Jon Stewart Silences Congress

[SkyDekker 1,465]

1 hour ago, BIGUN said:

Socialism and social programs have practically nothing to do with one another and people who scream about the former whenever they see the latter have nothing to contribute.

You mean like people who scream that providing health care for your society is socialism and will ruin everything. You mean like those people?

[SkyDekker 1,465]

12 hours ago, turtlespeed said:

Been all of those things - Did all of those things . . . . Next

And yet you still didn't learn the difference between anecdote and data.

[billvon 3,120]

13 hours ago, turtlespeed said:

Been all of those things - Did all of those things . . . . Next

I've had to live in a van, and I've had to decide how to get enough to eat on a few dollars a week.  But you (and I) have advantages most people don't have.

[turtlespeed 226]

7 hours ago, billvon said:

I've had to live in a van, and I've had to decide how to get enough to eat on a few dollars a week.  But you (and I) have advantages most people don't have.

What was that?  What are those?

The advantages I have - I went out and worked for.

 

[SkyDekker 1,465]

On 6/21/2019 at 4:54 PM, turtlespeed said:

What was that?  What are those?

The advantages I have - I went out and worked for.

 

Ah, the "I got a job, so other people must be lazy" argument.

[turtlespeed 226]

1 minute ago, SkyDekker said:

Ah, the "I got a job, so other people must be lazy" argument.

No - its the "I didn't give up and let someone else take care of me" argument.

[SkyDekker 1,465]

18 minutes ago, turtlespeed said:

No - its the "I didn't give up and let someone else take care of me" argument.

There are very few people who give up and do absolutely nothing. Giving people, who throughout history have been used and abused, a helping hand is not even remotely close to the picture you are painting.

[billvon 3,120]

On 6/21/2019 at 4:54 PM, turtlespeed said:

The advantages I have - I went out and worked for.

 

Really?  You were a woman and had that changed?  You were black and had your skin bleached?  Most people can't afford to do that.

[turtlespeed 226]

53 minutes ago, billvon said:

Really?  You were a woman and had that changed?  You were black and had your skin bleached?  Most people can't afford to do that.

Nope - I took the situation I was in, and made the correct decisions.

[turtlespeed 226]

Just now, turtlespeed said:

Nope - I took the situation I was in, and made the correct decisions.

And that all started by walking to a library.  So - if the library was my advantage - you must be right.

I'm pretty sure that a library walk isn't beyond any significant number of people in this country.

[SkyDekker 1,465]

8 minutes ago, turtlespeed said:

And that all started by walking to a library.  So - if the library was my advantage - you must be right.

I'm pretty sure that a library walk isn't beyond any significant number of people in this country.

And then it took somebody to hire you and take a chance on you. Could you conceive that people who aren't white males have lower odds of somebody taking a chance on them?

[billvon 3,120]

13 minutes ago, turtlespeed said:

Nope - I took the situation I was in, and made the correct decisions.

Great.  So you started with advantages, and made good decisions.

Quote

And that all started by walking to a library.  So - if the library was my advantage - you must be right.

It's great that you started with advantages and made good decisions.  You should be proud of the work you did.  Just be aware that many don't start with the advantages you had.

[turtlespeed 226]

On 6/24/2019 at 12:38 PM, billvon said:

Great.  So you started with advantages, and made good decisions.

It's great that you started with advantages and made good decisions.  You should be proud of the work you did.  Just be aware that many don't start with the advantages you had.

Last I checked - everyone can get into a library.

[SkyDekker 1,465]

1 hour ago, turtlespeed said:

Last I checked - everyone can get into a library.

I indeed have to give you credit. It is quite an accomplishment to have achieved anything when you are this unwilling to be reasonable in even a discussion.

[billvon 3,120]

1 hour ago, turtlespeed said:

Last I checked - everyone can get into a library.

Unless you're black.  Then you can get in trouble for studying while black.  Juan Pablo Gonzalez was booted from the Catholic University law library by cops in 2018 while he was studying, because he made the white librarian nervous.

How many times have seven cops showed up to physically remove you from the library because your skin color made someone nervous, and they “did not appreciate it?”  If that's never happened - then you started out with some advantages.

Ever been raped and beaten in front of the library while returning books, as an 18 year old woman was in Tampa in 2008?  No?  Then you may have had some advantages during your trips to the library.

It's great that you succeeded.  I am sure you worked hard.  But deciding that since you did it, anyone can with the same amount of effort, is a foolish mistake.  You had advantages that a great many people do not.  That's a fact.

[turtlespeed 226]

10 hours ago, billvon said:

Unless you're black.  Then you can get in trouble for studying while black.  Juan Pablo Gonzalez was booted from the Catholic University law library by cops in 2018 while he was studying, because he made the white librarian nervous.

How many times have seven cops showed up to physically remove you from the library because your skin color made someone nervous, and they “did not appreciate it?”  If that's never happened - then you started out with some advantages.

Ever been raped and beaten in front of the library while returning books, as an 18 year old woman was in Tampa in 2008?  No?  Then you may have had some advantages during your trips to the library.

It's great that you succeeded.  I am sure you worked hard.  But deciding that since you did it, anyone can with the same amount of effort, is a foolish mistake.  You had advantages that a great many people do not.  That's a fact.

I wouldn't know - I went to a public library.

And - No that isn't a fact.  It is your supposition.

 

[wmw999 2,589]

Turtle, I had a similar, less-strongly-worded, objection to your "it's so easy even I did it" post. Since it came from me, no one replied .

The objection is valid, and this is coming from someone who put herself through private university, and whose son graduated from public university in the 2000's with no debt, and no help from his parents for the last 2 1/2 years. It's easy to look back at one's own past and see the obvious decisions. It's a lot harder to recognize them at the time. It's also harder to deal with the consequences of not being what people expect/hope to see (yeah, I've been turned down for jobs for being female; I assume it's much worse if one is a minority). 

Wendy P.

[billvon 3,120]

13 hours ago, turtlespeed said:

I wouldn't know - I went to a public library.

So did the woman who was raped.  I take it you've never been raped or removed from the library because of your skin color?  Then you had advantages they did not.  Fact.

You seem to think that acknowledging your privilege diminishes your achievements.  It doesn't.  It just means that others might have an even harder time than you did.

[turtlespeed 226]

6 hours ago, wmw999 said:

Turtle, I had a similar, less-strongly-worded, objection to your "it's so easy even I did it" post. Since it came from me, no one replied .

The objection is valid, and this is coming from someone who put herself through private university, and whose son graduated from public university in the 2000's with no debt, and no help from his parents for the last 2 1/2 years. It's easy to look back at one's own past and see the obvious decisions. It's a lot harder to recognize them at the time. It's also harder to deal with the consequences of not being what people expect/hope to see (yeah, I've been turned down for jobs for being female; I assume it's much worse if one is a minority). 

Wendy P.

 

1 hour ago, billvon said:

So did the woman who was raped.  I take it you've never been raped or removed from the library because of your skin color?  Then you had advantages they did not.  Fact.

You seem to think that acknowledging your privilege diminishes your achievements.  It doesn't.  It just means that others might have an even harder time than you did.

No, I have never been raped for my skin color.

You are claiming privileges that do not exist and calling them fact.  That is wrong.

[turtlespeed 226]

6 hours ago, wmw999 said:

Turtle, I had a similar, less-strongly-worded, objection to your "it's so easy even I did it" post. Since it came from me, no one replied .

The objection is valid, and this is coming from someone who put herself through private university, and whose son graduated from public university in the 2000's with no debt, and no help from his parents for the last 2 1/2 years. It's easy to look back at one's own past and see the obvious decisions. It's a lot harder to recognize them at the time. It's also harder to deal with the consequences of not being what people expect/hope to see (yeah, I've been turned down for jobs for being female; I assume it's much worse if one is a minority). 

Wendy P.

Well - I suppose that may be correct, but only if you disqualify all of the disadvantages I had to start out with.

Or are there double standards when considering this type of thing?

 

[billvon 3,120]

2 minutes ago, turtlespeed said:

No, I have never been raped for my skin color.

Nor have I.   I have never been thrown out of libraries or arrested for my skin color, and I have never been raped.  We have both had those advantages.  Blacks and women often don't.  And that's a fact.

[billvon 3,120]

1 minute ago, turtlespeed said:

Well - I suppose that may be correct, but only if you disqualify all of the disadvantages I had to start out with.

Or are there double standards when considering this type of thing?

Not at all.  I am sure you had a lot of disadvantages.  You also had a lot of advantages.  Why not admit both?  Why do you have to portray yourself as a victim of circumstance, when a lot of that circumstance was to your advantage?

[turtlespeed 226]

45 minutes ago, billvon said:

Not at all.  I am sure you had a lot of disadvantages.  You also had a lot of advantages.  Why not admit both?  Why do you have to portray yourself as a victim of circumstance, when a lot of that circumstance was to your advantage?

 

45 minutes ago, billvon said:

Not at all.  I am sure you had a lot of disadvantages.  You also had a lot of advantages.  Why not admit both?  Why do you have to portray yourself as a victim of circumstance, when a lot of that circumstance was to your advantage?

Because I was there - I know what went on.

I'm not a victim - I don't look at myself as a victim - I simply didn't take "You can't do that" as an answer and worked around it.

I didn't accept limitations and worked through it.

I didnt have any of these so called advantages you are falsely accusing me of having.

[wmw999 2,589]

I’ve met you. The ones I identified in an earlier post are my opinion based on meeting you. Looks, intelligence, skin color are all advantages depending on the circumstances. In Texas, none of those that you have are generally disadvantages. 

Wendy P. 

[Coreece 190]

3 hours ago, wmw999 said:

Turtle, I had a similar, less-strongly-worded, objection to your "it's so easy even I did it" post. Since it came from me, no one replied .

Doesn't my lame turtle joke count?  Believe it or not, there was an underlying point in there somewhere. 

(There's also the possibility that she just ignore-listed me for being such an enormiss jackass in the mass shooting abortion thread.)

On 6/21/2019 at 6:56 AM, wmw999 said:

I also know people who were homeless and turned down for jobs because of no address. 

One of the first things I did was rent a mail box from some mom n' pop shop so it looks like a normal apartment address rather than a P.O box.  A cheap pre-paid phone for callbacks was also a must.  These can typically be funded with your first day-labor gig. 

 

On 6/21/2019 at 12:02 PM, billvon said:

I've had to live in a van

Pfffft, you and your luxury,  I had to sleep in a 2-door coupe!  It was still a huge advantage tho, not only did it have a solar roof, it practically guaranteed me day-labor gigs as long as I was willing to drive other day-laborers to the job site.

Also, public beach showers are nice, but I found an affordable 1-month gym membership to be well worth the extra cost for the mental and physical advantages it provided.

 

On 6/21/2019 at 12:02 PM, billvon said:

I've had to decide how to get enough to eat on a few dollars a week.

Cup noodles!   And I recommend that good hot water from the red coffee spigot at the gas station, not that lukewarm crap they serve at the local public bathroom.