The Invasion of Europe

[jgoose71 0]

It's been a while since I've picked a fight on the Internet. I found this as an interesting take on the refugee crisis.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rIcltV7r-nM

"Unlike other Robin Hoods, I speak with a real British accent"
-Robin Hood, Men in Tights

"There is an art, it says, or, rather, a knack to flying. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss."
Life, the Universe, and Everything

[turtlespeed 226]

jgoose71

It's been a while since I've picked a fight on the Internet. I found this as an interesting take on the refugee crisis.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rIcltV7r-nM

"Unlike other Robin Hoods, I speak with a real British accent"
-Robin Hood, Men in Tights

They are all wholesome law abiding people. Who cares if they rape a few women? Really, what difference does it make anyway.

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[ibx 2]

Agree with everything in the video. I will try shed light on the German position though.


Well the simple question you have ask yourself if you consider the refugees as humans in need.
If so, then the first thing is to help people in immediate need, disregarding of who they are since all humans deserve protection. That's one of the major insights that separates us from the middle ages and the middle east. Do we want to give that up?

That's how the Germans are arguing and that's why we've opened the damn.

These people are at the EU border right now, they are hungry and cold.
With Germanys history, we do not want to force people to live in camps, can you guess why? Further we do not want an impenetrable border( A large defended wall).
We've had a wall in the past where innocent people where shot for want of a better life.

Most of these the refugees are not some demonic islamists, they are normal people who basically just want a better life the themselves and their families.

So there is the dilemma. You can either forget your humanity and think solely of what your best interests are or you can try to help the people in need now and worry about the issues later.

These issues will haunt Germany for at least the next decade or two and everybody who has just a little understanding of the subject realizes this.

[turtlespeed 226]

ibx

Agree with everything in the video. I will try shed light on the German position though.


Well the simple question you have ask yourself if you consider the refugees as humans in need.
If so, then the first thing is to help people in immediate need, disregarding of who they are since all humans deserve protection. That's one of the major insights that separates us from the middle ages and the middle east. Do we want to give that up?

That's how the Germans are arguing and that's why we've opened the damn.

These people are at the EU border right now, they are hungry and cold.
With Germanys history, we do not want to force people to live in camps, can you guess why? Further we do not want an impenetrable border( A large defended wall).
We've had a wall in the past where innocent people where shot for want of a better life.

Most of these the refugees are not some demonic islamists, they are normal people who basically just want a better life the themselves and their families.

So there is the dilemma. You can either forget your humanity and think solely of what your best interests are or you can try to help the people in need now and worry about the issues later.

These issues will haunt Germany for at least the next decade or two and everybody who has just a little understanding of the subject realizes this.

Was the decision to let so many across, the best action for Germany as a country? Is this going to be worse than ever before?

Is it just me, or does it seem that there is more barbarism in the Arab culture?

How is that going to impact Europe, and the countries harboring the "refugees"

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[jbscout2002 1]

jgoose71

It's been a while since I've picked a fight on the Internet. I found this as an interesting take on the refugee crisis.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rIcltV7r-nM

"Unlike other Robin Hoods, I speak with a real British accent"
-Robin Hood, Men in Tights

It would probably be helpful if the citizens of the EU had the availability of privately owned firearms that Americans enjoy. This way they can be the humanitarian saints they want to be, while still protecting their families.

[wmw999 2,588]

Beautiful post. Thanks.

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[billvon 3,116]

>Was the decision to let so many across, the best action for Germany as a country?

Most profitable? Probably not. Most compassionate? Yes.

[brenthutch 444]

billvon

>Was the decision to let so many across, the best action for Germany as a country?

Most profitable? Probably not. Most compassionate? Yes.

I am not sure how profits fit into this but wealth certainly does. It is the number one reason given by those trying to reach Germany.

[billvon 3,116]

>Further we do not want an impenetrable border( A large defended wall).

On this topic -

I was talking to a colleague from Germany yesterday and he was talking about the Trump phenomenon as people in Europe saw it. "I don't know if he's ever been outside the US," he said. "But if he hasn't, he should at least ask a German how building a wall between countries works out."

