By Rejecting 'Radical Islam' Obama Rejects Reality

[mirage62 0]

Bill sorry on my iPad so I don't know how to "quote" but here in America certainly you are correct. OTOH if you want to take the TOTAL killed in America by guns - 30k ish and thr total killed by ISIS I believe even you would agree that the world wide chances of being killed is higher.

Kevin Keenan is my hero, a double FUP, he does so much with so little

[ibx 2]

Quote

Still, radical islam had zero to do with the Orlando shooting.
That dude was angry because he liked men.

The dude had his internal conflict because of fundamentalist Islam. If his religion and culture where accepting of homosexuality he wouldn't have been angry. Radical Islam offered an out with the promise of paradise. How does this not have anything to do with the shooting?

His internal struggle that homosexuality is wrong, yet he is somehow attracted to men caused this violence.

This is just like anti gay republicans who are caught with male prostitutes in public restrooms.

Like Christians shooting up abortion clinics, without the Christian vitriol against abortion, they probably wouldn't have done this.

Taking Islam out the equation is disingenuous at best and a huge problem when you are trying to tackle these issues since your ignoring a core part of the problem.

If you think Islam/Arab culutre is not a problem, please take a look at _ANY_ majority Islamic country and look how they treat homosexuals.

Normiss, normally you write pretty smart stuff, this time though, you've drunken too much of the left cool aid.

[jakee 1,595]

mirage62

Bill sorry on my iPad so I don't know how to "quote" but here in America certainly you are correct. OTOH if you want to take the TOTAL killed in America by guns - 30k ish and thr total killed by ISIS I believe even you would agree that the world wide chances of being killed is higher.

That would not only still be wrong, it would be really, really stupid.

You could take the TOTAL killed in Pauls Valley, Oklahoma by guns and the total killed worldwide by lightning and conclude that lightning is more dangerous than guns. But why would you?

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[billvon 3,118]

>OTOH if you want to take the TOTAL killed in America by guns - 30k ish and thr total
>killed by ISIS I believe even you would agree that the world wide chances of being
>killed is higher.

That doesn't make a whole lot of sense. You're comparing the odds of being killed in the US by a gun vs the odds of being killed anywhere in the world by ISIS?

A better comparison might be the odds of being killed anywhere in the world by a gun vs anywhere in the world by ISIS. And based on the gun death rates in many countries (like Honduras, Venezuela, Guatemala, El Salvador, Colombia, Brazil etc) you would still be far more likely to be killed by a gun.

[Bolas 5]

billvon

>OTOH if you want to take the TOTAL killed in America by guns - 30k ish and thr total
>killed by ISIS I believe even you would agree that the world wide chances of being
>killed is higher.

That doesn't make a whole lot of sense. You're comparing the odds of being killed in the US by a gun vs the odds of being killed anywhere in the world by ISIS?

A better comparison might be the odds of being killed anywhere in the world by a gun vs anywhere in the world by ISIS. And based on the gun death rates in many countries (like Honduras, Venezuela, Guatemala, El Salvador, Colombia, Brazil etc) you would still be far more likely to be killed by a gun.

Neither are good comparisons as it's comparing a method of death to the deaths a group of people commit with some using the same method.

Stupidity if left untreated is self-correcting
If ya can't be good, look good, if that fails, make 'em laugh.

[Coreeece 2]

billvon

I have no doubt that the same people who want this latest shooter to be called a radical Islamist would be aghast if Obama called Breivik a radical Christian

Ya well no shit, because he's not a Christian. . .

Never was there an answer....not without listening, without seeing - Gilmour

[Coreeece 2]

wmw999

That has nothing whatsoever to do with Islam, Christianity, or bonk-bonkism. It has to do with people.

It's funny how people mysteriously forget to lump atheism in there whenever this stuff pops up - but you're right, the common denominator in all of this is mere humanity.

hu·mane
adjective
1. having or showing compassion or benevolence.

2.(of a branch of learning) intended to have a civilizing or refining effect on people.

What an odd definition . . .

Never was there an answer....not without listening, without seeing - Gilmour

[billvon 3,118]

>Ya well no shit, because he's not a Christian. . .

Right. And he went to a Martyr's Mass before his killings because he . . wanted to sit down for a minute?

You don't get to "un-Christianize" him afterwards. Imagine your reaction if someone said that the Orlando killer wasn't Muslim after the fact.

[Coreeece 2]

billvon

>Ya well no shit, because he's not a Christian. . .

Right. And he went to a Martyr's Mass before his killings because he . . wanted to sit down for a minute?

You don't get to "un-Christianize" him afterwards. Imagine your reaction if someone said that the Orlando killer wasn't Muslim after the fact.

He stated that he's an Odinist and never identified as a Christian. However, if he was then I have no problem distinguishing him from the rest of us peaceful radicals/fundamentalists and calling him a christian terrorist.

Never was there an answer....not without listening, without seeing - Gilmour

[billvon 3,118]

>Neither are good comparisons as it's comparing a method of death to the deaths a
>group of people commit with some using the same method.

True. The more accurate method would be to compare ISIS deaths to deaths by Hondurans, Venezuelans, Guatemalans, El Salvadorians, Colombians, Brazilians, Americans etc. (moving any overlap between the two into the ISIS column)

[billvon 3,118]

>However, if he was then I have no problem distinguishing him from the rest of us
>peaceful radicals/fundamentalists and calling him a christian terrorist.

Cool; makes sense. As long as we can do that for all religions, then that works.

[Coreeece 2]

kallend

***

I do know that constantly pointing out that Christians kill abortion doctors is a pale comparison to what the extremist Muslims are doing currently.

Do you have any idea how many Muslim civilians the US killed in Iraq from 2003 -2008?

But the US didn't kill in the name of Christianity, just like the Soviets didn't kill in the name of Atheism - well, unless of course you were part of the League of Militant Atheists that conspired with other communists to intimidate, imprison and kill people of various religions.

Some estimates are as high as 140+ million people killed by the bloody hands of atheists in the last 100 years or so - that's gotta be a record or something.

btw, playing on NBCSN right now: volleyball in the name of Christianity vs volleyball in the name of Islam - USA vs Iran. . .

Never was there an answer....not without listening, without seeing - Gilmour

[Guest]

Austin Bay commentary on Orlando

"The mouse does not know life until it is in the mouth of the cat."

[kallend 2,148]

Coreeece

******

I do know that constantly pointing out that Christians kill abortion doctors is a pale comparison to what the extremist Muslims are doing currently.

Do you have any idea how many Muslim civilians the US killed in Iraq from 2003 -2008?

But the US didn't kill in the name of Christianity

So the Christians who repeatedly claim that "the US is a Christian nation" got it wrong. Check.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[Coreeece 2]

Bolas

Religion groups should not be a protected class

The infamous history of atheism tells us otherwise.

Bolas

it's something people choose and can easily change.

The science suggests that we're born this way for one reason or another. How that manifests is another story. To say that religious groups shouldn't be a protected class because their preference is a choice is like saying Homosexuals shouldn't be a protected class because they choose to have sex with men rather than stay celibate, or that a bi-sexual prefers women over men, or that a TG male prefers a TG female with a hairy chest. . .



sorry. . . I'm not helping religion, am I?

Never was there an answer....not without listening, without seeing - Gilmour

[Coreeece 2]

kallend

*********

I do know that constantly pointing out that Christians kill abortion doctors is a pale comparison to what the extremist Muslims are doing currently.

Do you have any idea how many Muslim civilians the US killed in Iraq from 2003 -2008?

But the US didn't kill in the name of Christianity

So Christians Atheists like me who repeatedly claim imply that "the US is a Christian nation" whenever it's convenient for us, got it wrong. Check.

FIFY

Never was there an answer....not without listening, without seeing - Gilmour

[billvon 3,118]

>FIFY

No, neither atheists nor Kallend constantly imply that the US is a Christian nation.

[Coreeece 2]

Plenty of them do as long as the idea makes it convenient for them to take a potshot at Christianity. . .

They like to take their shit and eat it too.

Never was there an answer....not without listening, without seeing - Gilmour

[Bolas 5]

Coreeece

***Religion groups should not be a protected class

The infamous history of atheism tells us otherwise.

Atheists wouldn't be a protected class either.

Coreeece

***it's something people choose and can easily change.

The science suggests that we're born this way for one reason or another. How that manifests is another story. To say that religious groups shouldn't be a protected class because their preference is a choice is like saying Homosexuals shouldn't be a protected class because they choose to have sex with men rather than stay celibate, or that a bi-sexual prefers women over men, or that a TG male prefers a TG female with a hairy chest. . .



sorry. . . I'm not helping religion, am I?

There may be genetic predispositions to religion and/or belief in higher powers the same as one may have a predisposition to alcoholism, but it's general, not type/brand specific: there's no Christian or Baptist gene the same as there's no beer or Budweiser gene.

Stupidity if left untreated is self-correcting
If ya can't be good, look good, if that fails, make 'em laugh.

[billvon 3,118]

>Plenty of them do as long as the idea makes it convenient for them to take a potshot at Christianity. . .

No, they don't. As a whole the are pretty clear that they do NOT believe that the US was founded on Christianity. They have written books about it, quoted George Washington saying it isn't and disagreeing with people who say it is.

You are doing what RushMC does - making up a story in your mind then complaining about it.

[Coreeece 2]

billvon

>Plenty of them do as long as the idea makes it convenient for them to take a potshot at Christianity. . .

No, they don't. As a whole the are pretty clear that they do NOT believe that the US was founded on Christianity.

Exactly - I'm pretty sure kallend doesn't believe that the US is a Christian nation, but that didn't stop him from blaming Christianity for the deaths of Muslim civilians during the US invasion of Iraq in 2003 as if it was a Christian nation.

billvon

you are doing what RushMC does - making up a story in your mind then complaining about it.

Lol, what a bunch of horseshit. He's the one that brought it up, not me.

Never was there an answer....not without listening, without seeing - Gilmour

[billvon 3,118]

>Exactly - I'm pretty sure kallend doesn't believe that the US is a Christian nation

That's a flip-flop worthy of RushMC.

>that didn't stop him from blaming Christianity for the deaths of Muslim civilians during
>the US invasion of Iraq in 2003 as if it was a Christian nation.

So wait - when Kallend blames Christianity for the deaths of Muslims, that means he is defining the US as a Christian nation?

Many right wingers here blame Islam for the acts of terror that Muslims commit, even when they are US citizens. Does that mean they are defining the US as a Muslim nation? Or is this one of those "no, it's only bad when the other side does it" things?

[normiss 897]

You've made some good points that I think I didn't follow due to all the local politicians trying to entirely blame on radical Islamic terrorism.
The coverage here has been a bit much to say the least.
I did a poor job of writing that perspective that I intended to.
I think you're correct.

Thanks.

[Coreeece 2]

billvon

So wait - when Kallend blames Christianity for the deaths of Muslims, that means he is defining the US as a Christian nation?

Not if he merely stated that Christians killed Muslims during the Iraq war, but he didn't. He implied that the U.S killed Muslims, and then lumped our armed forces in with the likes of christian nutcases that terrorize abortion clinics in the name of Christianity - a terrible comparison indeed, but still not as bad as some of yours.

billvon

Many right wingers here blame Islam for the acts of terror that Muslims commit, even when they are US citizens.

Speaking of terrible comparisons. . .

A more accurate one would've been if they blamed the US armed forces for carrying out acts of Islamic terror in the name of Islam, but they didn't - so you're kinda flat on your face there.

Never was there an answer....not without listening, without seeing - Gilmour

[ibx 2]

Thanks for the civil discourse