that person.

Miami

[leapdog 0]

ok, next question. is it as simple as contacting the Regional Director and trying to convince him/her of why you want to be one and what type fo experience you have?

Gunnery Sergeant of Marines
"I would like it if I were challenged mentally at my job and not feel like I'm mentally challenged." - Co-worker

[Miami 0]

I guess you could, but they (the RD) will usually only appoint a new one when they feel there is a need for one at a particular dz.

Miami

[leapdog 0]

Right now there is a need, but I guess I'm looking for the right direction to go to become one.

Gunnery Sergeant of Marines
"I would like it if I were challenged mentally at my job and not feel like I'm mentally challenged." - Co-worker

[Miami 0]

Best bet is probably to talk to your dzo...they can let your regional director know they need a new one and recommend you for it, then the RD can appoint you if he feels you are capable for the job.

Miami

[leapdog 0]

Thanks. This helps.

Gunnery Sergeant of Marines
"I would like it if I were challenged mentally at my job and not feel like I'm mentally challenged." - Co-worker

[PhreeZone 20]

You also need to have a USPA instructor rating since you will be signing off on the profencency cards of the instructors at the DZ. Coach is not enough accourding to a conversation I had with a RD a while back. You actually need an I rating.

Yesterday is history
And tomorrow is a mystery

Parachutemanuals.com

[Miami 0]

I'm not sure if that is an actual "requirement" or not as there is nothing in writing afaik. I do doubt, however, that you would easily find a RD willing to appoint someone who is not (or was not) an I of some sort.

Miami

[councilman24 37]

Area Safety Officers only had to be C license and a jumpmaster. When they changed to Safety and Training Advisor the requirement went to instructor, (and D IIRC). We had one or two years grace time to upgrade to Instructor.

In 1983 or ASO lived at least 180 miles away and never came to our DZ. None of us had ever met him. I found our Conference Director (who we also never saw) at the Nationals Boogie in Muskogee and told him we needed one and I'd do it. He wanted a D license so sent me back to see if anyone else was willing. No one was willing so he appointed me. Still here.

I'm old for my age.
Terry Urban
D-8631
FAA DPRE

[councilman24 37]

Didn't look hard enough.

From http://www.uspa.org/publications/manuals.pdf/Gov.Man.April06.pdf

Quote

A. Safety & Training Advisors
1. The regional director appoints S&TAs and
forwards the appointments to headquarters for
processing.
a. The appointments should be made in
consultation with the drop zone owneroperator,
while recognizing that
the advisor is a representative of USPA,
not the drop zone.
b. The appointment of a DZ owner,
operator or employee as the S&TA should
occur only if another suitable candidate is
not available.
c. The following qualifications are required:
(1) be a current USPA member
(2) have made a minimum of 50
freefalls within the past 12 months*
(3) hold at least an instructor rating*
(4) hold a D License
(5) be willing to endorse and promote
USPA policies
(6) attend the regional director’s annual
S&TA meeting*

Got a ways to go.

I'm old for my age.
Terry Urban
D-8631
FAA DPRE

[airtwardo 7]

Quote

(3) hold at least an instructor rating*

***

Interesting....I know of one that's not.

Either that or he STOLE the patch!

~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~

[bob.dino 1]

Quote

Quote

(3) hold at least an instructor rating*

Interesting....I know of one that's not.

Terry neglected to append the footnote:

Quote

* Items marked with an asterisk may be waived by the regional director. A
letter of exception will be included with the appointment forwarded to
headquarters. The regional director may appoint himself as an S&TA as
long as the minimum requirements are met.

It's on p17.

[leapdog 0]

Very good. Thanks for all the info everyone.

Gunnery Sergeant of Marines
"I would like it if I were challenged mentally at my job and not feel like I'm mentally challenged." - Co-worker

[tombuch 0]

An instructor rating is an important element because an S&TA can only sign off on rating that he/she has, and because an important role of an S&TA is the bridge between USPA and the local instructor community.

A good Regional Director will look at the needs of the DZ and what a new S&TA can bring to the USPA-DZ relationship. In my opinion, a non-instructor could work out if that person has extraordinary experiences in a wide variety of skydiving disciplines, a deep understanding of some key area(s) of skydiving, an exceptional standing in the local skydiving community, or is otherwise qualified to act as a bridge between the jumpers and the DZ, and not specifically act as a representative of the DZ.

Some drop zones are big enough to require more than one S&TA. In that case one of the S&TA's may be appointed without an instructor rating. Mine has three, and we are all instructors. At The Ranch, one of the S&TA's is the owner of the school and part owner of the DZ, a second runs the gear store but is not otherwise related to DZ operations, and I'm completely unrelated to the business with no income from the drop zone at all. It's important to understand that as an S&TA I represent the jumpers and USPA, not the drop zone. The representative of the drop zone is the owner. That means that the RD knows that in me he has a representative with no business affiliation, and that offers a different perspective than what he gets from the DZO/S&TA. I can imagine in a case like ours that a third S&TA might be appointed without an instructor rating as long as the first two are available to handle the needs of instructors.

Now I'll suggest that you carefully consider your desire to be an S&TA. It is a major pain in the ass that can really suck the fun out of skydiving. It's a volunteer job filled with responsibility, but without any real authority. It's tough to be responsible for something that you have no control over. I took the job because I believed the DZ needed an independent voice, and because after 20+ years I was ready to step beyond my role as an instructor and "give back" in a broader way.

Is it worth doing...for me it was (is?). In your case it might not be.
.

Tom Buchanan
Instructor Emeritus
Comm Pilot MSEL,G
Author: JUMP! Skydiving Made Fun and Easy

[airtwardo 7]

Quote

Quote

Quote

(3) hold at least an instructor rating*

Interesting....I know of one that's not.

Terry neglected to append the footnote:

Quote

* Items marked with an asterisk may be waived by the regional director. A
letter of exception will be included with the appointment forwarded to
headquarters. The regional director may appoint himself as an S&TA as
long as the minimum requirements are met.

It's on p17.

***

Hummm...that clears up the 'How'

But the 'Why' has me shaking my head a little.

The guy I'm referring to has more 'political' skills than skydiving skills, I can see how the "I" could get waived. But he isn't anywhere near as dedicated at a Tom B. so I kinda wonder 'why' he would even bother?!

Unless it's also viewed as a step in the ladder toward CD~RD?

~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~

[skybytch 273]

Quote

Now I'll suggest that you carefully consider your desire to be an S&TA. It is a major pain in the ass that can really suck the fun out of skydiving. It's a volunteer job filled with responsibility, but without any real authority. It's tough to be responsible for something that you have no control over.

I'll second that. I was an S&TA for a small dz 10 years ago. I took the job on because no one else at the dz with the qualifications was willing to do it.

I quit when a group of jumpers, including the dzo, did a demo jump without consulting me. They exited at well below minimum exit altitudes and then proceeded to brag about it to my face.

[councilman24 37]

Hmm so I did. Sorry. I couldn't read it on the screen I was using. And I was half asleep. Actually I knew attendance could be waived but didn't know that "I" could be waived.

I'm old for my age.
Terry Urban
D-8631
FAA DPRE

[councilman24 37]

I've had lots and lots of people ignore me over the years. I'm not a police officer. I can't stop anybody from doing anything if the pilot and DZO owner let them.

I had one guy do a demo into a ski resort wearing skies. Not that's not necessarily so bad except,

1. He made about 4 jumps a year, one just so he could say he was current so he could do 2 or 3 other usually high profile demo's for the glory. He wasn't a very good jumper to begin with.

2. He had NEVER done this before. Even for practice. He didn't know if he could exit stable or even how to exit (C182). He was doing this for the very first time over and in front of a crowd.

3. He planned on landing on the skies, cutting away and skiing down the rest of the hill.

4. They had actually gotten demo insurance for this one, but since I didn't approve it and wouldn't until he at least tried it once (and still probably would never have approved it for this jumper) the insurance was no good (at that time it requiered approval). The he and the team went ahead knowing I didn't approve the demo.

It actually worked out okay.

