Russian Involvement in US Election Results

[Bob_Church 7]

airdvr

***Since several million people more voted for HRC than for DJT, it’s probably not accurate to say they were all sleeping. They were outmaneuvered. I’m not sure that treating our democracy like a game, to pick at the rules to get the outcome desired by some, is the most honest approach. And yes, of course the Dems would do it too. The original Gerry was a Democrat-Relublican in 1812. It’s not a new concept. But it’s chickenshit, like thinking you got away with something cheating on a test where you didn’t actually know the answers.

There are a lot of smugly superior lefties. Oddly enough, the same goes for righties.

Wendy P.

Possibly...but to completely dismiss the effect of the MSM on Democrats and the polarizing personality of HRC wouldn't be accurate as well.

Until people quit obsessing about the four million and try to figure out the 64 million they'll get nowhere. Running against Donald Trump should not have been anywhere nearly as close as this was.
He should have gotten maybe ten or twenty percent of the vote, max.

[wmw999 2,588]

I'm not really one of those who ascribes everything (or much of anything) to a single cause. HRC was an awful candidate in some ways. I thought she was better than DJT, but that's kind of like asking if I'd rather have crabs or lice.

The smug, calm, assumption that HRC would win was not a good thing.

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[Bob_Church 7]

wmw999

I'm not really one of those who ascribes everything (or much of anything) to a single cause. HRC was an awful candidate in some ways. I thought she was better than DJT, but that's kind of like asking if I'd rather have crabs or lice.

The smug, calm, assumption that HRC would win was not a good thing.

Wendy P.

f

I have a friend who does some fairly high level government stuff that he never talks about. But he's also well placed with the Virginia Democrats and attended the big meetings. He's dyed in the wool Democrat but downright ashamed and embarrassed, oh and more than a little angry about the DNC's behavior in the run up to the last election. I think a big advantage for the Republicans is that they're very much aware of Trumps problems and tried to minimize and even use them to their own advantage instead of just saying "our opponents are just stupid, what can you do?
"

[billvon 3,116]

airdvr

***>What I want to know is, in the end, what do think the result of Russian involvement had
>in the presidential election.

There was some effect. It was not the decisive effect, but played a role. Which, when combined with every other effect in the election (Comey's November surprise, the effect of the deplorables comment, the unexpected mobilization of the white supremacy movement, etc etc) caused the result we saw.

Please...you left out the fact that most didn't like HRC and the left went to sleep at the polls thinking there was no way Trump could win.

The abbreviations "etc etc" mean "etcetera" and are there to indicate that several other reasons were left out, since there were many.

[jakee 1,595]

rushmc

I still ask you to back up what you post. But you usually won't do it

You have an exact quote, a name and a date to search for. If you don't know how to use that information to find the original thread then you really don't have any business talking to the grown ups.

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[billvon 3,116]

>I still ask you to back up what you post.

I gave you the poster's username, the date he posted, and what he posted. That is backup. If you don't know what to do with that information, ask a friend of yours who is good with computers.

[jakee 1,595]

Bob_Church

Until people quit obsessing about the four million and try to figure out the 64 million they'll get nowhere. Running against Donald Trump should not have been anywhere nearly as close as this was.
He should have gotten maybe ten or twenty percent of the vote, max.

Sure, Hillary should have won easy - by getting more votes. The idea that it's the fault of the Dem campaign that so many people voted for Trump, that it was because people were pushed onto him by Dem smugness, is utterly absurd.

Republicans chose Trump in the primaries. They flocked to him when he was campaigning against other Republicans, the Dems didn't have anything to do with it. For a party that supposedly values personal responsibilty the Rs sure as hell like to pass the buck don't they?

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[Stumpy 284]

jakee

Sure, Hillary should have won easy - by getting more votes.

Which, as it happened, she did.

Never try to eat more than you can lift

[wmw999 2,588]

Some votes are more equal than others.


Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[rushmc 23]

wmw999

Some votes are more equal than others.


Wendy P.

And some people would just as soon function outside the rules.

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[SkyDekker 1,465]

Yeah like handling classified information without a security clearance.

Or lying to congress under oath and keeping your job as the AG.

Or forgetting all your interactions with foreigners so you have to keep "amending" your security clearance application.

Or lying to the FBI.

[jcd11235 0]

rushmc

And some people would just as soon function outside the rules.

Hence the title of the thread.

Math tutoring available. Only $6! per hour! First lesson: Factorials!

[rushmc 23]

SkyDekker

Yeah like handling classified information without a security clearance.

Or lying to congress under oath and keeping your job as the AG.

Or forgetting all your interactions with foreigners so you have to keep "amending" your security clearance application.

Or lying to the FBI.

And still no collusion...

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[SkyDekker 1,465]

I thought we were talking about functioning outside the rules.

[billvon 3,116]

>And some people would just as soon function outside the rules.

We now have an administration that is living proof of that.

What are we up to? Four indictments and two guilty pleas? I'm losing track.

[Bob_Church 7]

wmw999

I'm not really one of those who ascribes everything (or much of anything) to a single cause. HRC was an awful candidate in some ways. I thought she was better than DJT, but that's kind of like asking if I'd rather have crabs or lice.

