RMK 3 #26 December 18, 2014 I was there recently; they don't stamp anyone's passports - you get an extra slip of paper. There's full checks with photos taken (even babies). Even as a Brit, we can't use any credit card that is distinctly American (no Amex, no foreign issued Citi, not even Virgin Credit Cards as they are MBNA). I found the Cuban people very friendly and welcoming. Go visit now, before they open it up to Americans Regarding the old American cars, everyone that I wrode in had had its engine replaced with a Japanese engine - so much for the made in America. "Pain is the best instructor, but no one wants to attend his classes" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ryoder 1,590 #27 December 18, 2014 RMK Regarding the old American cars, everyone that I wrode in had had its engine replaced with a Japanese engine - so much for the made in America. I saw this today: http://qz.com/315104/its-time-to-put-a-cuban-cliche-to-rest/ Sounds like only 10% of the cars are old American relics."There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkyDekker 1,465 #28 December 18, 2014 rehmwa***Well, of course they say that - they HAVE to say it, to justify (i.e., rationalize) the uncompromising ideological fervency that has guided the better part of most of their lives - otherwise, it's all been a waste. What else CAN they say, to rebut rational, objective analysis suggesting that Cubans' lives will improve, other than to steadfastly maintain that they will not? really interesting you are just ready to just blithely disregard the opinions of these people I'm not invested one way or the other here, all I know was it was a bit off putting to see how 'giddy' the national news anchors were about it this morning. I'd really would have absorbed it a bit better if the delivery and attitudes were professional and objective. Gen Powell made some good statements in an interview about it though. He thought it was ok, but we need to be very watchful and that it doesn't excuse the treatment of the people or the bad policies of the Cuba gov in any way. that seems reasonable You guys gladly do business with Saudi Arabia, spare me the hypocrisy on Cuba. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wolfriverjoe 1,523 #29 December 18, 2014 SkyDekker******Well, of course they say that - they HAVE to say it, to justify (i.e., rationalize) the uncompromising ideological fervency that has guided the better part of most of their lives - otherwise, it's all been a waste. What else CAN they say, to rebut rational, objective analysis suggesting that Cubans' lives will improve, other than to steadfastly maintain that they will not? really interesting you are just ready to just blithely disregard the opinions of these people I'm not invested one way or the other here, all I know was it was a bit off putting to see how 'giddy' the national news anchors were about it this morning. I'd really would have absorbed it a bit better if the delivery and attitudes were professional and objective. Gen Powell made some good statements in an interview about it though. He thought it was ok, but we need to be very watchful and that it doesn't excuse the treatment of the people or the bad policies of the Cuba gov in any way. that seems reasonable You guys gladly do business with Saudi Arabia, spare me the hypocrisy on Cuba. And China. Just about every consumer product sold in the US is "Made In China." I don't hear too many people bitching about their governmental policies. Search "Human Rights Abuses China" for about a bazillion hits."There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy "~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkyDekker 1,465 #30 December 18, 2014 QuoteAnd China. Agreed, it is a long list. I specifically picked Saudi since the US is pretty close with them...as in holding hands close. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #31 December 18, 2014 SkyDekker******Well, of course they say that - they HAVE to say it, to justify (i.e., rationalize) the uncompromising ideological fervency that has guided the better part of most of their lives - otherwise, it's all been a waste. What else CAN they say, to rebut rational, objective analysis suggesting that Cubans' lives will improve, other than to steadfastly maintain that they will not? really interesting you are just ready to just blithely disregard the opinions of these people I'm not invested one way or the other here, all I know was it was a bit off putting to see how 'giddy' the national news anchors were about it this morning. I'd really would have absorbed it a bit better if the delivery and attitudes were professional and objective. Gen Powell made some good statements in an interview about it though. He thought it was ok, but we need to be very watchful and that it doesn't excuse the treatment of the people or the bad policies of the Cuba gov in any way. that seems reasonable You guys gladly do business with Saudi Arabia, spare me the hypocrisy on Cuba. you'll have to explain the 'hypocrisy' statement - Doesn't this action puts Cuba on a more consistent footing with these other countries? Why do you hate Colin Powell? is it because he's black? edit: (nah, that tactic (last line up there) even is awkward, I don't know how people do it so easy) ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andy9o8 2 #32 December 18, 2014 RonD1120Also as a side note, Communist Cuba advocates torturing their prisoners. http://www.cubaverdad.net/torture_in_cuba.htm I've no doubt. But that's not really really the point; it never really was. The US embargo was imposed on Cuba as a tantrum, and - domestic politics and international hypocrisy aside - it's been maintained for the same reason a petulant child sits on the floor and refuses to budge: because his pride won't let him do otherwise. Enough of that already. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
normiss 892 #33 December 18, 2014 IF congress changes the position it has anyway. I'm expecting some push back on this. Yet China has preferred nation status. Yay for our gooberment. Idiots. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkyDekker 1,465 #34 December 18, 2014 Quoteyou'll have to explain the 'hypocrisy' statement Complaining about thawing relations, when you have very friendly relations with.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RMK 3 #35 December 18, 2014 Yes, that's correct; you will see a lot, but the old American cars are a minority. I stayed at the Hotel Parque Central Havana (which is the nicest hotel in Old Town Havana. Only after speaking with our drivers did I find that the nicest old cars that took tourists out were actually owned by the hotel and they paid the drivers. I had planned on using Skype via the hotel wifi, only to find that Skype is not allowed in Cuba. Not a great problem as the hotel wifi (though reputed to be the fasted in Cuba) was quite slow. Here's a pic below that shows a nice old vintage car, but look at the row of cars in the background. Under the bonnet (err...I mean hood) power was by Hyundai."Pain is the best instructor, but no one wants to attend his classes" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #36 December 18, 2014 SkyDekkerQuoteyou'll have to explain the 'hypocrisy' statement Complaining about thawing relations, when you have very friendly relations with.... still confusing me - I noted Colin Powell's position was reasonable and he said it was a good thing but to be wary and observant going forward and try to use the opportunity for positive change (or something to that effect). isn't that the opposite of complaining about it? Or am I misreading just who you include when you write things like "You guys"? This might be something of the sort... http://www.cbsnews.com/news/cuba-us-relations-colin-powell-backs-obama-on-diplomatic-changes/ ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkyDekker 1,465 #37 December 18, 2014 rehmwa***Quoteyou'll have to explain the 'hypocrisy' statement Complaining about thawing relations, when you have very friendly relations with.... still confusing me - I noted Colin Powell's position was reasonable and he said it was a good thing. isn't that the opposite of complaining about it? Or am I misreading just who you include when you write things like "You guys"? This might be something of the sort... http://www.cbsnews.com/news/cuba-us-relations-colin-powell-backs-obama-on-diplomatic-changes/ here: Quotebut we need to be very watchful and that it doesn't excuse the treatment of the people or the bad policies of the Cuba gov in any way. Why would thawing the relationship with Cuba indicate that when you have strong relationships with the likes of China and Saudi Arabia? Do those strong relationships indicate you approve of their treatment of their people and their type of government? No, then why is it a concern with regards to Cuba? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
RonD1120 62 #38 December 18, 2014 You should make that point clear to BHO, Cuba not withstanding.Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ryoder 1,590 #39 December 18, 2014 So Cuba has a few of our most-wanted; Interesting wrinkle. http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2014/12/18/what-s-next-for-the-cop-killers-hiding-in-havana.html"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #40 December 18, 2014 SkyDekkerWhy would thawing the relationship with Cuba indicate that when you have strong relationships with the likes of China and Saudi Arabia? Do those strong relationships indicate you approve of their treatment of their people and their type of government? No, then why is it a concern with regards to Cuba? I think you are reaching for something that's not there. thanks for trying to clarify. ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkyDekker 1,465 #41 December 18, 2014 rehmwa***Why would thawing the relationship with Cuba indicate that when you have strong relationships with the likes of China and Saudi Arabia? Do those strong relationships indicate you approve of their treatment of their people and their type of government? No, then why is it a concern with regards to Cuba? I think you are reaching for something that's not there. thanks for trying to clarify. Actually I was hoping to get actual answers to the questions, since you appear to agree with Mr. Powell. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #42 December 18, 2014 SkyDekker******Why would thawing the relationship with Cuba indicate that when you have strong relationships with the likes of China and Saudi Arabia? Do those strong relationships indicate you approve of their treatment of their people and their type of government? No, then why is it a concern with regards to Cuba? I think you are reaching for something that's not there. thanks for trying to clarify. Actually I was hoping to get actual answers to the questions, since you appear to agree with Mr. Powell. oh...I don't really have a dog in the fight. I suspect having diplomatic relations with all these countries needs to done with an eye to their goals, laws, treatment of their citizens, etc etc. so being consistent is fine with me. But to me, it's a lot like your girlfriends shouting "Be safe" when you go load the airplane. It's kind of a 'no kidding' feel good thing but for public statements, it seems it needs to said. ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 2,146 #43 December 20, 2014 rehmwa Why do you hate Colin Powell? is it because he's black? Is that Colin "Cover up the My Lai Massacre" Powell or Colin "See the Mobile Biological Weapons Laboratories" Powell? Either way, his color has little to do with his credibility.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