I'm old for my age.
Terry Urban
D-8631
FAA DPRE

[penniless 0]

The rules are what they are, but I would have thought integrity was a more important attribute than any ratings held. Why does one NEED to be an instructor to verify that requirements have been met, except that it's a rule.

[Miami 0]

Ah, cool...learn something new every day. Thanks for the info.

And I agree with Tom, it is a pita. I've been an S&TA for 3 different dz's and two different regions. A fair amount of extra responsibility but no authority. Not exactly fun, but it is necessary.

Miami

[fcajump 164]

Quote

I've had lots and lots of people ignore me over the years. I'm not a police officer. I can't stop anybody from doing anything if the pilot and DZO owner let them.

I had one guy do a demo into a ski resort wearing skies. Not that's not necessarily so bad except,

1. He made about 4 jumps a year, one just so he could say he was current so he could do 2 or 3 other usually high profile demo's for the glory. He wasn't a very good jumper to begin with.

2. He had NEVER done this before. Even for practice. He didn't know if he could exit stable or even how to exit (C182). He was doing this for the very first time over and in front of a crowd.

3. He planned on landing on the skies, cutting away and skiing down the rest of the hill.

4. They had actually gotten demo insurance for this one, but since I didn't approve it and wouldn't until he at least tried it once (and still probably would never have approved it for this jumper) the insurance was no good (at that time it requiered approval). The he and the team went ahead knowing I didn't approve the demo.

It actually worked out okay.

Actually, if this was any time recently, the FAA could have charged him (and the pilot) with a violation...

Assuming the "demo" was for an "open air assembly of persons" then he was required to get a Certificate of Authorization per FAR 105.21a.

Assuming that the local FSDO uses the same boiler-plate that our local FSDO uses, then it includes several (USPA recommended) requirements...
50 jumps in the last 12 calendar months,
5 jumps on the same gear in the last 60 days,
1 jump with all additional paraphernalia

To continue with the jump in violation of the Cert is a violation of FAR 105.21c.

Assuming I have my assumptions correct

Jim

Always remember that some clouds are harder than others...

[leapdog 0]

This is very good insight from experience.

Thanks everyone for the input beyond what I asked for. Also for the actual answer to my question.

Here is one more-

Quote

It's a volunteer job filled with responsibility, but without any real authority. It's tough to be responsible for something that you have no control over.

I have seen S&TA ground people and threaten to ground people. If an S&TA has no real authority, then how is it possible for one to act as if they do?

Maybe because most of the jumper population believes they do? I certainly thought so.


By the way wasn't the reason I thought of persueing becoming an S&TA. It is simply because the DZ doesn't have one at the moment and I do have a sort of passion to volunteer and take on challenges. I would have instructor ratings, but just haven't met the criteria for either AFFI or Tandem I. I definatetly plan on getting both as soon as the money and criteria are met. Tandem will be easier since I do CRW more than I do free fall and don't have the free fall hours for AFFI. I'm sure I have a good understanding of all disciplines even though I don't participate in all of them, including swooping. I will soon have a PRO rating (edited to add) just a couple of accuracies and written test and a D license. (end Edit)I do have a coach rating and a rigger ticket. I'm confident I'm on my way.

Gunnery Sergeant of Marines
"I would like it if I were challenged mentally at my job and not feel like I'm mentally challenged." - Co-worker

[AggieDave 6]

Quote

I have seen S&TA ground people and threaten to ground people. If an S&TA has no real authority, then how is it possible for one to act as if they do?

The short answer and most common reason is that the DZO gives them the authority. If the S&TA grounds someone and the DZO backs the S&TA's decisions, then that person is grounded.

On the flip side, an S&TA can bring a member up to the RD to have disciplinary proceedings brought against the jumper with the BOD to loose ratings/membership privlages; however, that's typically saved for the extreme scenerios. The scenerios I can think of off the top of my head involve injuries/fatalities to students.

--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."

[leapdog 0]

That explains it. Thanks.

Gunnery Sergeant of Marines
"I would like it if I were challenged mentally at my job and not feel like I'm mentally challenged." - Co-worker