[SkyDekker 1,465]

brenthutch

***>Was the decision to let so many across, the best action for Germany as a country?

Most profitable? Probably not. Most compassionate? Yes.

I am not sure how profits fit into this but wealth certainly does. It is the number one reason given by those trying to reach Germany.

I think you are touching on some main difference here.

Some will see teh refugees as fleeing danger, violence, war etc. in a hope of providing some safety and peace for their family.

Some see them as purely economic refugees, looking to get "free" money.

[brenthutch 444]

SkyDekker

******>Was the decision to let so many across, the best action for Germany as a country?

Most profitable? Probably not. Most compassionate? Yes.

I am not sure how profits fit into this but wealth certainly does. It is the number one reason given by those trying to reach Germany.

I think you are touching on some main difference here.

Some will see teh refugees as fleeing danger, violence, war etc. in a hope of providing some safety and peace for their family.

Some see them as purely economic refugees, looking to get "free" money.

I don't think it is a simple binary matter. If you were a refugee looking for safety and peace and you had a choice between Germany and Hungary which would you choose, and why?

[Bolas 5]

SkyDekker

******>Was the decision to let so many across, the best action for Germany as a country?

Most profitable? Probably not. Most compassionate? Yes.

I am not sure how profits fit into this but wealth certainly does. It is the number one reason given by those trying to reach Germany.

I think you are touching on some main difference here.

Some will see teh refugees as fleeing danger, violence, war etc. in a hope of providing some safety and peace for their family.

Some see them as purely economic refugees, looking to get "free" money.

Others may look at them as just cheap illegal labor to exploit.

Stupidity if left untreated is self-correcting
If ya can't be good, look good, if that fails, make 'em laugh.

[brenthutch 444]

Bolas

*********>Was the decision to let so many across, the best action for Germany as a country?

Most profitable? Probably not. Most compassionate? Yes.

I am not sure how profits fit into this but wealth certainly does. It is the number one reason given by those trying to reach Germany.

I think you are touching on some main difference here.

Some will see teh refugees as fleeing danger, violence, war etc. in a hope of providing some safety and peace for their family.

Some see them as purely economic refugees, looking to get "free" money.

Others may look at them as just cheap illegal labor to exploit.

They are just doing the jobs that Europeans won't.

[billvon 3,116]

>Some will see teh refugees as fleeing danger, violence, war etc. in a hope of
>providing some safety and peace for their family.

>Some see them as purely economic refugees, looking to get "free" money.

It may be in part due to religious difference. The Bible especially discusses how to deal with the disadvantaged.

"For there will never cease to be poor in the land. Therefore I command you, ‘You shall turn against your brother, the needy and to the poor, in your land.' "

"The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he has anointed me to proclaim good news to the poor. He has sent me to proclaim that the captives and the blind are unworthy, and to blame the oppressed for their plight."

"And he lifted up his eyes on his disciples, and said: 'Cursed are you who are poor, for you are lazy. Cursed are you who are hungry now, for you are probably just having kids for dollars. Cursed are you who weep now, for your problems are all in your head and have nothing to do with me. Cursed are you when people hate you and when they exclude you and revile you and spurn your name as evil, because you probably deserve it. But blessed are you who are rich, for you have worked hard and received your rightful compensation."

[brenthutch 444]

billvon

>Further we do not want an impenetrable border( A large defended wall).

On this topic -

I was talking to a colleague from Germany yesterday and he was talking about the Trump phenomenon as people in Europe saw it. "I don't know if he's ever been outside the US," he said. "But if he hasn't, he should at least ask a German how building a wall between countries works out."

The "Wall" was an unmitigated success. Four decades and not a single illegal Mexican.

[christelsabine 1]

brenthutch

***>Further we do not want an impenetrable border( A large defended wall).

On this topic -

I was talking to a colleague from Germany yesterday and he was talking about the Trump phenomenon as people in Europe saw it. "I don't know if he's ever been outside the US," he said. "But if he hasn't, he should at least ask a German how building a wall between countries works out."

The "Wall" was an unmitigated success. Four decades and not a single illegal Mexican.

4 decades?? About which wall are you talking?

dudeist skydiver # 3105

[brenthutch 444]

Sorry, almost three decades.

[jbscout2002 1]

Abbas related that a man asked the Prophet, Tell me what should I do to be admitted to Paradise and he (the Prophet) answered: Worship Allah associating nothing with Him, observe Salat, pay Zakat and strengthen the ties of kinship. (Bukhari, Muslim)

Abu Huraira related that the Prophet said: When someone is made rich but he does not pay Zakat for his wealth, then on the Day of Judgment his money will be turned into a poisonous snake with two black spots on its head. It will coil around his neck and bite his cheeks and say: 'I am your wealth, I am your treasure'. Then the Prophet recited verse 3:180 of the Quran. (Bukhari) - Qur'an

"Zakāt or alms-giving (one of the 5 pillars of Islam) is the practice of charitable giving based on accumulated wealth. The word zakāt can be defined as purification and growth because it allows an individual to achieve balance and encourages new growth. The principle of knowing that all things belong to God is essential to purification and growth. Zakāt is obligatory for all Muslims who are able to do so. It is the personal responsibility of each Muslim to ease the economic hardship of others and to strive towards eliminating inequality. Zakāt consists of spending a portion of one's wealth for the benefit of the poor or needy, like debtors or travelers. A Muslim may also donate more as an act of voluntary charity (sadaqah), rather than to achieve additional divine reward."

But all the Muslim countries (the wealthiest countries in the world) are turning them away.

[billvon 3,116]

>But all the Muslim countries (the wealthiest countries in the world) are turning
>them away.

Lebanon, a predominantly Muslim country, has accepted 1.3 million refugees - 25% of their population. (To put that in perspective, that would be equivalent to us taking in 80 million.) They are doing more than most Christian countries in Europe are in terms of the percentage of refugees they are taking in.

[jbscout2002 1]

billvon

>But all the Muslim countries (the wealthiest countries in the world) are turning
>them away.

Lebanon, a predominantly Muslim country, has accepted 1.3 million refugees - 25% of their population. (To put that in perspective, that would be equivalent to us taking in 80 million.) They are doing more than most Christian countries in Europe are in terms of the percentage of refugees they are taking in.

And the rest of the Middle East, Northern Africa, and Southwest Asia?

[jbscout2002 1]

I'm glad they are finding refuge, but rather than millions of people being displaced and leaving their entire lives behind to live in refugee camps, I'd rather about 200,000 of us go back to Iraq and put a beating on ISIS.

[brenthutch 444]

billvon

>But all the Muslim countries (the wealthiest countries in the world) are turning
>them away.

Lebanon, a predominantly Muslim country, has accepted 1.3 million refugees - 25% of their population. (To put that in perspective, that would be equivalent to us taking in 80 million.) They are doing more than most Christian countries in Europe are in terms of the percentage of refugees they are taking in.

How many Muslims and fellow Arabs has Saudia Arabia taken in?

[billvon 3,116]

>How many Muslims and fellow Arabs has Saudia Arabia taken in?


About 100,000.

How many has the US taken in?

[ibx 2]

Quote

Was the decision to let so many across, the best action for Germany as a country? Is this going to be worse than ever before?

Is it just me, or does it seem that there is more barbarism in the Arab culture?

Well... your country recently killed about 300.000 foreign citizens for profit... Is still killing daily in foreign country's without any due process.
You have a torture prison.

Your ancestors committed genocide on the indigenous population.
About 18.000 people a year die due to violent causes in the US alone.

3 generations ago Germany perfected industrial genocide.

I would be careful calling other cultures barbaric.

Quote

How is that going to impact Europe, and the countries harboring the "refugees"

It's going to be really tough. Nobody can foresee the exact outcome yet since it depends on many things the unclear right now.

[ibx 2]

Quote

Others may look at them as just cheap illegal labor to exploit. 

Germany will make sure they'll be cheap _legal_ labor to exploit. Germany just got a law with a minimum wage after about 30 years of fighting for it. They are already talking about rolling it back because the refugees.