Ban Vaping?

[yobnoc 142]

Thoughts?

[Coreece 190]

14 minutes ago, yobnoc said:

Thoughts?

No

[wolfriverjoe 1,523]

Kinda funny (not amusing, but ironic).

If there's a food product with a potential to harm someone (infectious agent or foreign object), they recall ALL of it, out of an 'abundance of caution'. Same with safety recalls, especially for kid's products.

 

Vaping seems to be causing a form of chemical pneumonia. They don't know why and they don't know why it seems to be appearing now, when vaping has been around for a few years.

 

Smoking kills thousands (actually hundreds of thousands) every year and little is done. It's become less socially acceptable and the places one can do it are being limited. Very few calls for bans on tobacco.
Alcohol kills a lot of people too. It also kills a lot of innocent bystanders (drunk driving). We all know how the attempt to ban it went. 
And the 'war on drugs' has been an abject failure. The only people who 'won' that one are the drug lords and the prison industry.

 

The unregulated aspect of it makes it much harder to ban. The tobacco industry, along with the 'health supplements' industry have done a very good job of removing any real oversight of their products. I'm not sure where/how/who vaping products fit in there, but it's pretty clear there's not a whole lot of regulation of it.
 
I really wouldn't support a ban. If someone wants to be that foolish, let them.

[yobnoc 142]

16 minutes ago, Coreece said:

No

Then simply don't reply.  You're so transparently desperate for attention right now. 

[yobnoc 142]

10 minutes ago, wolfriverjoe said:

Kinda funny (not amusing, but ironic).

If there's a food product with a potential to harm someone (infectious agent or foreign object), they recall ALL of it, out of an 'abundance of caution'. Same with safety recalls, especially for kid's products.

 

Vaping seems to be causing a form of chemical pneumonia. They don't know why and they don't know why it seems to be appearing now, when vaping has been around for a few years.

 

Smoking kills thousands (actually hundreds of thousands) every year and little is done. It's become less socially acceptable and the places one can do it are being limited. Very few calls for bans on tobacco.
Alcohol kills a lot of people too. It also kills a lot of innocent bystanders (drunk driving). We all know how the attempt to ban it went. 
And the 'war on drugs' has been an abject failure. The only people who 'won' that one are the drug lords and the prison industry.

 

The unregulated aspect of it makes it much harder to ban. The tobacco industry, along with the 'health supplements' industry have done a very good job of removing any real oversight of their products. I'm not sure where/how/who vaping products fit in there, but it's pretty clear there's not a whole lot of regulation of it.
 
I really wouldn't support a ban. If someone wants to be that foolish, let them.

WaPo did a pretty good article about this: the common link they've found so far is a Vitamin E acetate and other lipids, which so far have only been found in black-market thc products. 

My issue is that a 6 month ban puts a lot of people out of business, and potentially puts a lot of people without an alternative to cigarettes.  I'm one of those people (not the business part, but the smoking part).

When they find romaine lettuce contaminated with e-coli, they don't ban the sale of all vegetables, either.  That's a more appropriate analogy, imo.

[Coreece 190]

14 minutes ago, yobnoc said:

31 minutes ago, Coreece said:

No

Then simply don't reply

You asked a fucking question and I answered it

How about offering your own thoughts when you start a post?

 

14 minutes ago, yobnoc said:

You're so transparently desperate for attention right now.

You can keep making your dumb ass assumptions, but it doesn't make them true.

 

Edited September 11, 2019 by Coreece

[yobnoc 142]

1 minute ago, Coreece said:

You asked a fucking question and I answered it

 

.  How about offering your own thoughts when you start a post?

 

You can keep making your dumb ass assumptions, but it doesn't make them true.

 

 

Trigger alert!  Generally when people don't care about a topic, they don't take time to type it out.  That's not a dumbass assumption; that's just basic human behavior.

If you're not just trolling, maybe do us both a favor and ignore me.  Otherwise, you're kinda proving me right.

 

[Coreece 190]

1 minute ago, yobnoc said:

 when people don't care about a topic

Another dumbass ASSumption.

2 minutes ago, yobnoc said:

If you're not just trolling, maybe do us both a favor and ignore me.  Otherwise, you're kinda proving me right.

What in the actual fuck are you talking about?

[yobnoc 142]

6 minutes ago, Coreece said:

Another dumbass ASSumption.

What in the actual fuck are you talking about?

This might be a case of simple miscommunication.  When you said "No," was that intended to mean you don't have thoughts on it?  Or was that intended to mean "No (I don't support the ban)?"

 

[jakee 1,563]

39 minutes ago, yobnoc said:

Then simply don't reply.  You're so transparently desperate for attention right now. 

To be fair, your OP was one word long. A one word response is legitimate.

[Coreece 190]

17 minutes ago, yobnoc said:

When you said "No," was that intended to mean you don't have thoughts on it?  Or was that intended to mean "No (I don't support the ban)?

