More sacrifices to the 2nd Amendment

[SkyDekker 1,465]

On 12/21/2024 at 6:16 AM, turtlespeed said:

It demonstrates that guns are not the problem. People in certain areas and under certain government are.

yes that is why all Western governments who are significantly further left than the US government have such higher levels of gun violence....and such higher murder rates.....

 

Oh wait they don't. So, the only other logical answer than is that Americans are just more prone to violence and have significantly lower impulse control. Those are arguments that support that Americans don't have the intellectual capacity, nor the inherent composure to own firearms.

[gowlerk 2,251]

19 minutes ago, SkyDekker said:

yes that is why all Western governments who are significantly further left than the US government have such higher levels of gun violence....and such higher murder rates.....

 

Oh wait they don't. So, the only other logical answer than is that Americans are just more prone to violence and have significantly lower impulse control. Those are arguments that support that Americans don't have the intellectual capacity, nor the inherent composure to own firearms.

I don't understand why these people keep up with the lame excuses. Why can't they just admit that having the right to play with and own killing machines is more important to them than lessening the death and mayhem that results is? Seriously, man up.

[SkyDekker 1,465]

1 hour ago, gowlerk said:

I don't understand why these people keep up with the lame excuses. Why can't they just admit that having the right to play with and own killing machines is more important to them than lessening the death and mayhem that results is? Seriously, man up.

It isn't the right to play with them. It is the right to easily acquire and easily carry them anywhere they want that is the problem, IMHO.

I agree with the right to play with them. I don't agree with the ease of acquisition and the ease of anyone carrying it anywhere.

[Hissone 6]

2 hours ago, gowlerk said:

I don't understand why these people keep up with the lame excuses. Why can't they just admit that having the right to play with and own killing machines is more important to them than lessening the death and mayhem that results is? Seriously, man up.

If you lessened the hyperbole statements it would be easier to take you seriously.  So how much would say banning scary guns ( assault weapons) reduce the death and mayhem?  Also have you ever trained with said killing machines?  

[billvon 3,076]

36 minutes ago, Hissone said:

So how much would say banning scary guns ( assault weapons) reduce the death and mayhem? 

When that happened in Australia, gun homicides declined an average of 2.5% a year for 10 years after the assault weapon ban.

[kallend 2,107]

51 minutes ago, Hissone said:

If you lessened the hyperbole statements it would be easier to take you seriously.  So how much would say banning scary guns ( assault weapons) reduce the death and mayhem?  Also have you ever trained with said killing machines?  

If you looked at the data it would be possible to take you seriously.

[rifleman 70]

IMO, there's a lot of talk about rights but not much about responsibility. 

In the UK, you have the right to own firearms, if you want to, but this comes with a whole bunch of responsibilities. 

First comes the responsibility to acquire proper training. Usually this involves being a member of a local gun club for at least 6 months, after which the gun club will help you to complete the required paperwork for your firearms licence. During this period, you will receive training in the safe handling and storage of firearms and an instructor will constantly assess your ability.

Next is the responsibility to prove that you're mentally, physically and socially fit to own firearms. As part of your application, you are required to have a full medical with your doctor. You are expected to give consent to him sharing this information with the local police Firearms Licensing Officer. You also consent to the fact that he has *mandatory* reporting responsibilities in the event of a decline in your mental or physical health. On two occasions in my personal life, I've required treatment for depression. This hasn't meant the confiscation of my firearms but did involve a visit from, and a discussion with, the FLO. We reached an agreement that for the duration of my treatment, my firearms would be lodged with my local gun club allowing me to access them but removing them as a potential source of self harm. Once my doctor gave the all clear after treatment was complete, I was free to collect my guns.

Social fitness is determined by a combination of references submitted by members of your community and a criminal records check.

Thirdly, you have the responsibility to keep your weapons and ammunition in a secure manner. You will be required to purchase an approved gun safe suitable for the size and number of firearms you intend to hold and install it correctly, ensuring that it is securely bolted to the wall and floor. The FLO will arrange an appointment to come and inspect your security arrangements and will either approve, or offer advice on further requirements. If you reload, you will be required to have safe storage for reloading components and ammunition. It's also a good idea to inform your local fire department that you have ammunition stored, in case of fire.

Once all these responsibilities are complied with, to the satisfaction of the FLO, a firearms licence will be issued.

[kallend 2,107]

29 minutes ago, rifleman said:

IMO, there's a lot of talk about rights but not much about responsibility. 

In the UK, you have the right to own firearms, if you want to, but this comes with a whole bunch of responsibilities. 

First comes the responsibility to acquire proper training. Usually this involves being a member of a local gun club for at least 6 months, after which the gun club will help you to complete the required paperwork for your firearms licence. During this period, you will receive training in the safe handling and storage of firearms and an instructor will constantly assess your ability.

Next is the responsibility to prove that you're mentally, physically and socially fit to own firearms. As part of your application, you are required to have a full medical with your doctor. You are expected to give consent to him sharing this information with the local police Firearms Licensing Officer. You also consent to the fact that he has *mandatory* reporting responsibilities in the event of a decline in your mental or physical health. On two occasions in my personal life, I've required treatment for depression. This hasn't meant the confiscation of my firearms but did involve a visit from, and a discussion with, the FLO. We reached an agreement that for the duration of my treatment, my firearms would be lodged with my local gun club allowing me to access them but removing them as a potential source of self harm. Once my doctor gave the all clear after treatment was complete, I was free to collect my guns.

Social fitness is determined by a combination of references submitted by members of your community and a criminal records check.

