FBI Clinton Email Dump - 09-02-2016

[quade 4]

Have at it.

https://vault.fbi.gov/hillary-r.-clinton

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[tkhayes 348]

contains too many facts - I expect no one on Dz.com will be interested in any of that.

[winsor 236]

quade

Have at it.

https://vault.fbi.gov/hillary-r.-clinton

What's your point?

[RonD1120 62]

There is nothing to be gained. As a former Skydive City Twin Otter pilot used to say, "Some things only change by...." Well, he meant by drastic measure.

Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.

[rushmc 23]

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/hillary-clinton-email-2000/story?id=29396854

Can you imagine...

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[quade 4]

winsor

***Have at it.
https://vault.fbi.gov/hillary-r.-clinton

What's your point?

That people bitched, whined, and moaned about the FBI not finding anything actionable enough to prosecute and went further to accuse Comey of selling out and demanded to see this.

Go ahead, take a gander at it and see if you can find what what she should be prosecuted for in it.

Go for it.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[winsor 236]

quade

******Have at it.
https://vault.fbi.gov/hillary-r.-clinton

What's your point?

That people bitched, whined, and moaned about the FBI not finding anything actionable enough to prosecute and went further to accuse Comey of selling out and demanded to see this.

Go ahead, take a gander at it and see if you can find what what she should be prosecuted for in it.

Go for it.

From what shows up in the Cliff's Notes version she should be in Leavenworth.

Again, your point (unless it's to 'baffle them with bullshit)?

[quade 4]

winsor

*********Have at it.
https://vault.fbi.gov/hillary-r.-clinton

What's your point?
That people bitched, whined, and moaned about the FBI not finding anything actionable enough to prosecute and went further to accuse Comey of selling out and demanded to see this.
Go ahead, take a gander at it and see if you can find what what she should be prosecuted for in it.
Go for it.
From what shows up in the Cliff's Notes version she should be in Leavenworth.

Legal experts who have reviewed the documents did not come to this conclusion.

How did you?

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[normiss 897]

The "feels" is my guess.

[winsor 236]

quade

************Have at it.
https://vault.fbi.gov/hillary-r.-clinton

What's your point?
That people bitched, whined, and moaned about the FBI not finding anything actionable enough to prosecute and went further to accuse Comey of selling out and demanded to see this.
Go ahead, take a gander at it and see if you can find what what she should be prosecuted for in it.
Go for it.
From what shows up in the Cliff's Notes version she should be in Leavenworth.

Legal experts who have reviewed the documents did not come to this conclusion.

How did you?

I have a cousin who's an Expert in Toledo.

[BIGUN 1,486]

While in the military; if you or I had setup a personal server to use for military communications, been complacent in the use of that server or had employed the "I didn't know" defense regarding classified material on that personal server - The UCMJ would have hung our asses.

Nobody has time to listen; because they're desperately chasing the need of being heard.

[normiss 897]

I don't recall her ever being in the military and therefore subject to the UCMJ.
Interesting.

[BIGUN 1,486]

You're correct.

However, government agencies are held to a similar if not; higher standard.

18 U.S. Code § 798 — disclosure of classified information could apply to someone who “knowingly and willfully communicates, furnishes, transmits, or otherwise makes available to an unauthorized person” classified information. Someone guilty of this crime “shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than ten years, or both,” under the law.

18 USC 793 — gathering, transmitting or losing defense information also carries a penalty of an unspecified fine or imprisonment of up to 10 years, or both.

18 U.S. Code § 2071 — concealment, removal or mutilation generally of classified information. Under this statute, a guilty person “shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than three years, or both; and shall forfeit his office and be disqualified from holding any office under the United States.”

Quote

Executive Order 13526 and 18 U.S.C Sec. 793(f) of the federal code make it unlawful to send or store classified information on personal email.