I don't support a ban.  Let's not let our previous disagreement on religion dictate our tone to each other.  I like you a lot.  Believe it or not, we practically the same person aside from religion, my nigga.  I worked those factories too.

BTW, they still let you smoke on the line?  Can you vape?

Edited September 11, 2019 by Coreece

[yobnoc 142]

8 minutes ago, Coreece said:

I don't support a ban.  Let's not let our previous disagreement on religion dictate our tone to each other.  I like you a lot.  Believe it or not, we practically the same person aside from religion, my nigga.  I worked those factories too.

BTW, they still let you smoke on the line?  Can you vape?

I apologize for not asking for clarification earlier. My bad! I’ll need a surgeon to remove my foot from my mouth. 

Smoking is not allowed on the line post-2010 ban. Vaping just recently got banned on the line in the last few years, but it’s not really enforced at all.

I like you too, although I deplore the use of the word you used to address me just there. But I’m not the speech police. We’re all good bro!

[Coreece 190]

18 minutes ago, yobnoc said:

I apologize for not asking for clarification earlier. My bad!

You once told me that "apologies are weird online" All's good.  "My bad" simply works in most cases.

18 minutes ago, yobnoc said:

although I deplore the use of the word you used to address me just there. But I’m not the speech police.

Sometimes it makes me cringe depending on the context.  I grew up where I was understood and could use it with impunity.  It meant nothing to us.  And tho I never used it at MSU, I got a rude awakening there about racial comedy, and it broke my heart.

Edited September 11, 2019 by Coreece

[yobnoc 142]

2 minutes ago, Coreece said:

You once told me that "apologies are weird online" All's good.  "My bad" simple works in most cases.

Sometimes it makes me cringe depending on the context.  I grew up where I was understood and could use it with impunity.  It meant nothing to us.  And tho I never used it at MSU, I got a rude awakening there about racial comedy, and it broke my heart.

Yeah to me it doesn't matter what color the person who's using it is.  However, that being said, I also can't stand the disparity that exists between it being "OK" to have the hashtag #wypipo or #wypipobelike or any iteration of that bullshit, while we decide as a society that we're going to put the N-word in the dustbin of history (or at least try).  I don't like inconsistency.

[Coreece 190]

2 minutes ago, yobnoc said:

7 minutes ago, Coreece said:

You once told me that "apologies are weird online" All's good.  "My bad" simple works in most cases.

Sometimes it makes me cringe depending on the context.  I grew up where I was understood and could use it with impunity.  It meant nothing to us.  And tho I never used it at MSU, I got a rude awakening there about racial comedy, and it broke my heart.

Yeah to me it doesn't matter what color the person who's using it is.  However, that being said, I also can't stand the disparity that exists between it being "OK" to have the hashtag #wypipo or #wypipobelike or any iteration of that bullshit, while we decide as a society that we're going to put the N-word in the dustbin of history (or at least try).  I don't like inconsistency.

Dave Chappelle said it best:

Making fun of our differences is how we made it through that shithole of a city.  And It breaks my heart that it's still a shithole, and apparently will continue to be a shithole for another 50 years.  Except of course for all the gentrification going on downtown, but nobody gives a shit about that, right?

[yobnoc 142]

1 minute ago, Coreece said:

Dave Chappelle said it best:

Making fun of our differences is how we made it through that shithole of a city.  And It breaks my heart that it's still a shithole, and apparently will continue to be a shithole for another 50 years.  Except of course for all the gentrification going on downtown, but nobody gives a shit about that, right?

I don't hate gentrification.  I am also at work and it's loud in here so I can't watch the video for reference. 

I know that gentrification is usually considered a bad thing when you ask most liberals, but I also don't hold every single liberal position.  I just happen to have more in common with liberal values than conservative.  If conservatives returned to sound fiscal policy instead of marrying with the church, I'd have a harder time voting Democratic. 

That said, I wanted Abdul to be the Governor, not Gretchen.  And while I voted for Gretchen this past go-round, I will not be voting for her again.  She has lost my vote altogether due to her overreach with regards to the vaping ban.  Might seem trivial, but it's the only thing that I was successfully able to use to get off of cigarettes.  She's quite literally bad for my health.

[Coreece 190]

46 minutes ago, yobnoc said:

I don't hate gentrification.

Ultimately downtown Detroit is following Chicago's model.  I did a story on it almost 20 years ago as a requirement to graduate form Specs Howard after MSU.  Back then it was all rainbows and jellybeans, but now, no thanks.  Chicago is fucked and I don't want anything to do with modeling this city after chicago if it's going to lead to that type income/violence inequality.

 

46 minutes ago, yobnoc said:

I am also at work and it's loud in here so I can't watch the video for reference.

He basically said that it's too hard to entertain a country with such brittle ears.  "Motherfuckers have become too sensitive, the whole country has turned into a bunch of bitch ass niggers." 

 

46 minutes ago, yobnoc said:

And while I voted for Gretchen this past go-round, I will not be voting for her again. 

You only voted for her because of her "fix the damn roads" comment, right? 