Thirdly, you have the responsibility to keep your weapons and ammunition in a secure manner. You will be required to purchase an approved gun safe suitable for the size and number of firearms you intend to hold and install it correctly, ensuring that it is securely bolted to the wall and floor. The FLO will arrange an appointment to come and inspect your security arrangements and will either approve, or offer advice on further requirements. If you reload, you will be required to have safe storage for reloading components and ammunition. It's also a good idea to inform your local fire department that you have ammunition stored, in case of fire.

Once all these responsibilities are complied with, to the satisfaction of the FLO, a firearms licence will be issued.

The firearm death rate per 100k of population is 10.72 in the USA.  It is 0.23 in the UK.

That is, you are roughly 50x more likely to be shot to death in the USA as in the UK.

I wonder why - could it possibly be the gun regulations?  Or are people just nicer in the UK?

[Hissone 6]

57 minutes ago, billvon said:

When that happened in Australia, gun homicides declined an average of 2.5% a year for 10 years after the assault weapon ban.

Gun homicides reduced yes. If you just look at the 2023 murder rates there were more murders in 2023 than in 1996 when the Port Arthur massacre happened.  People are simpler using other weapons.   Also it’s not a good comparison between the US and Australia. Australia is averaging around 400 homicides a year.  The cultures, population, demographics do not lead to a good comparison.  

[Hissone 6]

54 minutes ago, kallend said:

If you looked at the data it would be possible to take you seriously.

What data are you referring?

Edited December 23, 2024 by Hissone

[jaybird18c 24]

Thank God we have The 2nd Amendment.

[normiss 857]

2 minutes ago, jaybird18c said:

Thank God we have The 2nd Amendment.

And school children willing to sacrifice their lives in support of it!

Shame some CEO's seem to dislike it though.

 

[jaybird18c 24]

3 minutes ago, normiss said:

And school children willing to sacrifice their lives in support of it!

Shame some CEO's seem to dislike it though.

 

No. To protect the citizenry from the government who might have people who think like you in power. In defense of liberty and freedom.

Edited December 23, 2024 by jaybird18c

[normiss 857]

1 minute ago, jaybird18c said:

No. To protect the citizenry from the government who might have people who think like you in power. In defense of liberty and freedom.

You're gonna need a fuck load more than just guns dummy.

Your freedumb is deadly to school kids.

[jaybird18c 24]

51 minutes ago, normiss said:

You're gonna need a fuck load more than just guns dummy.

Your freedumb is deadly to school kids.

Merry Christmas Norpiss!

Edited December 23, 2024 by jaybird18c

[normiss 857]

18 minutes ago, jaybird18c said:

Merry Christmas Normiss!

Thanks for letting me know your mental challenges. It helps to understand your insanity here.

[jaybird18c 24]

Just now, normiss said:

Thanks for letting me know your mental challenges. It helps to understand your insanity here.

You’re welcome. And I own a lot of guns. And there’s nothing you or the government can do about it.

[kallend 2,107]

1 hour ago, Hissone said:

What data are you referring?

QED

[turtlespeed 226]

6 hours ago, SkyDekker said:

yes that is why all Western governments who are significantly further left than the US government have such higher levels of gun violence....and such higher murder rates.....

 

Oh wait they don't. So, the only other logical answer than is that Americans are just more prone to violence and have significantly lower impulse control. Those are arguments that support that Americans don't have the intellectual capacity, nor the inherent composure to own firearms.

I asked earlier if you realize how impossible it would be to starkly reduce the number of guns in the US.  I asked how or what that process looked like.

No one answered.

Until that happens and the percentages are similar, you are looking at apples to oranges.

Where is the control?

[wmw999 2,545]

Just now, turtlespeed said:

I asked earlier if you realize how impossible it would be to starkly reduce the number of guns in the US.  I asked how or what that process looked like.

No one answered.

Until that happens and the percentages are similar, you are looking at apples to oranges.

Where is the control?

Well, with the concerted efforts of the NRA to make guns the most commonly available thing in America, yeah, that’s not going to happen soon. Kind of like shifting all over the place and then asking for help cleaning it up

Wendy P. 

[turtlespeed 226]

6 hours ago, SkyDekker said:

yes that is why all Western governments who are significantly further left than the US government have such higher levels of gun violence....and such higher murder rates.....

 

Oh wait they don't. So, the only other logical answer than is that Americans are just more prone to violence and have significantly lower impulse control. Those are arguments that support that Americans don't have the intellectual capacity, nor the inherent composure to own firearms.

That is because they don't have a structure like the second amendment that guarantees that right.

[turtlespeed 226]

Just now, wmw999 said:

Well, with the concerted efforts of the NRA to make guns the most commonly available thing in America, yeah, that’s not going to happen soon. Kind of like shifting all over the place and then asking for help cleaning it up

Wendy P. 

So do you agree that without all things being equal the comparison is seriously lacking in the ability to be factual? 

[SkyDekker 1,465]

50 minutes ago, jaybird18c said:

No. To protect the citizenry from the government who might have people who think like you in power. In defense of liberty and freedom.

Lol. you are cheering on the removal of rights and freedoms. You won't know what happened until they come for yours. Defense of liberty and freedom. You make me laugh.

[jaybird18c 24]

Just now, SkyDekker said:

Lol. you are cheering on the removal of rights and freedoms. You won't know what happened until they come for yours. Defense of liberty and freedom. You make me laugh.

You don’t believe in the defense of liberty and freedom?

[SkyDekker 1,465]

13 minutes ago, turtlespeed said:

I asked earlier if you realize how impossible it would be to starkly reduce the number of guns in the US.  I asked how or what that process looked like.

Not impossible, but will take time.

Start with requiring training and licenses to own and carry firearms. Enshrine laws around safe storage and enforce them. Increase penalties for those whose guns are used in crimes.

That alone would have a significant positive impact.