(NOW, THEREFORE, I, BARACK OBAMA, by the authority vested in me as President by the Constitution and the laws of the United States of America, it is hereby ordered as follows:)

SUBPART of the Executive Order:

Sec. 1.4. Classification Categories. Information shall not be considered for classification unless its unauthorized disclosure could reasonably be expected to cause identifiable or describable damage to the national security in accordance with section 1.2 of this order, and it pertains to one or more of the following:

(a) military plans, weapons systems, or operations;

(b) foreign government information;

(c) intelligence activities (including covert action), intelligence sources or methods, or cryptology;

(d) foreign relations or foreign activities of the United States, including confidential sources;

(e) scientific, technological, or economic matters relating to the national security;

(f) United States Government programs for safeguarding nuclear materials or facilities;

(g) vulnerabilities or capabilities of systems, installations, infrastructures, projects, plans, or protection services relating to the national security; or

(h) the development, production, or use of weapons of mass destruction.

SOURCE: https://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-office/executive-order-classified-national-security-information

The "Attorney" didn't know?

Same Executive Order.

(d) All original classification authorities must receive training in proper classification (including the avoidance of over-classification) and declassification as provided in this order and its implementing directives at least once a calendar year. Such training must include instruction on the proper safeguarding of classified information and on the sanctions in section 5.5 of this order that may be brought against an individual who fails to classify information properly or protect classified information from unauthorized disclosure. Original classification authorities who do not receive such mandatory training at least once within a calendar year shall have their classification authority suspended by the agency head or the senior agency official designated under section 5.4(d) of this order until such training has taken place. A waiver may be granted by the agency head, the deputy agency head, or the senior agency official if an individual is unable to receive such training due to unavoidable circumstances. Whenever a waiver is granted, the individual shall receive such training as soon as practicable.

Quite Frankly, for me, this is not an R or D issue. It is a matter of public/military trust. I felt the same way about Petraeus AND thought he got a slap on the wrist given HIS position at the time.

What's that old line? "Ignorance of the law is no excuse."

Nobody has time to listen; because they're desperately chasing the need of being heard.

[normiss 897]

Yep.
How does this matter? "Willful" is a key word here.
People with the metric shit ton of law found nothing, though it took years and millions to find that.
This horse is dead. Period.
The feels do not matter.
She's not guilty no matter how hard people try, there is still, simply, nothing to prove that she is.
It's pretty sad how many people do not understand the meaning of words and then get caught up in twisting the meanings.

[quade 4]

Here is THE key sentence in all of this;

Quote

“knowingly and willfully communicates, furnishes, transmits, or otherwise makes available to an unauthorized person”

.
(emphasis mine)

The problem for prosecution is to PROVE she intended to let anything fall into the wrong hands.

Mistakes were made. Sure. Was any of it intentional?

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[BIGUN 1,486]

Mistakes were made. Sure. Was any of it intentional?

I would argue that she instructed someone to install a personal server.
Once she began doing work product on that personal computer; she had knowledge.
All government agencies within the cabinet must place the classification in the "Subject" line or at the top part of the email along with the allowable distribution path.


I hear what Mark and you are saying.
I understand; but do not agree.

Nobody has time to listen; because they're desperately chasing the need of being heard.

[wmw999 2,589]

Thanks; understanding and not agreeing is really what gets us ahead, instead of yammering.

Personally, I think she willingly let herself be ignorant/advised poorly in the IT world, because it suited her needs. I have a relative who works overseas for the State Department, who says that the State Department system is so bad that it's very understandable.

I understand the frustration with being owned by one's assigned system (rather than owning it), and the frustration that comes with having too much to do to address the underlying problems, when there's a quicker workaround. Nearly everyone does.

I see this as evidence of a disturbing willingness on Clinton's part to go answer-shopping sometimes, kind of like the young skygod who wants to downsize. Since Trump seems to be infinitely worse in this (based on a seeming unwillingness even to be questioned or to admit disagreement into his arena), it doesn't disqualify Clinton.

Lucky for me, I live in a state where the result is a foregone conclusion, so I'll probably vote outside the two-party system. Neither of those candidates aligns all the way down with me, but they're at least not caricatures.

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[BIGUN 1,486]

Same Wendy.

Intelligence, Common Sense, Logic and great communication skills. Its no wonder we all love ya.

Keith

Nobody has time to listen; because they're desperately chasing the need of being heard.

[normiss 897]

The ignorance of the executive level of leadership is rather disappointing across a lot of industries.
I walked once when instructed to re-open a closed security breach in a network, having been instructed by Veeps to do so.
It was in direct violation of laws put in place to protect financial data as well as SOX compliance.
I reported the violation and they paid a few mill in fines.

Answer shopping is the norm as well, if you don't do as told, you're easily replaced with someone who will.

The behavior hasn't changed from what I see to this day.

[kallend 2,150]

wmw999

Thanks; understanding and not agreeing is really what gets us ahead, instead of yammering.

Personally, I think she willingly let herself be ignorant/advised poorly in the IT world, because it suited her needs. I have a relative who works overseas for the State Department, who says that the State Department system is so bad that it's very understandable.

I understand the frustration with being owned by one's assigned system (rather than owning it), and the frustration that comes with having too much to do to address the underlying problems, when there's a quicker workaround. Nearly everyone does.

I see this as evidence of a disturbing willingness on Clinton's part to go answer-shopping sometimes, kind of like the young skygod who wants to downsize. Since Trump seems to be infinitely worse in this (based on a seeming unwillingness even to be questioned or to admit disagreement into his arena), it doesn't disqualify Clinton.

Lucky for me, I live in a state where the result is a foregone conclusion, so I'll probably vote outside the two-party system. Neither of those candidates aligns all the way down with me, but they're at least not caricatures.

Wendy P.

I wonder what would come out if Trump was subjected to 8 Congressional inquiries run by Democrats, and an FBI investigation run by a Dem, all paid for by taxpayers.

He is running based on his (claimed) ability as a businessman and dealmaker. Yet the very information (tax returns) that would allow the voters to see if he's telling the truth (or even if he IS a taxpayer himself) is being withheld, contrary to all norms in the modern era.

Even his fraud trial won't take place until after the election.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[wolfriverjoe 1,523]

kallend

I wonder what would come out if Trump was subjected to 8 Congressional inquiries run by Democrats, and an FBI investigation run by a Dem, all paid for by taxpayers...

Do you mean inquiries into stuff like, oh I don't know, Large Donations to Prosecutors Who Were Considering Charges Against Him?

"There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy

"~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo

[quade 4]

BIGUN

Mistakes were made. Sure. Was any of it intentional?

I would argue that she instructed someone to install a personal server.

So, let me get this straight . . .

You believe, Hillary Clinton, set up a personal server (which is untrue it was set up at the request of Bill after leaving office and she simply used it) with the intention of giving classified documents to foreign agents?

Because that's what it appears to be you're saying.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[Coreeece 2]

quade

Mistakes were made. Sure. Was any of it intentional?

As we have seen in this forum on an almost daily basis, the benefit of a doubt is only given to the party with which you most align yourself.

...but again, ignorance is no excuse.

We already know what we're getting with Hillary - just incompetence. . .more excuses.

Never was there an answer....not without listening, without seeing - Gilmour

[Coreeece 2]

kallend

I wonder what would come out if Trump was subjected to 8 Congressional inquiries run by Democrats, and an FBI investigation run by a Dem, all paid for by taxpayers

He hasn't been in the position to fuck up like Hillary - give him a chance.

kallend

He is running based on his (claimed) ability as a businessman and dealmaker. Yet the very information (tax returns) that would allow the voters to see if he's telling the truth (or even if he IS a taxpayer himself) is being withheld, contrary to all norms in the modern era.

Why would he put himself up to any possible and unnecessary scrutiny given the current political climate? - not that it would matter, lol.

Never was there an answer....not without listening, without seeing - Gilmour

[winsor 236]

Deal with it.