Just playin, she was bound to win just on principle alone after the last fucking asshole.

46 minutes ago, yobnoc said:

She has lost my vote altogether due to her overreach with regards to the vaping ban.

I wasn't aware of that.  Idiot.

 

46 minutes ago, yobnoc said:

Might seem trivial, but it's the only thing that I was successfully able to use to get off of cigarettes.

 Not trivial at all.  It's the only reason that I can now buy a pack of squares and enjoy a weekend of smoking without getting "hooked" again.  I just go back to the e-cig during the week if I get that urge and I usually just forget about it and stop vaping all together.

For me, nicotine  doesn't seem to be physically addictive.  When I was a heavy smoker, I once found myself in a situation where access to cigarettes was just not an option.  Once that option was taken from me, I realized how not addicted I really was.  Ya, I had some thoughts about smoking, but I knew I couldn't get any so it was all good - it's wasn't like real addiction where you apparently become physically incapable of functioning normally.  That realization has allowed me to smoke periodically and quit at will.  Vaping just makes it easier to deal with the "mental addiction" if you will.

Also, If I vape for an extended period, I eventually find myself getting tired of it and just stop naturally.  That never really happened when I was a heavy smoker, which leads me to believe that it's all the other chemicals in cigs that fuck you up, not the nicotine.

 

Edited September 11, 2019 by Coreece

[Coreece 190]

Having said that, there are still concerns I have with some vaping techiques, but I don't have time to address that right now. . .

Edited September 11, 2019 by Coreece

[yobnoc 142]

12 minutes ago, Coreece said:

Having said that, there are still concerns I have with some vaping techiques, but I don't have time to address that right now. . .

Yeah, I have all the devices that do those huge annoying clouds, but I only ever use the small devices now that are salt-nicotine based. 

[yoink 321]

3 hours ago, yobnoc said:

Thoughts?

6 people dead from vaping this year. Somewhere between 30 and 40 THOUSAND to gun injuries.

Sure. Ban vaping. *rolls eyes

What? No thoughts and prayers??

 

IMO vaping is no different to smoking. It’s your choice to do it and as you’re putting chemicals known to cause harm directly into your lungs then there’s a pretty good chance it’ll fuck you up over the long term. But that’s your choice.

Whats not Ok would be making me suck up your second hand vape. So no vaping in enclosed public spaces etc.

Edited September 12, 2019 by yoink

[yobnoc 142]

2 minutes ago, yoink said:

6 people dead from vaping this year. Somewhere between 30 and 40 THOUSAND to gun injuries.

Sure. Ban vaping. *rolls eyes

 

IMO vaping is no different to smoking. It’s your choice to do it and as you’re putting chemicals known to cause harm directly into your lungs then there’s a pretty good chance it’ll fuck you up over the long term. But that’s your choice.

Whats not Ok would be making me suck up your second hand vape. So no vaping in enclosed public spaces etc.

Which chemicals are known to cause harm?

[yoink 321]

Hang on. Let me double check.

But I’m pretty sure they contain bad solvents.

Edit: Nope. Propylene glycol for the most part. So those aren’t the issue I thought.

Edited September 12, 2019 by yoink

[yobnoc 142]

5 minutes ago, yoink said:

Hang on. Let me double check.

But I’m pretty sure they contain bad solvents.

Edit: Nope. Propylene glycol for the most part. So those aren’t the issue I thought.

Some businesses don't allow the huge cloud producing devices, but I've never had a bar tell me I can't use my little mini.  You can barely even see the exhale, so people don't even notice.  I understand people getting annoyed by plumes of vapor dusting past them, but there is no science behind it being medically harmful.  I have no problem with businesses setting their own rules.  I'm very laissez-faire when it comes to that.  I don't support blanket bans on smoking cigarettes indoors; if a business chooses to allow it, and it's not free-market viable, then the business will ultimately fail due to lack of customers.  If you don't want to breathe in second hand smoke, I totally get it.  Go get drunk at applebees or chili's, not Moe's pub across the street from the auto plant. 

[Coreece 190]

1 minute ago, yobnoc said:

Which chemicals are known to cause harm?

A concerned has been raised about formaldehyde when vaping a dry coil at high wattage, but what they don't realize is that such a hit taste horrible.  Even if you get some in you lungs, it's still nowhere near that of what you get from a cig.  It's not really a concern with fixed low wattage devices.

Some newer brands include other chemicals, but I tend to stick with straight nicotine VG/PG.

I used the Marlboro Markten a long while ago when they where practically giving them out for free, and I found it a bit peculiar that when I went back to my basic stuff I got a horrible headache.  It was almost like there was something in there to keep me stuck on Marktens.

The other concern I have is that vape particles are so small and can penetrate deeper into the lung, so we don't know what if there are any long term effects of that.  The porosity of paint looks like Swiss cheese to a vape particle.

[Coreece 190]

23 minutes ago, yoink said:

Whats not Ok would be making me suck up your second hand vape. So no vaping in enclosed public spaces etc.