The smug, calm, assumption that HRC would win was not a good thing.

Wendy P.

It's interesting to consider who they might have gone with if they weren't, well, whatever it was, let's just say if HRC hadn't been a candidate. I seriously doubt it would have been Saunders, I think he was just a token to make it look like a legitimate primary. I don't think it's a moot point. I know that right now it seems like forever but someday the next few years will pass by and we'll have another election. Let's hope it's a very different one.
Personally I like Ted Strickland but that's just because I want Internet service here in Appalachia.

[rushmc 23]

billvon

>And some people would just as soon function outside the rules.

We now have an administration that is living proof of that.

What are we up to? Four indictments and two guilty pleas? I'm losing track.

And yet none of them have to do anything with Russia.

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[jakee 1,595]

rushmc

And yet none of them have to do anything with Russia.

Right... Lying to the FBI about the contacts you had with Russians has nothing at all to do with conacting Russians.

And laundering money and conspiring against the US when working for an explicitly Pro-Russian party in Ukraine is purely to be with Ukraine, not Russia.

Ok then.

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[rushmc 23]

jakee

***And yet none of them have to do anything with Russia.

Right... Lying to the FBI about the contacts you had with Russians has nothing at all to do with conacting Russians.

And laundering money and conspiring against the US when working for an explicitly Pro-Russian party in Ukraine is purely to be with Ukraine, not Russia.

Ok then.


Keep dreaming

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[jakee 1,595]

rushmc

******And yet none of them have to do anything with Russia.

Right... Lying to the FBI about the contacts you had with Russians has nothing at all to do with conacting Russians.

And laundering money and conspiring against the US when working for an explicitly Pro-Russian party in Ukraine is purely to be with Ukraine, not Russia.

Ok then.
Keep dreaming
About what?

You do know that those are the indictments, right?

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[billvon 3,116]

>And yet none of them have to do anything with Russia.

Except the two that concern lying about their collusion with Russia. And the two that involve Russian money laundering. And the seven that involve failing to disclose their Russian accounts. And the two that involve "conspiracy against the United States" with Russia. And two about being an unregistered foreign agent for Russia.

Other than those thirteen criminal charges, you are right - none of the rest have anything to do with Russia.

[kallend 2,148]

rushmc

***>And some people would just as soon function outside the rules.

We now have an administration that is living proof of that.

What are we up to? Four indictments and two guilty pleas? I'm losing track.

And yet none of them have to do anything with Russia.

Every time I think your credibility has reached rock bottom, you prove me wrong.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[rushmc 23]

kallend

******>And some people would just as soon function outside the rules.

We now have an administration that is living proof of that.

What are we up to? Four indictments and two guilty pleas? I'm losing track.

And yet none of them have to do anything with Russia.

Every time I think your credibility has reached rock bottom, you prove me wrong.

Okay then. Tell me which charge deals directly with Russian collusion. And according to the left that would be some treasonous activity dealing directly with the Russians. I can wait...

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[billvon 3,116]

>Okay then. Tell me which charge deals directly with Russian collusion.

From the charges against Papadopoulos:

==================
Pursuant to Federal Rule of Criminal Procedure 11, the United States of America and the defendant, GEORGE PAPADOPOULOS, stipulate and agree that the following facts are true and accurate. These facts do not constitute all of the facts known to the parties concerning the charged offense; they are being submitted to demonstrate that sufficient facts exist that the defendant committed the offense to which he is pleading guilty.
. . .
On or about April 26, 2016, defendant PAPADOPOULOS met the Professor for breakfast at a London hotel. During this meeting, the Professor told defendant PAPADOPOULOS that he had just returned from a trip to Moscow where he had met with highlevel Russian government officials. The Professor told defendant PAPADOPOULOS that on that trip he (the Professor) learned that the Russians had obtained "dirt" on then-candidate Clinton. The Professor told defendant PAPADOPOULOS, as defendant PAPADOPOULOS later described to the FBI, that "They [the Russians] have dirt on her"; "the Russians had emails of Clinton"; "they have thousands of emails."

Following that conversation, defendant PAPADOPOULOS continued to correspond with Campaign officials, and continued to communicate with the Professor and the Russian MF A Connection, in an effort to arrange a meeting between the Campaign and the Russian government.
. . .
In truth and in fact, however, defendant PAPADOPOULOS understood the Professor to have substantial connections to high-level Russian government officials and that the Professor spoke with some of those officials in Moscow before telling defendant PAPADOPOULOS about the "dirt." Defendant PAPADOPOULOS also engaged in extensive communications over a period of months with the Professor regarding foreign policy issues for the Campaign, including efforts to arrange a "history making" meeting between the Campaign and Russian government officials.
. . .
In truth and in fact, however, defendant PAPADOPOULOS met the Female Russian National on or about March 24, 2016, after he had joined the Campaign; he believed that the Female Russian National had connections to high-level Russian government officials and could help him arrange a potential foreign policy trip to Russia; and during the Campaign he emailed and spoke over Skype on numerous occasions with the Female Russian National about the potential foreign policy trip to Russia.
=================================

[rushmc 23]

We now know the Whistleblower that turned him in worked for the Clinton Foundation. Funny how all this keeps turning back towards the clintons. More to come...

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln